If Only I Was a Catholic...

[Caedmon]

I know this sounds bizarre coming from me, but let me explain.

My main reason for saying this is that I admire the Catholic family structure and function. I believe sex has an immutable, natural, two-fold design of procreation/intimacy. I don't believe in artificial birth control. I want to have a very large family with numerous children. I want a Catholic wife. Let's be honest, these women are incredible. They're more likely to abhor birth control, more likely to honestly, openly welcome droves of children, and a good number have the amazing ability of tolerating natural child birth. These women are absolutely incredible!

Unfortunately, even though I love so many things about the Catholic church related to family, I cannot make myself convert with a clear conscience. I just simply cannot do it! And don't dare think I haven't tried either. There are things that I just plain cannot accept.(I am firmly convinced of Reformed thought)

It would be so much easier to hold my views on family that I do if I was a Catholic. I would be so much stronger and so much more organized if I was. I would have a "reason" to believe as I do.(in most Protestant circles, I am an outcast in this area for my beliefs) It really breaks my heart sometimes. I guess I don't really know what kind of response I'm seeking... I just needed to share my heart with you guys. Please talk to me. I don't care if you don't have an "answer" for me, just please... have compassion on me, just a thought, or an encouragement, or a prayer maybe. I feel stretched pretty thin right now.

 

[Stormy]

Humblejoe: I pray that you find and marry the right girl for you.

You are going to be a great Dad!!!

 

[nyj]

Originally posted by humblejoe
And don't dare think I haven't tried either. There are things that I just plain cannot accept.(I am firmly convinced of Reformed thought)

 

Humblejoe,

You are aware that much of Luther's and Calvin's thoughts were based on St. Augustine right?  Augustine's teachings are accepted by the Catholic Church as orthodox, it's just that the Catholic Church feels that people like Luther and Calvin went a bit too far relying on the words of a single man (isn't this ironic coming from a Catholic? *grin*).

 

At any rate, I'll pray for you and the ease of mind and soul that you are seeking.

 

[VOW]

To Joe:

My best advice for you is to study. Take the deepest questions you have about the Catholic Church, and study WHY She teaches these things.

(and see if the parish nearest to you offers get-togethers for Catholic singles.... )

May the Light of the Lord illuminate your path.



Peace be with you,
~VOW

 

[patriarch]

Humblejoe,

Grace and peace!

Certainly there is no one instructed in the faith who would even *want* you to make yourself convert.  What kind of conversion would  *that* be?

Faith is a gift, a gift from God.  Of course, since we are Catholics we believe in things which you do not, and will pray that God open the eyes of your mind about them.  That's probably as much as we can do for you, other than answer your questions, but on the other hand it is not nothing.

If you are sincerely seeking the truth, God Himself will lead you in the right way. Never doubt it!  "Ask and you shall receive, seek and you shall find, knock and the door shall be opened unto you." How can you step over the threshold of a door that has not been opened to you?

As for the suffering you are undergoing because of being suspended between two worlds, as it were, embrace it!  It is your cross.  "A troubled mind and a contrite heart are a sacrifice to you O Lord."  I will tell you something a confessor told me the other day about similar suffering- "It is your chariot to Heaven!"

It's wonderful that you have seen the beauty of Catholic family life as it should be lived (and often is not).  Did you try to see it, or is it a gift from God?

In the meantime, you are a bridge between two worlds.  Would it not be wonderful for the unity of the Church if through your prayers and apostolate your fellow Calvinists came to see marriage as you see it? And I have not the slightest doubt that there are elements of the faith that are lived our more vibrantly among the reformed than among Catholics.  Pray for us, too! 

"Nor should we forget that anything wrought by the grace of the Holy Spirit in the hearts of our separated brethren can contribute to our own sanctification.  Whatever is truly Christian is never contraryt to what genuinely belongs to the faith; indeed, it can always bring a more perfect realization  of the very mystery of Christ and the Church"-from the decree on Ecumenism.

