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Is Fred Phelps really "horrible"?...

Is Fred Phelps really "horrible"?...

  • No. He might be a little off, but not horrible.

  • Yes.

  • I'm not sure...

  • I think he's a Christian that has become fleshly...


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ShieldOFaith

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Many have heard of Pastor Fred Phelps. Most of what they have read or seen is/has been distorted by the liberal media of course. However, let's ask the question:

Q. Is Fred Phelps really "horrible"?

NOTE: I am not 100% supporting Pastor Phelps here!!!

I am asking for Christians to open up their minds to something they may have not seen or heard of in a long while. Someone who has a message of DOOM! Hasn't crossed your mind in a while, huh?

I say Christians, because I know that the unsaved will not have a clue of what I speak. They will instantly label me a 'Fred Phelps supporter'. However, that is not what I am.

I am simply saying that maybe, just maybe; GOD has a message for America??...hummmm...??

Read:

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]5 Now when King David came to Bahurim, there was a man from the family of the house of Saul, whose name was Shimei the son of Gera, coming from there. He came out, cursing continuously as he came. 6 And he threw stones at David and at all the servants of King David. And all the people and all the mighty men were on his right hand and on his left. 7 Also Shimei said thus when he cursed: "Come out! Come out! You bloodthirsty man, you rogue! 8 The Lord has brought upon you all the blood of the house of Saul, in whose place you have reigned; and the Lord has delivered the kingdom into the hand of Absalom your son. So now you are caught in your own evil, because you are a bloodthirsty man!" 9 Then Abishai the son of Zeruiah said to the king, "Why should this dead dog curse my lord the king? Please, let me go over and take off his head!" 10 But the king said, "What have I to do with you, you sons of Zeruiah? So let him curse, because the Lord has said to him, 'Curse David.' Who then shall say, 'Why have you done so?' " 11 And David said to Abishai and all his servants, "See how my son who came from my own body seeks my life. How much more now may this Benjamite? Let him alone, and let him curse; for so the Lord has ordered him. 12 It may be that the Lord will look on my affliction, and that the Lord will repay me with good for his cursing this day." 13 And as David and his men went along the road, Shimei went along the hillside opposite him and cursed as he went, threw stones at him and kicked up dust. --2 Sam 16[/FONT]

READ:

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica] 1 The vision of Isaiah the son of Amoz, which he saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem in the days of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz, and Hezekiah, kings of Judah. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica] 2 Hear, O heavens, and give ear, O earth! For the Lord has spoken: " I have nourished and brought up children, And they have rebelled against Me; 3 The ox knows its owner And the donkey its master's crib; But Israel does not know, My people do not consider." 4 Alas, sinful nation, A people laden with iniquity, A brood of evildoers, Children who are corrupters! They have forsaken the Lord, They have provoked to anger The Holy One of Israel, They have turned away backward. 5 Why should you be stricken again? You will revolt more and more. The whole head is sick, And the whole heart faints. 6 From the sole of the foot even to the head, There is no soundness in it, But wounds and bruises and putrefying sores; They have not been closed or bound up, Or soothed with ointment. 7 Your country is desolate, Your cities are burned with fire; Strangers devour your land in your presence; And it is desolate, as overthrown by strangers. 8 So the daughter of Zion is left as a booth in a vineyard, As a hut in a garden of cucumbers, As a besieged city. 9 Unless the Lord of hosts Had left to us a very small remnant, We would have become like Sodom, We would have been made like Gomorrah. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica] 10 Hear the word of the Lord, You rulers of Sodom; Give ear to the law of our God, You people of Gomorrah: 11 "To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices to Me?" Says the Lord. "I have had enough of burnt offerings of rams And the fat of fed cattle. I do not delight in the blood of bulls, Or of lambs or goats. 12 "When you come to appear before Me, Who has required this from your hand, To trample My courts? 13 Bring no more futile sacrifices; Incense is an abomination to Me. The New Moons, the Sabbaths, and the calling of assemblies-- I cannot endure iniquity and the sacred meeting. 14 Your New Moons and your appointed feasts My soul hates; They are a trouble to Me, I am weary of bearing them. 15 When you spread out your hands, I will hide My eyes from you; Even though you make many prayers, I will not hear. Your hands are full of blood. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica] 16 "Wash yourselves, make yourselves clean; Put away the evil of your doings from before My eyes. Cease to do evil, 17 Learn to do good; Seek justice, Rebuke the oppressor; F1 Defend the fatherless, Plead for the widow. 18 "Come now, and let us reason together," Says the Lord, "Though your sins are like scarlet, They shall be as white as snow; Though they are red like crimson, They shall be as wool. 19 If you are willing and obedient, You shall eat the good of the land; 20 But if you refuse and rebel, You shall be devoured by the sword"; For the mouth of the Lord has spoken. --Isaiah 1[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Maybe, just maybe, there is some truth to what Pastor Fred Phelps is saying??...[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Maybe not the hating of homosexuals, with the slur word attached to it; but maybe the condemnation of the U.S. and its sins? Hello?[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Could it be that he has the right message; but he has gone a little overboard? In other words, maybe he has the right message for the U.S. but has wrapped the message up with a little bit of his own fleshly nature? And maybe all we see from the media standpoint is the fleshly nature of his methods, and not the clear rebuke of America and her sins?[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Christian brothers and sisters, all I am asking is that we don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. Maybe Pastor Phelps is a Shimei??[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]***NOTE: Once again, I do not support Pastor Fred Phelps 100%, and I do not condone protesting military funerals. Nor do I condone the use of signs that say,[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Maybe Christian brothers and sisters, if you were hounded by the left-wing media day and night, and attacked constantly by homosexual and other groups; maybe you'd get a little fleshly natured too? Just a thought there.
[/FONT]
 
