I need everyones help on this one!!! please!!!

[BiblicalThoughts-Josh]

I received an e-mail from a member of B.T ministries today involving a conversation between him and his boss from a "Christian Ministry" I have been struggling all day on whether or not I wanted to write this but my spirit cries out and the words must be written. First I am going to post the message between the two, Person number 1 is the guy who sent it, and person number 2 is the member of B.T ministries. the names of any organizations are taken out. after the message I will post my thoughts and issues with this.



Person 1 - old boss January 14 at 3:14pm Report


Take us off of your work history. Your facebook page is covered with girls girls anmd more girls you are NOT a christian you stinking puke! The bible says no FORNICATOR will enter into heaven! Hypocrite! Takes us off!!
Sent via Facebook Mobile



Person 2 - B.T.M member January 14 at 8:03pm

I added the girls, some are mormons which I like to talk about doctrine with and the other girls are just people I added because they know some of my friends.... I'm not going out and having sex with every girl I see. I honestly do struggle with masturbation and I'm praying that God will take it from me and sanctify me so that I can do His will and live according to His will and His Spirit. Obviously there is a battle against the flesh with me, as with everyone else and I'm praying that God will take it from me. I do not appreciate the hypocrite comment and the stinking puke comment. I'm not going to say Christians should "nice" in essence all the time, especially when God commands us to rebuke so that others may fear (1 Tim. 5:20) but I don't believe I should be judged "righteous judgement" when you have no idea on why I am adding these people. I appreciate your concern and I did take "name of ministry here"off of my employment history, but I did learn a lot with the Ministry and I'm glad I had the opportunity to learn about Christ and His Word. Thank you for your concern and for your message and I pray that the Ministry will prosper.


How have you been recently? It has been a long time since we have talked....

Person 1-guy who sent it January 14 at 10:59pm Report

You are a joke, fake, phoney, hypocrite. How DARE you preach about Jesus Christ , the lamb of God. And praying to God for him to "take it away" is a JOKE! God won't "take it away" you give it up. The only reason you don't is because you love it. I don't know... here is one thought if you have a "problem" with that then maybe you should stay off of the internet...ya think? Just a question when you preach to people do you preach against sin? If so you are a hypocrite! I can't stand guys like you, you give Christians a bad name. Unless you repent from your sins that you love so much you are going to hell and you deserve it. Oh and please DO NOT pray for me, Isaiah 59:2 God DOES NOT hear your prayer any way. Read it for yourself.

Here is some biblical thoughts for you Hebrews 10:26 if we sin willfully after we ave received the knowledge of the truth there remains no more sacrifice for sins

You are willfully jackingoff and having sex. YOU DEVIL HAVE FUN IN HELL.HYPOCRITE!!!HYPOCRITE!!!HYPOCRITE!!!HYPOCRITE!!

Now both sides of this conversation have valid points. however they are handled in different ways. This kid is a fresh christian with a bad background and he is working and fighting with satan, and temptation while this other guy is claiming he is wrong for being in sin. First off it says in James 5:16 Confess [your] faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much. Paul said "I die daily, the things I want to do I fail to do and the things I don't want to do I continue to battle with" This man who is judging the Kid for battling with sin is not only Lying about being sinless for the bible says "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God" Romans 3:23. Matthew 24:4-5 Jesus answered: <span>“Watch out that no one deceives you.</span> <span>5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many." Christ was the only man to be sinless for this man to claim he is with out sin he is a deceiver and an enemy of God. For this "Christian" to say You devil have fun in hell you deserve it. he is placing himself higher then God, how can man decide who deserves and does not deserve to be in the kingdom of heaven? We have no idea the fullness of Gods plan, I don't doubt I'll be in heaven and I'll look over and say "Wow, he was saved? AMEN!! my brother I had not thought you would be here praise the Lord for your soul was saved." The small chunks of scripture taken saying no fornicator will enter into the gates of heaven, does he not read, that if you are born again you don't stand before the Lord as a drunkard, fornicator, murderer, ect. now this DOES NOT mean you continue living freely in sin, Paul spends so much time speaking on the Heart. As a Christian we know what is right and wrong, we battle with it everyday, does that mean I go out and murder and steal because Christ is my savior? NO it means I stand strong and battle with my temptations and my sin. Why place a cap on God saying he does not take away sin? GOD came into the WORLD through his SON to take away sin. it is a two way street I come to Lord guilty, and pray to take away my sin, I am giving up my sins to him. and he takes them away. Now as far as this Kid I do agree with how the man said if you struggle with it, why be around it? If I was a past drunk do I go to the bar? no I avoid temptation as we should as Christians, not to say we won't have them. Look around, every where you go satan is throwing his tempting arrows at us. If you struggle with lust, perhaps delete all fleshly people on your f.b? if you struggle with swearing, detach yourself from hearing swear words. The Life of a Christian is a very difficult task and NO ONE is perfect, except for he who came as PERFECT. I close you with this. How do you see your sin? Do you bring it to the Lord for help? Do you share with others? or do you do it in secret not regretting your choices? How do you communicate with others? Do you shatter they're trust in God and fellowshipping with others? Or do you show compassion and patience as your help work with them. for it says in james 5:20 "</span>Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.' and 1 peter 4:8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. I also believe in this "He who turns a soul away whether saved or non, holds his blood on his hands.