It's in the very nature of a bridge to be stretched  between one bank and another, and perhaps to feel trampled upon by traffic from both directions.

Peace to you and yours, and may you find everything your heart desires- and more...

Lee

 

 

[pax]

My only advice would be don't convert unless you really believe Catholicism is the truth, although in your post you pretty much made it clear that you wouldn't convert unless you did. My best advice is to read up on those things you agree with (like the Catholic views on family). Also, you may want to consider trying to understand what exactly the Catholic Church teaches in some areas, why it teaches it, and what the basis for the teaching is. http://www.catholic.com has some good articles. I'll pray for you...

Pax Vobiscum

 

[Caedmon]

More melodrama from the hj, eh? :o

Well, as it stands, I do not "desire" to convert. I am quite content and satisfied in my Reformed faith. But as I said before, I am a champion of the family as God established it from the beginning. I guess I'm not really asking you to convert me, that wouldn't work. No, I am solid in my beliefs. I guess I just desperately needed somebody to comfort me. I am harshly torn and bitterly trampled at times. It hurts so bad sometimes, but I know that I KNOW I'm following God's design for marriage. I'm searching so hard. Trust me, I don't believe in doing things half---ed. It's all or nothing for my precious family, God be praised!

 

[Caedmon]

Originally posted by Stormy
Humblejoe: I pray that you find and marry the right girl for you.

You are going to be a great Dad!!!

Awww, thanks Stormy!

 

[Caedmon]

Originally posted by nyj
 

Humblejoe,

You are aware that much of Luther's and Calvin's thoughts were based on St. Augustine right?  Augustine's teachings are accepted by the Catholic Church as orthodox, it's just that the Catholic Church feels that people like Luther and Calvin went a bit too far relying on the words of a single man (isn't this ironic coming from a Catholic? *grin*).

 

At any rate, I'll pray for you and the ease of mind and soul that you are seeking.

Yes, I knew about Augustine. Augustine's an incredible story, and a definite bridge-man. I know we're not supposed to put a lot of stock in "feelings", but I definitely "sense" a path close to Catholics in my destiny... message from God? I dunno, it's just a feeling. I'll find out eventually.

/me turbos his supercharged Nova into the setting sun.

Disclaimer:
/me does not ACTUALLY own a "supercharged Nova".

 

[Caedmon]

Originally posted by VOW
To Joe:

My best advice for you is to study. Take the deepest questions you have about the Catholic Church, and study WHY She teaches these things.

Yes, I know VOW. I've done some studying in the past. And if I were to marry a precious Catholic lady, I would REALLY get to study.

(and see if the parish nearest to you offers get-togethers for Catholic singles.... )

LOL! Goodness VOW! You don't think they'd be afraid of me, do you?

"Hi, my name is hj, and I'm a Calvinist. Would any of you ladies care to marry me?"

LOL!

May the Light of the Lord illuminate your path.



Peace be with you,
~VOW

Thanks VOW.

 

[isshinwhat]

I think Patriarch put it beautifully.

Reformations within various churches are done by people who are willing to stick to their guns. Look at the effect St. Francis had on the Church. Almost 800 years and we still honor his memory for the simplicity and love he brought to our eyes. You can have the same effect on your community, at the very least. Let's face it, there are a lot of people who won't even touch anything they view as "Cath-lick" with a ten-foot pole. But coming from you, humblejoe, some will be more wiling to listen to the revealed truth of God's plan for families. Truth is truth, regardless of who bears it. Notice, though, one bears truth. It is a burden. If we are to be beacon's on a hill, then there must be a lot of darkness for us to bring light to, and there will be resistance to it. Remain firm, and God will provide. Remember it is His work you are doing, and He will accomplish it!

Let all Creation sing His praises!

Neal

 

[Caedmon]

Originally posted by patriarch
Humblejoe,

Grace and peace!

