Is Judas in Hell? Are we certain of this?

graysparrow · Nov 17, 2005

Of what there is no way to know is better to remain silent

Bushido216 · Nov 17, 2005

WarriorAngel said:
Praying in the Garden resulted in strengthening Himself for His mission.

Releasing His human fears and talking to His Father...and having Angels help Him.

I don't see that, at all. Christ asked to be relieved of the burden. If He had perfect foreknowledge, then He'd have known a.) God's answer and b.) that He would have the strength to do it, as he would.

If you know for certain (hypothetically) that something will happen, then the probability of that event (as we calculate it) is 1 (or 100% for those of us lucky enough to be able to eschew statistics).

WarriorAngel · Nov 17, 2005

Bushido216 said:
I don't see that, at all. Christ asked to be relieved of the burden. If He had perfect foreknowledge, then He'd have known a.) God's answer and b.) that He would have the strength to do it, as he would.

If you know for certain (hypothetically) that something will happen, then the probability of that event (as we calculate it) is 1 (or 100% for those of us lucky enough to be able to eschew statistics).

He prophecied His death a few times.

He knew His whole life that He came to earth for ONE mission. To preach, teach, change the law, perfect the Law of the Prophets, and to take on our sins thru His death.

However; still knowing this, He was also human, and altho being human He was still God with a free choice to 'forget the whole mission' and let mankind never be forgiven of their sins.
YET He did not, and the Angels administered to Him.

WE cannot 'explain' the Trinity, but becoming a human He lowered Himself lower than angels to do as He set out to do.
He needed the divine strength of the Father to ensure His human weakness did not falter to the task He knew was set upon Him...

AS He urged His apostles to pray that night.
AS He told Judas to go out and do what he was about to do.

Christ said 'IF the cup could pass...{Scrap the whole ordeal} but let the Will of the Father be done.'

And His ability to know the future is all over scripture, so it is not a matter of 'IF'.

ShannonMcCatholic · Nov 17, 2005

nyj said:
Yet another reason we should not prevent the children from going to Him. You never know when you'll need one of them to help you!

If I had to define "time" I'd probably define it as "a grace of God". For with time, old wounds heal, and those who we may not be able to forgive at the moment of the unjust deed, can be forgiven, given enough time.

I was just kind of thinking about that-- because might't Judas be saved by the merits of our prayers and sacrificeds now--- since God is outside of time???

Bushido216 · Nov 17, 2005

WarriorAngel, I see what you're saying. But it still seems contradictory. If Christ is asking to be relieved of His burden, then doesn't He not know that He'll be doing it anyway?

nyj · Nov 17, 2005

ShannonMcCatholic said:
I was just kind of thinking about that-- because might't Judas be saved by the merits of our prayers and sacrificeds now--- since God is outside of time???

It never hurts to try.

ShannonMcCatholic · Nov 17, 2005

nyj said:
It never hurts to try.

yes-- I think that is a good way to pray and live...

WarriorAngel · Nov 17, 2005

Bushido216 said:
WarriorAngel, I see what you're saying. But it still seems contradictory. If Christ is asking to be relieved of His burden, then doesn't He not know that He'll be doing it anyway?

The same argument is given about 'the Last Day' where only the Father knows.
AS long as Christ was living on earth, His humanity did not perceive the fullness of His Divine knowledge.

IE, the veil was in place while He lived. Once He 'fully accepted' His death, as agreed in the beginning, He would die and have His full divine knowledge again.

While living He knew hearts and He knew His future. Read scripture where He spoke of His death at least three times. He predicted His passion, and He predicted Peter's betrayal, and He predicted Judas leaving the Last Supper, and He prayed over His Death which would be upon Him that NIGHT.

There is NO question of Him knowing. You ask about His 'knowing' He would do it anyway.

He knew that 'everything' prophecied would be fulfilled, and He also knew He had a free will as God to let this cup pass...and then if He did that, then humanity would probably have ceased to exist.
AND God has that right.

Why would humanity cease to exist? Because we would have no knowledge of God's rescinding His Promise...

HOWEVER; this is against God's nature, so He took the Free Will He is entitled to, and used it for our benefit.

Because God, unlike man, keeps His every Promise.

And so....the very fact He did as He said He would means we should be more the thankful. For the Lord does not need us...but He loves us, and that is the ONE reason He carried out the Promise.

One other option would have been to do it another way, at a later time, and no one would have been the wiser...but if we look at it, the 3rd year of His mission, He was 33, and He started His mission at 30...{ALL symbolic of the trinity, the numbers 3}

Jesus could have just 'left us' and not fulfilled His Promise, which He did not, because He is perfect....
The humanity He struggled with in fear, but not sin.

The end result...we sit her pondering IF He could have...and yet He did.

It really would blow the mind to think if He decided we were not worth it. An option God always has.............and a humbling concept indeed.

HolyGuardianAngels · Nov 26, 2005

Holly3278 said:
Hi everyone. Does the Church teach that Judas is in Hell or is there a possibility that he in fact went to purgatory and is possibly still there or maybe even in Heaven by now? Could he have repented and gone to Heaven?

I hate consigning ANYONE to Hell...

It is such a horrific place... beyond our wildest imagination is terribleness!!
I like to think of Our Lords' last conversation with Judas Iscariot:

Judas: Peace Rabbi

Our Lord: Friend, do what you are here for.

Jesus, still offered Judas friendship.

However, Sacred Scripture does use the word BETRAYED... which I feel implyes that there could have been another way for all the "final" events to have occured. (Kinda like, what would have happen if Eve had not sinned??)

I just find it VERY hard to believe anyone will REALLY end up being TORMENTED FOREVER!! ~ I mean Hell is worse than utter poverty, -when everybody else is rich; worse than the most painful infirmity, -when everybody else is fine, worse than being the only POW in a great war when no one else has been captured... ~ This is where my mind takes me, when I think of GODs' WRATH and ETERNAL PUNISHMENT... Does anybody ever take the time to think... that he or she, may be the ONLY one there... For only God knows the heart!!

From: The Novena to The Divine Mercy

Today bring to Me All Mankind, Especially All Sinners, and immerse them in the ocean of My mercy. In this way you will console Me in the Bitter grief into which the loss of souls plunges Me. ~ Most Merciful Jesus... Receive us all into the abode of Your Most Compassionate Heart, and NEVER let us escape from it. We beg this...

God Bless

Is Judas in Hell? Are we certain of this?

graysparrow

My life is for the kids who have it rough

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Bushido216

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WarriorAngel

I close my eyes and see you smile

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ShannonMcCatholic

I swallowed a bug

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Bushido216

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nyj

Goodbye, my puppy

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ShannonMcCatholic

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WarriorAngel

I close my eyes and see you smile

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HolyGuardianAngels

Merry Christmas Everyone

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