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How to show a wiccan The Truth

Leat

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Hello, I am in some need of help here. I have a made a great new friend, and she's really cool. We think alike, and share some common ground overall. But she is a Wiccan. She claims that Hecate[research this goddess if you have no idea, I still don't really know much about it] came to her, and showed her love. Now to her, I believe she has been deceived by the obvious Great Deceiver.

She was raised in a southern christian family, but was abused, shamed, and put through some kind of other pain IDK about within her family. She lives with her grandmother, so I have a feeling it eventually involved the law[popos].

So she knows about The Bible, it's been crammed down her throat most of her life, and she knows I'm a christian. She doesn't reject me for it, which I'm thankful for.

So how do you show a wiccan the truth, who has been greatly deceived and mistreated by "Christians"?
 

GhostKid

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Look at how Christ dealt with those folks who either didn't believe in Him or were considered unclean by the Jewish community. He showed them compassion and love first and foremost. He really only answered questions / taught when asked. Be friends with her but do not participate in any rituals. In fact by showing her the inner peace that you can obtain through relationships and not rituals. When God looks at us He see His Son. Why shouldn't the rest of the world see His Son when they look at us too?
 
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paul1149

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I agree with Ghost Kid. Show her the love of Christ. Show her that Christianity isn't the distorted image she saw in her fam. Be patient and kind, and all the other fruit of the Spirit:

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. -Gal 5:22-23

This way, the Spirit himself can woo her, whereas any religious arguments would just put her off. David said of the Lord, "Thy gentleness has made me great."

Blessings.
 
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E.C.

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"Preach the Gospel and when necessary, use words" - St. Augustine of Hippo.

"Acquire a peaceful spirit and thousands around you shall be saved" - St. Seraphim of Sarov.


Live by example, pray, and answer questions when asked. That's all. I find that using this approach one can have greater theological discussions with Wiccas and Buddhists than with most Christians.
 
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eyerobot

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The first stage of "real magick" is for an "entity" to appear as a helpful spirit, Or god. These "entities" are supposedly controlled by rituals, And offerings. These rituals are instrumental in making the practitioner believe that they have control. This normally continues for an indefinite time, Until the demon posing as the "entity" begins to escalate this into oppression.

Oppression can be anything from emotional distress, To full blown physical threats and attacks.

That's usually the point where the average person gets worried, And starts looking for a way to get rid of this demon that they invited into their life.

But there are the more hardcore believers, That are taught that with each level of understanding, There is a heavier price to pay. What they are telling the believer, Is that the oppression is a sign that you are dealing with a more powerful spirit than before. Or, You have reached a higher power level, And the god requires more from you.

This is a never ending circle of deception, Which always leads to the "spirit" having more control over your life.

And there are the extreme cases, Where a person actually becomes possessed.

The reason I tell you this, Is because right now, Like so many people in the world today, She is playing white witch. It seems harmless enough at first, And you might even begin to believe she has power. But she does not!

What is happening to these people, Is they are getting a slight introduction to the occult. Just enough to make them want to try more, And then run home to watch "Charmed", Or one of the other occult shows. It's the same as a drug dealer, He doesnt hand you a syringe and say hey try this. He gets you to smoke a little weed at a time, Then try some pills, And then he brings out the big guns.

The advice here is correct, In that you should show her the love of Christ, Take no part in her ceremonies, But also let her know what she's doing, And how it will destroy her.

I know you don't want to lose a friend, But if it comes down to it, Will you stand your ground against what shes doing? This battle is as much for your soul as hers.

I noticed that this is posted under "non christians". I hope you were only referring to your friend, And not yourself, Because you cannot win this battle alone.
 
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JGG

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Awesome!
 
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vespasia

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The first stage of "real magick" is for an "entity" to appear as a helpful spirit, Or god.

Urm no - not unless you have been reading those funky populist notions written by Christians about what they suppose magick must be. Its also not wise or helpful to presume that any path taken by a wiccan uses magick. I was always left aghast by the presumptions made by Christians about what I had to be doing, sadly that led to me making the presumption that what they had to say about Christ would be equally errenous.

Again this is a Christian presumption of the purpose of ritual which is simply a prescribed way of doing things. Wicca has its own liturgical forms just as Christianity does. This does not mean the intent is to control something that is other to humanity.

Oppression can be anything from emotional distress, To full blown physical threats and attacks.
Hmm now that sounds like the actions of a nice group of Christians I meet; the adversary turned up wearing a face that represented Christ so how Christians treat wiccans shows them the Christ the Christians claim to represent. On the whole I consider the suggestions of Ghostkid, E.C. and Paul to be the most constructive approach to take.