Certainly there is no one instructed in the faith who would even *want* you to make yourself convert.  What kind of conversion would  *that* be?

Faith is a gift, a gift from God.  Of course, since we are Catholics we believe in things which you do not, and will pray that God open the eyes of your mind about them.  That's probably as much as we can do for you, other than answer your questions, but on the other hand it is not nothing.

If you are sincerely seeking the truth, God Himself will lead you in the right way. Never doubt it!  "Ask and you shall receive, seek and you shall find, knock and the door shall be opened unto you." How can you step over the threshold of a door that has not been opened to you?

As for the suffering you are undergoing because of being suspended between two worlds, as it were, embrace it!  It is your cross.  "A troubled mind and a contrite heart are a sacrifice to you O Lord."  I will tell you something a confessor told me the other day about similar suffering- "It is your chariot to Heaven!"

Thanks patriarch... it feels good when somebody tells me my pain is not in vain. I feel really alone sometimes. Both sides have their opportunities to tear at my soul, some people more viciously than others. I can only keep on trying to pour out my heart to people. I try so hard! And yet they don't understand. The bad thing though is that I get the most punishment from the Protestant side. You'd think my peers would be more kind. Oh well...

It's wonderful that you have seen the beauty of Catholic family life as it should be lived (and often is not).  Did you try to see it, or is it a gift from God?

In the meantime, you are a bridge between two worlds.  Would it not be wonderful for the unity of the Church if through your prayers and apostolate your fellow Calvinists came to see marriage as you see it? And I have not the slightest doubt that there are elements of the faith that are lived our more vibrantly among the reformed than among Catholics.  Pray for us, too! 

"Nor should we forget that anything wrought by the grace of the Holy Spirit in the hearts of our separated brethren can contribute to our own sanctification.  Whatever is truly Christian is never contraryt to what genuinely belongs to the faith; indeed, it can always bring a more perfect realization  of the very mystery of Christ and the Church"-from the decree on Ecumenism.

Oh, I will patriach, I will pray for you!
I hope I don't seem presumptious, but I think it hurts my heart the most when I see Catholics that don't follow the natural order of marriage. There it is! Right there, all laid out for them! They're already Catholic, it's so easy for them! For me, it is a journey against flow and uphill, a trip of agony. And there it is, right there for them, begging to be taken hold of! They have no excuse! I'm sorry, I didn't mean to rant, I just feel so passionately for it. :o

It's in the very nature of a bridge to be stretched  between one bank and another, and perhaps to feel trampled upon by traffic from both directions.

Peace to you and yours, and may you find everything your heart desires- and more...

Lee

 

I definitely feel trampled and torn and tossed to the side of the road. I'm just glad that I have some kind people to pick up my near-lifeless body and carry me to the inn. Awww, you guys are my family.

 

[VOW]

To Joe:

You DO realize that a lot of us converts married Cradle Catholics, don't you?????

And if you do go to any Catholic Singles gathering, leave your Calvinist tee-shirt at home.

Souljah's conversion story was a lot like your search (only he started with the Catholic wife....get in touch with him, maybe she's got some unmarried sisters or cousins, LOL). Perhaps the two of you could have a heart-to-heart about his journey.


Peace be with you,
~VOW

 

[Caedmon]

Originally posted by pax
My only advice would be don't convert unless you really believe Catholicism is the truth, although in your post you pretty much made it clear that you wouldn't convert unless you did. My best advice is to read up on those things you agree with (like the Catholic views on family). Also, you may want to consider trying to understand what exactly the Catholic Church teaches in some areas, why it teaches it, and what the basis for the teaching is. http://www.catholic.com has some good articles. I'll pray for you...

Pax Vobiscum

Thanks pax... you're right, I don't take faith lightly. I would never dishonor the Church by trying to join her and not believing her 100%.

