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The fact is that science (today) does not concern itself with the supernatural. It cannot because the supernatural cannot be proven with observable, repeatable evidence.
Science is a methology, a mode of logical thought and deductive reasoning. The products of science must be refutable (gravity, atomic theory, evolution, etc.) Christianity is not refutable - you cannot refute it ot provide evidence against it (i know, poor argument).Why can't it be proven? Who says?
Meaning, are you suggesting the matter has been decided before considering the evidence?
The Bible clearly says God proves his supernatural character by prophecy and healing. The Bible certainly seems to think such things can be proven.
This is the problem.
Indeed. If, as Christians, we denounce scientism (that is, the philosophy that the only authentic knowledge is scientific knowlege), then the Bible's timely science is of no concern to us.Right - the book isn't science - it's theology. It contains theological truths.
Well said - thank you. I would rep you, but I have run out.Indeed. If, as Christians, we denounce scientism (that is, the philosophy that the only authentic knowledge is scientific knowlege), then the Bible's timely science is of no concern to us.
Besides, the Bible doesn't call itself Holy, anyway. That's a human artifact rooted in tradition.
So, if some where in the Bible is "obviously" wrong, no matter it is science or not, how could you be sure that some other verses about faith are right ?Right - the book isn't science - it's theology. It contains theological truths.
Because the Bible tells us that its authors were inspired to speak truthfully about matters of the spirit, not matters of science. See 1 Cor 2:13:So, if some where in the Bible is "obviously" wrong, no matter it is science or not, how could you be sure that some other verses about faith are right ?
Are you saying that spiritual matters are not related to fact? I beg to differ. If you're saying what I think you're saying, you are exemplifying the very scientism I spoke about in my last post.If something about fact is wrong, how could you trust something else in the same book, which is not even related to fact?
I might have an easier time understanding you if you phrased yourself less ambiguously, juvenissun.I do not know what is wrong with you. Not I am trying to ignore you, but you usually expand my words to what I did not say, and it made me confused on how to respond.
For example:
I said: If something about fact is wrong, how could you trust something else in the same book, which is not even related to fact?
Then you replied: Are you saying that spiritual matters are not related to fact? I beg to differ.
I did not say that. What I said was:
"Some" matters (about faith) are not related to fact. But not:
"All" spiritual matters are not related to fact.
I am sorry that I do not have so much time to correct your logic error every time.
Right so the error might not be 'obvious' as you put it but it is inaccurate, insects don't have 4 legs they have 6, they don't walk on 4 legs they walk on 6.
So why do you think the bible says 4 and not 6?
example: we are sinners.I might have an easier time understanding you if you phrased yourself less ambiguously, juvenissun.
With that out of the way, when you say "some" matters of faith are not related to fact, what do you mean? Which matters of faith are you referring to? Please be explicit, because this is how misunderstandings come about.
6 legs, but only 4 are used at any time in walking.I'm still interested in you answer to this question juvenissun.
not a science fact.So, are you saying "we are sinners" is not a fact?
Aha! And there we have it. We have come full circle, and you have exemplified the very scientism I spoke of earlier. That is, you have erroneously equated "fact" with "science", as per your earlier statement:not a science fact.
Is it any wonder you seek 21st century science hidden in the Scriptures, given your conflation of reality with what is scientifically verifiable? I think things are really starting to click into place. I think I understand you more now than ever!If something about fact is wrong, how could you trust something else in the same book, which is not even related to fact?
You are really hopeless.
You are really hopeless.
6 legs, but only 4 are used at any time in walking.
Why do I have to repeat this?
So, it is the same question:I couldn't care less. I don't expect science in the Enuma Elish, and the Bible has more in common with the Enuma Elish than it does with Darwin's Origin of the Species.
Don't ask me. Ask a Rabbi. It is their food and I do not eat insect. Ask him why dare they eat grasshopper which has more than 4 legs. Or ask him why don't Jews eat all insects since all of them has 6 legs.Because I don't think you're quite getting the verse. Look at what it says:
Leviticus 11:20
KJV - going upon all four (legs)
NIV - that walk on all fours
ESV - that go on all fours
*all fours*. All meaning all of the legs, all four of them. Are you going to tell us that 'all' means something different here?
So, it is the same question:
If the Book of your faith has science errors, how can you be sure there are no other errors, such as geographic errors, music errors, art errors, math errors, logic errors, etc. ?
An honest answer is that you can not be sure, and the content of the Book becomes debatable. Then the foundation of faith is destroyed.
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