But there are the more hardcore believers, That are taught that with each level of understanding, There is a heavier price to pay.
I presume you refer to the concept that the Dark Goddess only takes what we have to give? If you already have the epitomy of the dark feminine why bother looking for more? You have no real concept fo this entity and it is foolish to try and comprehend this as human structure of heriarchy.

I have to smile at the idea this is about power- perhaps for some very hurting young people fleeing Christian backgrounds but they stand out like raw gapping wounds. There is something about such a person turning up at a moot wearing a hastly contrived upside down cross and demanding access to the inner circle of the [insert imagined order of choice often derived from their parents books on spiritual warfare] that makes even the most sinsitri person hand over the phone number of a good youth counselling service. No one sinistri that is sane welcomes or wants to work with someone who is emotionally unstable. Most wiccan groups would not either and would refer on to a priest who was qualified to listen and give space to such a person to work out what they do want.

Hurting young people who beocme serious are more likely to apply to CoS than run home to watch Charmed. Okay I do consider books by the likes of Starhawk to be one of the best pension plans I have ever seen but to presume that books by wiccan authors do not wrestle with some tough questions in the same way Christians do is a tad niave. Wiccans tackle theodicy as well as Christians and other faiths.

It is not wicca that will destroy her- it is the false vindictive Christ that has inflicted harm. The enemy is in the church often at the front and showing a perverted version of Christ that immunises people from the reality of Christ.

The OP has a christian symbol and I am presumming has posted in this folder in an attempt to understand his friends pov. Compared to the twisted version of christ she has been shown I can understand why she has fled as far away as she can imagine.
Why on earth would she want to settle for 'a christ' made in the image of man? It took me decades and only after I had seen someone living in the image of Christ in the gospels before I was willing to consider that Christ might be the better way. The witness of a life lived following Christ often carries ore weight than mere words.

I suggest contacting the Gathering at Salem. They outreach in the local pagan community and may be able to help. The Sacred Tribes Journal available free to read online may help give you insight into todays alternative spiritual cultures. Be there, listen to her, answer any questions as honestly as YOU can rather than regurgitate the thoughts of others, pray for her quietly and asks God to bless her with what God knows she needs and wait.
 
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kimmyh51

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I think the fact that she is into wicca, shows that she does have a desire to know more about the spiritual world, and where she comes from.

Maybe bring up 'spirituality' rather than 'religon' ask her what she likes about her wiccan faith, and what she didnt like about christianity, and from there maybe even reverse psychology, - like rather than try and argue with her reasons for being against christianity, which (while obviously i dont know what they are, but from what you say would guess that at least in part she has been betrayed by people she sees as representing christianity, so has no trust in the people who claim to be christians or the concept (and who could blame her)) anyway maybe instead when she talks about her reasons, sort of agree with her.

By that I dont mean go yeah thats right christianity sucks, but if she says something like that christians do not treat people properly or dont do what they preach - or whatever say, yeah and either tell her any stories you have (i guess as a christian tell them without naming names and trashing the person) but tell her any thing that shows you understand and think that the behaviour of the christians who she has been abused by, is wrong, and not at all christian. And maybe then say how it upsets you when people who do cruel, deceitful, manipulative etc things, and use christianity as an excuse, and that you wonder if the people who do that are not christians at all, and what a pity their behaviour is and how the good christians end up with the bad rap for it, etc etc (without being judgemental if you know what i mean - treading a fine line I know - but you want her to understand that you hear her reasons), and you understand them, and you can see where she is coming from if she was abused by people claiming to be christians, and just try and talk to her about that, and spirituality in general.

Just keep being a friend, and showing her by your own love as a friend - the love of jesus. Try and pick your moments to ask her whether she thinks that its actually Christ/God, or whether its the actions of these people (ie try and let her discover for herself why she is feeling this way)

And of course at the end of the day, ask God for help, and for him to show you the right times to talk to her, and the right things to do, and to put the right words in your mouth that will show her the truth.

I experimented with that sort of thing years ago (well before becomming a christian). And I think the reason was to try and answer the questions that god answers like why was i here what was the point, was there anything outside human life, did i mean something more than just one more speck in a great huge cesspot of specs called humans. Maybe a way to feel special, ie if she is able to cast spells etc, then she feels that she must be special to a higher power, as she has been given the ability to make things happen with spells.

