If The Book of Mormon is false then why does the Bible make reference to it?

skylark1 said:

Perhaps I misunderstood you. Weren't you claiming that one of the two stickes was a reference to the BoM?

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pyro457 said:

Has anyone taked about this verse yet? It says that there would be "a book that is sealed." The Bible never refers to itself as a book, so it cant be talking about itself (also when was the Bible sealed?). But the Book of Mormon was a sealed book. Infact when Joseph Smith translated it 2/3 of it remained sealed and he was not permited to translated that section, (for reasons known only by God). The Book of Mormon was also a book from a destroyed civilization. These verses seem to talk about a time of aptosasy when the "book that is sealed" would come and it says that in that time many men would "draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me" It says that they are taught by the traditions of men, by their precepts.

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http://www.equip.org/free/DM197.htm



ISAIAH 29:11-12

Mormonism teaches this passage was fulfilled when Joseph Smith received the ‘Gold Plates’ and Martin Harris took a copy of some of the ‘caractors’ to Professor Anthon. A portion of this event is recorded in the Pearl of Great Price, JS 2:63-65.



These events do not fit Isaiah 29:11-12 because the text shows



1) this is a parable and the subject is a vision and not a book,

2) the vision of the prophets of that day had become as meaningless to the people as the words of a book that was sealed. Isaiah was referring to the condition of the people at that time and not a book of some ‘future time,’

3)according to Harris, the professor said the translation was correct. Anthon could have said this only if he read it. But Isaiah said the learned man could not read the book because it was sealed! The only way the professor knew the plates were ‘sealed’ was because Harris, “Told him they were.”



In our passage of Scripture, in Isaiah, the Book went to the learned man first–then to the unlearned. But the Mormon story has the book of gold delivered first to the “unlearned” Smith who copied some of the ‘caractors’ of his translation on a piece of paper which was taken to the “learned” Anthon. In Isaiah the same sealed book was taken to both the learned man and the unlearned man. But Anthon did not receive any book–sealed or unsealed, and in Isaiah the book was delivered to the unlearned and he simply said, “I am not learned,” and he made no effort to read or translate it. But Smith claimed he (Smith) did read the book, even though unlearned.



The Mormon Apostle LeGrand Richards said, “Professor Anthon did not realize that he was literally fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah.” (op. cit., p.50) But the professor didn’t believe he was fulfilling Mormon prophecy, because in a letter to E.D. Howe, a Painsville, Ohio newspaper editor, he (Anthon) relates the events as a hoax and a scheme to ‘cheat’ the farmer (Harris) out of money. Instead of fulfilling prophecy he (Anthon) became somewhat of a prophet himself, in that Harris actually did lose money.



Let no one tell you what a passage or portion of Scripture says without checking it yourself with what the Holy Spirit says to your heart. And when you do read a Scripture, read all of the passage in context. Remember – “A text taken from its context, becomes a pretext.”

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pyro457 said:

In Ezekiel 37:15-17, Ezekiel prophesied about the joining of two "sticks" from different parts of the House Israel, one from the tribe of Judah and one from the tribe of Ephraim (from Joseph). These "sticks" refer to two volumes of scripture. The Hebrew word used in Ezekiel 37 is not the usual word for stick, but is "etz", which means a wooden tablet. Wooden tablets, based on modern archaeological data, were used as a writing tablet on which a layer of wax was coated for writing with a stylus. These tablets appear to have been a major medium of writing in the ancient world, though few survived because wood rots. The tablets were like pages of a book that could be bound together to make a book. Based on the Hebrew and based on what we now know about the use of "etz" as a writing medium, Ezek. 37:15-17 makes sense as a prophecy of two volumes of scripture that would be united in the last days. These volumes are the Bible (from the tribe of Judah) and the Book of Mormon (from the tribe of Joseph, for the founders of the Nephite people who came out of Jerusalem were descendants of Joseph). Now I know there are probally other translations of this verse (there always are) but this one makes a lot of sense and includes historical data to back it up.