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[BiblicalThoughts-Josh]

I find myself struggling with this, the way this Minister of Gospel cut into this young man blew me away, please share your thoughts on the above post and help me clear my mind of it, the final paragraph are my thoughts towards this.

 

[tturt]

The "old boss" is very concerned about what people will think of them and their church's image. Plus - their approach is not Biblical. The Bible contains conflict resolution steps. Additionally, no believer is perfect including church leadership.

Is this person new to leadership? Do they have the authority to speak for leadership? If they are leadership, who are they accountable to?

I'm so sorry this has happened to this young man especially as a young believer. Please assure him.

 

[BiblicalThoughts-Josh]

Thank you for the reply, This organization is very unbiblical in many ways. everyone involved come from a non church background and are either ex drug attics and alcoholics. they seem to worship the overseer as he claims to be a "Prophet" but when he speaks he sounds like a corner psychic making broad generalizations which lead to self fulfilling prophecy. The man who wrote this has never had schooling, He was appointed a leader from the organization. It is sad to see this happen and I personally have been spending a lot of time with the young man he is a member of my ministry now and the growth he has had is remarkable to be able to see Gods impact in his life. I send my assurance from you to him, and he thanks you for your time on reading and replying to this thread.
God Bless,
Josh-B.T Ministries

 

[Catherineanne]

I send my assurance from you to him, and he thanks you for your time on reading and replying to this thread.
God Bless,
Josh-B.T Ministries

Hiya Josh.

There is a psychological behaviour called projection. This is where I don't want to admit that I am selfish, so I look at you, 'see' that you are selfish through and through, and then accuse you of this. It is always useful to consider what other people accuse us of; nine times out of ten they are actually talking about themselves, good and bad. The selfish will see selfishness in us, the generous will call us generous. It is a very good test of character, imo.

Result of projection: I feel so much better, and am reaffirmed in how unselfish I am. If I were not perfect, how could I see your sin? Therefore, this reinforces my own (false) self image, and makes me feel nice and smug.

What is actually true, however, is that you are probably no more selfish than the average person, and that this is my besetting sin, not yours. This applies to any other accusations of a similar nature. In Biblical terms, it is what the ancient Israelites did with their scapegoat; they gave all the sin to the goat, and then cast it out. This left them ritually pure, but was not good news for the goat. It is also not good news for anyone today who is on the receiving end of someone else's projection.

What I have found is that if I take my own sin to God, and ask his forgiveness, then he readily forgives, of course. However, if I take sin that has been projected onto me, he doesn't. How can he, when I didn't commit it, and the guilt is not mine? We cannot repent other people's projected sin; they have to repent it for themselves. So this young man will know if he feels guilt, but cannot find absolution from God. The sin does not belong to him.

Conclusion: whoever wrote that vitriolic email is very, very enmeshed in sin relating to women. He is not free from it in any way. The young man who could admit the extent of his own sin is telling the truth, that is evident; he is on the narrow path, and I really hope he continues on it. The one who is accusing him, actually accuses himself.