If she has been dabbling for a while, ask her about any spells that worked... then ask her if there was anything about them that worked too well (in a negative way) or did they work by doing something negative - ie were there any downsides - on reflection?

If she has dabbled in it much, chances are if she is honest with you, she will have some experiences where her spells may have taken on a life of their own, and not in a positive way.

Also, ask her this: Even if all her spells have worked so far, and she has had success, and managed to control her ownlife/relationships and so on better. Has it helped with the stuff thats right down at the core of us all, ie depression, fear of death, self esteem (that one she might think it has helped if her spells have worked, but if she goes beyond the novelty of that she will find it has not helped her self esteem either.
As her whether she has more love in her heart or whether it has brought a feeling of being loved into her life. Ask her to compare any feelings she has about that - to both the feeling of being sought out, and being special, maybe powerful, or attractive, vs being truly loved, without any ego stroking.

I think as others have said, if she has made this decision, straight out debate and attempts to convince her wont work (unless god decides to work them), and will just come across possibly as an attempt to control her, which is quite possibly what her christian family and/or abusers did, and therefore her reaction will be that you are just more of the same.

I think you have to try and pick your times with guidance from god, and let her talk about things, and hope that she will come to her own conclusions.
You dont have to approve of what shes doing by that (IMHO anyway), simply be like Jesus, and be her friend, and love her anyway and be there for her. So that when she realises wicca is not the answer, its you she turns to, to try and figure out what is.
 
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Kiravana

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I think it is great your friend has found something that calls to her. Maybe Wicca to her is the truth. She could be just going through an experimental phase, sure. However, she could also have strong feelings for Wicca and it could stick with her for the rest of her life. I know some people who followed Wicca just as if it were a phase, and then I have some friends who still see it as their calling and they are well into adulthood now.

Wiccan's aren't really all that different in belief from christians... given time, she'll get sick of it. Where she goes from there will be another matter.

Is that what you do with religion? You wear it for a while until you get sick of it, then toss it aside? It is quite unfair to make assumptions based on someone we have never met or spoken to.
 
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salida

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salida

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Show them the love of Christ-not all christians are christians but just in name only.

http://carm.org/religious-movements/wicca/witnessing-those-wicca

http://www.dare2share.org/top10/how-do-i-reach-a-witch-or-wiccan-for-christ/
 
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TheOldLine

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How about everyone non-christian gets off this site because, if you haven't noticed, it's for Christians. And don't not be friends with her like the Pentecostal fellow above suggested, that's what turns people away from God. What I always find is the most affective way to evangelize is to not talk about God until asked, and then explain what he has done for your life. But in my view if it doesn't work, forget it, its all in God's hands anyways he's already chosen all this stuff.
 
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wartyg

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Excellent post.


I'm a Kemetic Pagan, And so far my gods have given me things that I am grateful for, someone seemed to be implying that Wicca and Paganism do not teach love, or goodness however that is not the truth.

There are a few mottos

"Love Light Life"
"Do what ye will Harm none"

What is so evil about that?
Yes it does occasionally lead to evil, But then as vespasia said, Christianity has turned a few people into full blown satanists (often only a temporary stage)

Its wrong to change and impose on someones will... I did that once in a moment of fear and I still regret it. We never use these methods unless it is for the greater good yet you imply we do the bidding of a Demon...

Please don't attempt to convert her, she will only get angry at you.
Don't take part in ceremonies by all means but trying to convert her then her goddess may tell her and she would be angry...
 
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morningstar2651

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Hecate is a dark goddess. She is not a misunderstood sweetheart - she has earned her dark reputation.

This idea that Hecate is a sweetness and light and loves your friend flies in the face of the ancient Greek religion that Hecate is from. In ancient Greek mythology the gods aren't depicted as the loving and benevolent creators of mankind. (Prometheus is the exception that proves the rule)

Attempting to convert her will only push her away. She needs to sort out what she believes... and this is something she needs to do on her own - a person's religion is a very personal thing and it's something she's going to have to work out for herself. It sounds to me like she believes in a maternal goddess that loves her... However, Hecate is not traditionally depicted as maternal or loving. The ancient Greeks constructed household altars to her in hopes that appeasing her would protect them from witchcraft. If you need a reference to point her to for research - point her to the Theoi project. It's not about Wicca, it's about the traditions and mythology of ancient Greece.

The best thing you can do is to remember that she is still the same person and she is still your friend no matter what she believes or does not believe.
 
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