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Isaiah 29:10-14, 18-19, 24, contains several references to The Book of Mormon.This chapter talks of a time of apostasy when prophecy would cease (v. 10, also v. 13), followed by a revelation containing a "vision of all" that would be in "a book that is sealed." Several details in verses 11 and 12 correlate well with the history of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon (with Prof. Charles Anthon as the learned man and Joseph Smith as the unlearned man). I see the book being involved in the process of restoration, the "marvelous work and a wonder" (vs. 13 and 14)

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, for "the words of the book" would bring truth to the ears and eyes of those who had been deaf and blind (spiritually) (v.18, see also v.24). This book from a lost and destroyed civilization would "whisper out of the dust" (v. 4) to future generations. To me this says that The Book of Mormon and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was known by Isaiah.

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In Isaiah 2:2-5 it says that "And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it." (v.2)(KJV). These verses say that after a time of apostasy the Church would be restored "in the top fo the mountains", I recently found out that Utah, taken from the Ute indian tribe, means high "place/mountain tops" this fits quite well in with verse 2. almost ironicly well. And Utahs name was not given by LDS members, it was given by non LDS members.

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Also in John 10:16 "And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd." Chist is reffering to "other sheep" that would hear His voice and join Him. And He is not reffering to the gentiles, for they (the gentiles) would not hear from Christ directly but from His servents. For Christ was "sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Matt. 15:24

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pyro457 said:

If the Book of Mormon is false, as so many claim it to be, then why does the Bible make reference to another book of scripture which can be resonably judged to be The Book of Mormon?
The Scriptures I am talking about are Ezekiel 37:15-17, Isaiah 29:10-14, 18-19, 24, Isaiah 2:2-5, and John 10:16.

In Ezekiel 37:15-17, Ezekiel prophesied about the joining of two "sticks" from different parts of the House Israel, one from the tribe of Judah and one from the tribe of Ephraim (from Joseph). These "sticks" refer to two volumes of scripture. The Hebrew word used in Ezekiel 37 is not the usual word for stick, but is "etz", which means a wooden tablet. Wooden tablets, based on modern archaeological data, were used as a writing tablet on which a layer of wax was coated for writing with a stylus. These tablets appear to have been a major medium of writing in the ancient world, though few survived because wood rots. The tablets were like pages of a book that could be bound together to make a book. Based on the Hebrew and based on what we now know about the use of "etz" as a writing medium, Ezek. 37:15-17 makes sense as a prophecy of two volumes of scripture that would be united in the last days. These volumes are the Bible (from the tribe of Judah) and the Book of Mormon (from the tribe of Joseph, for the founders of the Nephite people who came out of Jerusalem were descendants of Joseph). Now I know there are probally other translations of this verse (there always are) but this one makes a lot of sense and includes historical data to back it up.

Isaiah 29:10-14, 18-19, 24, contains several references to The Book of Mormon.This chapter talks of a time of apostasy when prophecy would cease (v. 10, also v. 13), followed by a revelation containing a "vision of all" that would be in "a book that is sealed." Several details in verses 11 and 12 correlate well with the history of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon (with Prof. Charles Anthon as the learned man and Joseph Smith as the unlearned man). I see the book being involved in the process of restoration, the "marvelous work and a wonder" (vs. 13 and 14), for "the words of the book" would bring truth to the ears and eyes of those who had been deaf and blind (spiritually) (v.18, see also v.24). This book from a lost and destroyed civilization would "whisper out of the dust" (v. 4) to future generations. To me this says that The Book of Mormon and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was known by Isaiah.

In Isaiah 2:2-5 it says that "And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it." (v.2)(KJV). These verses say that after a time of apostasy the Church would be restored "in the top fo the mountains", I recently found out that Utah, taken from the Ute indian tribe, means high "place/mountain tops" this fits quite well in with verse 2. almost ironicly well. And Utahs name was not given by LDS members, it was given by non LDS members.

Also in John 10:16 "And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd." Chist is reffering to "other sheep" that would hear His voice and join Him. And He is not reffering to the gentiles, for they (the gentiles) would not hear from Christ directly but from His servents. For Christ was "sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Matt. 15:24

(all of these scriptures were taken from the KJV of the Bible)

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