If you know who this accuser is, then I suggest keeping well away. He is an accident waiting to happen, in my view. Remind your young friend that satan is called the accuser of the brethren, and he will know all that he needs to know about this nasty behaviour.

Read this part again, and realise that this man is talking about himself, and all will become clear. He seriously has problems, and so will anyone who comes into contact with him in any way.

You are a joke, fake, phoney, hypocrite. How DARE you preach about Jesus Christ , the lamb of God. And praying to God for him to "take it away" is a JOKE! God won't "take it away" you give it up. The only reason you don't is because you love it. I don't know... here is one thought if you have a "problem" with that then maybe you should stay off of the internet...ya think? Just a question when you preach to people do you preach against sin? If so you are a hypocrite! I can't stand guys like you, you give Christians a bad name. Unless you repent from your sins that you love so much you are going to hell and you deserve it. Oh and please DO NOT pray for me, Isaiah 59:2 God DOES NOT hear your prayer any way. Read it for yourself.

 

[BiblicalThoughts-Josh]

Wow, thank you for that one I agree 100% I personally felt this when I first became a Christian I was very Prideful, full of myself and my abilities, when God humbled me and I began to understand my Pride as sin, I found myself instantly shutting out other Prideful people and not wanting to go near them for it was like standing in a Mirror. I am a lot more mature in Christ then I was back then and now I find it easy to relate to these people. I understand that this man is probably dealing with it when he saw the reflection off of the young man he became outraged because of his own guilt. In another note the man told the young man "God will not hear your prayers or be with you in your works" The other night we went to get dinner, and as we were ordering a group of women walked in. We began small talking and it turned out one of the ladies just lost her 16year old son and was in town to do her first church speaking and she thought it was so incredible for her to run into us for it was God showing her that he was there. This is evidence that God is with this young man, and proud that he is willing to come out and admit the problems and battle with them everyday.
Thank you for replying, and helping provide some very encouraging and useful information.
Josh

 

[Catherineanne]

Wow, thank you for that one I agree 100% I personally felt this when I first became a Christian I was very Prideful, full of myself and my abilities, when God humbled me and I began to understand my Pride as sin, I found myself instantly shutting out other Prideful people and not wanting to go near them for it was like standing in a Mirror. I am a lot more mature in Christ then I was back then and now I find it easy to relate to these people. I understand that this man is probably dealing with it when he saw the reflection off of the young man he became outraged because of his own guilt.

This is right, except that people who project do this so they do not have to deal with the sin; it is a form of denial. As long as this man continues to see the sin in everyone else, and not himself, he will remain unrepentant, with all that this entails.

This is a serious failing, and one which is incredibly difficult to break through. Any attempt to reach this man will result in more denial, and more psychological defensiveness, which is likely to take the form of an attack. This is why, when offered a very Christian message, he got more strident in his accusations, rather than less.

In another note the man told the young man "God will not hear your prayers or be with you in your works" The other night we went to get dinner, and as we were ordering a group of women walked in. We began small talking and it turned out one of the ladies just lost her 16year old son and was in town to do her first church speaking and she thought it was so incredible for her to run into us for it was God showing her that he was there. This is evidence that God is with this young man, and proud that he is willing to come out and admit the problems and battle with them everyday.

The funny thing about God is that he is not a bigot. He doesn't choose to work only through the perfect and the virtuous; quite the opposite. He chooses the least likely people, the sinners and the fallen, so that we don't fall into the very easy trap of thinking that he chooses us because of how good we are.

God does not choose anyone because of how good they are, but because of how good he is.

Thank you for replying, and helping provide some very encouraging and useful information.
Josh

You are most welcome. Keep away from that other person; imagine he has the plague, and you might catch it. Stay with people who you know are good for you.

 

[tturt]

I re-read my post and "conflict resolution" wasn't the best term I could have used. Whenever there is a disagreement in the church, there are Scriptures to guide us. However, I view this more of a shepherd not doing his job.

OP - very glad this young man is under your ministry now.