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brightmorningstar

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Ah but the lessons of Sodom, Numbers and the OT about God's reaction to sexual immorality are disputed by those who support same sex unions.
I dont know much about Fred Phelps etc that some of his church's actions are insensitive and that the slogan God hates [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth] is used.
This is as fundamentally an un-Christian view as the pro-same sex union argument.
Even as the snake was raised in the desert God so loved the world so as to send His only Son so that whoever believes shall be saved.
What God has shown is past tense, what God will do is future tense. God has shown His love for all through Christ so through Christ all who believe will be saved from what He hates. So God cant hate anyone who He loved enough to provide salvation for until the time of judgement, which is up to Jesus Christ.

Now on top of the fundamental flawed unChristian view of same sex unions, I note that those who support it, talk about interpretation of scripture, which it isnt, and then seem unable to accept Fred Phelp's so called interpretation of scripture.

So those who propose same sex unions are scripturally just as bad and dont even practrice what they preach about interpretation.
 
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PantsMcFist

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Yes, he is horrible. No way around that. Someone here already came up with the idea of protesting his funeral when he dies. I am going to be there holding the biggest sign of them all.

If I thought it would change anyone's mind, or do some good, I would be right beside you.
 
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Tinker Grey

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You have to wonder what Phelps thinks he is accomplishing. Are gays getting saved thru his actions? I doubt it. Are straights getting saved thrus his actions? I doubt it. Is he getting rich off of those that agree with him? If he is, he isn't spending it. From what I've read, he lives modestly and drives modest cars.

His actions seem to be an effort release his own demons. I'm not suggesting he is necessarily gay ... just that gays happen to be the target of his venting.

*shrug*
 
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Polycarp_fan

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I am as shocked as anyone to agree completely with PCF.

You quote the nutball Freddy Neetch twice in signature lines?

He's more like Phelps in the mental health department.

I'd appreciate it if you don't mention "PCF" in your post responses.

Associating with people that associate with Neechy works, is nothing I want on my resume.

Oil and water in the reason and logic department sir. And I don't care which fluid you ascribe to me. Both are good for a Christian.

You could go back and edit your post to say something like this:

"I agree that Christians should be concerned with other Christians if they are going to preach New Testament moral and ethical behavior. There is no cause or justifiable position from NT scripture to promote gay sex. And leave, to the practicing Judaism believer (Torah-observant Jews) what is there concepts of right and wrong. To the pagans, infidels (dot-orgers)and others, let them do as they wilteth."

Nietzsche in a signature? Oh yeah, the prophet of the usual suspects. The rise of humanism and it's legions of adherants and proponents.