 

[Caedmon]

Originally posted by isshinwhat
I think Patriarch put it beautifully.

Reformations within various churches are done by people who are willing to stick to their guns. Look at the effect St. Francis had on the Church. Almost 800 years and we still honor his memory for the simplicity and love he brought to our eyes. You can have the same effect on your community, at the very least. Let's face it, there are a lot of people who won't even touch anything they view as "Cath-lick" with a ten-foot pole. But coming from you, humblejoe, some will be more wiling to listen to the revealed truth of God's plan for families. Truth is truth, regardless of who bears it. Notice, though, one bears truth. It is a burden. If we are to be beacon's on a hill, then there must be a lot of darkness for us to bring light to, and there will be resistance to it. Remain firm, and God will provide. Remember it is His work you are doing, and He will accomplish it!

Let all Creation sing His praises!

Neal

Yeah, but this is just something that I never ever though in a million years I'd have to do. Flow against the pack and stand before all men?! Ahhh!!! I'm terrified!!! I'm so shy, I'm not powerful. :o I hope Jesus will help me.

And I know all about the "pathological aversion" to things Catholic, as Wols puts it. I used to be like that, and my mom still is. Actually, I'm quite terrified of what she would do if I married a Catholic. Please pray for my strength. I try hard not to be afraid of all things Catholic, because really, that's all it is with people that "hate" Catholicism... poor people, they're scared, and they don't know how to deal with it. May Jesus be merciful to their hearts. Actually, I've been kind of wanting a small crucifix to where. What's the cross without Jesus, eh? (ahhh!!! a graven image!!!! )

I know God will provide for me, I'm just scared. I've failed in so many things before this. I pray He will make me triumphant in this. May I remain steadfast in my conviction, I pray this with all my life's being.

 

[Caedmon]

Originally posted by VOW
To Joe:

You DO realize that a lot of us converts married Cradle Catholics, don't you?????

And if you do go to any Catholic Singles gathering, leave your Calvinist tee-shirt at home.

Yeah, that might be a good idea. :o

Souljah's conversion story was a lot like your search (only he started with the Catholic wife....get in touch with him, maybe she's got some unmarried sisters or cousins, LOL). Perhaps the two of you could have a heart-to-heart about his journey.


Peace be with you,
~VOW

LOL! sisters or cousins... VOW, you matchmaker, hehe... Yeah, maybe I can talk to him a little, probably not about conversion, but maybe just about having a precious family the way God intended it... awww!!!! *warm fuzzies*

 

[panterapat]

HJ,

You are in my prayers that the Holy spirit may guide your every step.

Have you aver read any of Dr. Scott Haun's books? He was an absolute anti-Catholic biblical scholar. He devoted his life to refuting the Catholic Church through Scripture. What he found instead is that Scripture affirms the Catholic Church.

Suggested reading:
Suprised by the Truth (Testamony of Protestant pastors who converted through Dr. Haun)
Rome Sweet Home (Haun's story of conflict and conversion)
The Lamb's Supper (An explaination of the Catholic Mass as explained in Revelations)

Dr. Hahn is a master biblical scholar. His writing opens the Scriptures like no other I have ever read.

In Christ: Patrick

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Please talk to me. I don't care if you don't have an "answer" for me, just please... have compassion on me, just a thought, or an encouragement, or a prayer maybe. I feel stretched

Hey Joe-

What questions do you have that I can try and answer. I am a neophyte, but being such, I might have some insights for ya.

 

[KC Catholic]

WOW Humblejoe what an interesting thread. Just pray my brother that the lord leads you to the ideal wife.

If there are questions about the Catholic faith you would like to discuss here or in an email - let us know. We are always glad to help.

Whatever you end up doing, may the lord continue to guide and bless you.

 

[VOW]

Hey, KC:

The Lord CAN'T lead Joe to the idea wife.

I'm already married...

/me snickers at her pitiful attempt at humor...


Peace,
~VOW