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If God is everywhere.....

StormyOne

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Okay this one has been nagging me for a while.... here is the question... If God is everywhere, and he is all powerful and all knowing, why would he need angels to record anything? In fact why would he need angels to protect us when he could do it himself... afterall he is everywhere right?
 

Byfaithalone1

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Okay this one has been nagging me for a while.... here is the question... If God is everywhere, and he is all powerful and all knowing, why would he need angels to record anything? In fact why would he need angels to protect us when he could do it himself... afterall he is everywhere right?

Great questions! Honestly, I don't have a clue. I still can't wrap my brain around the concept of an omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent God. Though I believe He is each of those things, I cannot really fathom what that means.

BFA
 
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Adventtruth

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Okay this one has been nagging me for a while.... here is the question... If God is everywhere, and he is all powerful and all knowing, why would he need angels to record anything? In fact why would he need angels to protect us when he could do it himself... afterall he is everywhere right?

Can you give scripture that I may comment?


AT
 
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StormyOne

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Can you give scripture that I may comment?


AT
no, I am not providing any text..... comment based on what you think about the question.... and realize that any scripture you wish to provide I am sure I already know and consider inadequate... I want to look at the conundrum.... i.e. God is everywhere, so then why angels?
 
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Avonia

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Okay this one has been nagging me for a while.... here is the question... If God is everywhere, and he is all powerful and all knowing, why would he need angels to record anything? In fact why would he need angels to protect us when he could do it himself... afterall he is everywhere right?

Above the line of creation there is only One. Nothing is outside of anything.

Below the line of creation there is delegation. The created are affected by the One, and the One is affected by Its creation. Parents sometimes comment that the best way to learn about themselves is through their children.
 
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StormyOne

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Above the line of creation there is only One. Nothing is outside of anything.

Below the line of creation there is delegation. The created are affected by the One, and the One is affected by Its creation. Parents sometimes comment that the best way to learn about themselves is through their children.
so you are suggesting that God delegates to angels? Even though God is everywhere and all powerful? Is that not a duplication of services?
 
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Adventtruth

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no, I am not providing any text..... comment based on what you think about the question.... and realize that any scripture you wish to provide I am sure I already know and consider inadequate... I want to look at the conundrum.... i.e. God is everywhere, so then why angels?


Ok, but thats just like saying why did God create humanity.


AT
 
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Avonia

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so you are suggesting that God delegates to angels? Even though God is everywhere and all powerful? Is that not a duplication of services?

Maximum downward delegation - not duplication. This connects to our conversations about sovereignty.
 
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StormyOne

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But the point is the same...God is omni present. Why need anything.


AT
the point is not the same.... it appears from the bible that some of what God does and some of what the angels do i.e. protect humans and/or record human behavior is the same.... Humans were not created spirits neither were they given the task to record or protect.....
 
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sentipente

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Ok, but thats just like saying why did God create humanity.


AT
The problem is not with the beings but the fact that they were called messengers. The ancients called them messengers because they believed that every ruler needed messengers. All their kings had messengers. Having created beings is not the problem but rather the need of messengers to carry messengers and do his work when he is omnipresent and omnipotent.
 
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sentipente

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Great questions! Honestly, I don't have a clue. I still can't wrap my brain around the concept of an omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent God. Though I believe He is each of those things, I cannot really fathom what that means.

BFA
Those concepts are very easily explained. Consider yourself. Everything that is a part of your is part of your personal space. If you can it aside it may belong to you but it is not a part of you. Now, is there any place you are where it can be said you are not? The answer is No. Whereever any part of you is you are there. So, in terms of your personal space you are omnipresent. However, your component parts are not omnipresent because your brain is not where your feet are. But you are whereever your brain, or your feet, or your hands are. The same with omnipotence. You have power over every part of your body but no part of your body has direct power over the other parts of your body. In terms of your personal space you are omnipresent. You are omniscient in terms of your personal space and this demonstrates that omniscience is not about knowing detailed facts but having a full understanding of oneself. The only reason why you think you don't know all about your body is because you are considering what your brain knows, but your brain is not you, it is only a part of you. God is omniscient but He does not know every detail that you will do tomorrow. However, he does know everything you are capable of doing and cannot be taken by surprise.

Now, think of the Creator of the universe who, by definition, must occupy all time and space. There is nowhere in the universe that He is not because there is nothing outside of Him.
 
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Byfaithalone1

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Those concepts are very easily explained. Consider yourself. Everything that is a part of your is part of your personal space. If you can it aside it may belong to you but it is not a part of you. Now, is there any place you are where it can be said you are not? The answer is No. Whereever any part of you is you are there. So, in terms of your personal space you are omnipresent. However, your component parts are not omnipresent because your brain is not where your feet are. But you are whereever your brain, or your feet, or your hands are. The same with omnipotence. You have power over every part of your body but no part of your body has direct power over the other parts of your body. In terms of your personal space you are omnipresent. You are omniscient in terms of your personal space and this demonstrates that omniscience is not about knowing detailed facts but having a full understanding of oneself. The only reason why you think you don't know all about your body is because you are considering what your brain knows, but your brain is not you, it is only a part of you. God is omniscient but He does not know every detail that you will do tomorrow. However, he does know everything you are capable of doing and cannot be taken by surprise.

Now, think of the Creator of the universe who, by definition, must occupy all time and space. There is nowhere in the universe that He is not because there is nothing outside of Him.

To adapt a phrase used by Stormy, would this be 4- or 5-dimensional thinking in a 3-dimensional world? This 3-dimensional guy can only imagine concepts such as "eternity," and "omnipresence." :D

BFA
 
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sentipente

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To adapt a phrase used by Stormy, would this be 4- or 5-dimensional thinking in a 3-dimensional world? This 3-dimensional guy can only imagine concepts such as "eternity," and "omnipresence." :D

BFA
Maybe you are expecting it to be more difficult than it really is.
 
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Adventtruth

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the point is not the same.... it appears from the bible that some of what God does and some of what the angels do i.e. protect humans and/or record human behavior is the same.... Humans were not created spirits neither were they given the task to record or protect.....

Oh I would differ with you on humans not protecting and not recording, but fair enough...

Hmmmmmmm So why does God need angels...

So who said He needed angels? I can't imagine that God needs anything. He fills up the sum of all things.

I love good music. I mean I can sit in the dark and listen to good music in my home for hours....classical, Gospel, Christian Rock, Contemporary Christian, Gospel, Jazz, Blues, Soul even a little country music, New Age, and classical piano. Any thing but Rap, unless its Laren Hill. But I have to have the best audio gear I can afford. And that stuff aint cheap. I'm talking about hundreds of dollars for good interconnects , and thousnads of dollars for good audiophile grade gear and speakers.

My wife thinks Im nuts to spend that kinda money. Its a luxury. Do I need that luxury to listen to music? No, but it makes the music as if its live in my listening space if I close my eyes.

I suppose its the same with God. He does not need angels or anything.


Its all a luxury for Him.


AT
 
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Adventtruth

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interesting analogy except you are not suggesting that your equipment are your messengers and are in existence to protect and serve....


Hahahahaha. Now that was funny. Don't know how you can up with that but it was a good laugh.


AT
 
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