He died a psychotic drooling on himself babbling about whatever.

Bit cliche and oh-so typical Christian bash action pal.

You need to implement Dawkins or Hitchens for more relevant insultificationary reasons.


(I claim neologism rights to insultificationary.)

(It's all in fun!!!)
 
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selfinflikted

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You have to wonder what Phelps thinks he is accomplishing. Are gays getting saved thru his actions? I doubt it. Are straights getting saved thrus his actions? I doubt it. Is he getting rich off of those that agree with him? If he is, he isn't spending it. From what I've read, he lives modestly and drives modest cars.

His actions seem to be an effort release his own demons. I'm not suggesting he is necessarily gay ... just that gays happen to be the target of his venting.

*shrug*

From what I've read, most of their money goes towards the protests. It takes a lot of money to travel around the country/world to protest. Also, from what I've read, all the church members are family. Heh.
 
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Polycarp_fan

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You have to wonder what Phelps thinks he is accomplishing. Are gays getting saved thru his actions? I doubt it.

Did they ever want to be saved? Phelps' actions can be proven to be as incompatible with Apostolic truth as gay culture. But I see no need for the screaming and ranting from either side.


Are straights getting saved thrus his actions? I doubt it. Is he getting rich off of those that agree with him? If he is, he isn't spending it. From what I've read, he lives modestly and drives modest cars.

Hmmm, sounds like an honest man.

His actions seem to be an effort release his own demons. I'm not suggesting he is necessarily gay ... just that gays happen to be the target of his venting.

Uh, you guys gotta let go of the self-loathing gay guy position. A repentant sinner is a good example of Christian reality and truth.

Phelps shows little of both in his actions and behaviors towards non-believers AND, AND, those that ARE Christians, that he and his pals are screaming at.

I would need to repent for my actions towards this dude if I ever encountered him screaming at the funeral of a friend or soldier.
 
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cantata

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He died a psychotic drooling on himself babbling about whatever.

Personally I consider this fact to be very sad, rather than a reason to damn or laugh at either Nietzsche, or the people who admire the works he produced during healthier times.
 
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PantsMcFist

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A persons heroes says a lot about them.

A lot.

Are you aware that in The Will to Power, Nietzsche praised Christ and the early church? He believed that Paul ruined the concept with the institutionalization of faith.
 
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cantata

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A persons heroes says a lot about them.

A lot.

Okay. But - forgive me for being dense - how do the piteous circumstances of Nietzsche's old age have any bearing on his quality as a hero?
 
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Tinker Grey

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Did they ever want to be saved?
Well, I would think that at least those Christians who claim to be ex-gays would have "wanted to be saved".

But, of course, the point is that if it is possible for gays to want to be saved, they wouldn't after hearing Phelps.

Phelps' actions can be proven to be as incompatible with Apostolic truth as gay culture. But I see no need for the screaming and ranting from either side.
Agreed.
Hmmm, sounds like an honest man.
I think it is quite possible to be both honest and disturbed.

Uh, you guys gotta let go of the self-loathing gay guy position.
Uh. You need to go back and read what I wrote. I was specifically noting that I think he is disturbed and that I don't think that he is necessarily gay.

All that hatred and vitriol is indicative of a disturbed mind, whatever the cause.

Phelps shows little of both in his actions and behaviors towards non-believers AND, AND, those that ARE Christians, that he and his pals are screaming at.
Agreed.
I would need to repent for my actions towards this dude if I ever encountered him screaming at the funeral of a friend or soldier.
Agreed.
 
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ShieldOFaith

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America is NOT the kingdom of Israel, and Americans are NOT Israelites.

It would be like a devout Israelite cursing out the Babylonian citizenry.

Phelps is wrong in what he is doing.

GOD judges nations. The U.S. is no exception.

Phelps has some correct things that he is saying. Not everything that he says is whack!
 
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PreachersWife2004

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Yes, he is horrible. No way around that. Someone here already came up with the idea of protesting his funeral when he dies. I am going to be there holding the biggest sign of them all.

Why stoop to his level? If everyone IGNORED this guy's funeral (when it happens), that would make a much bigger statement.
 
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