How Do You Know If You Are Chosen?

[DMagoh]

I am asking the following questions honestly, trying to understand. I do not plan to flame, ridicule, or reply with sarcasm.


As a Calvinist who is chosen, how did you know you were chosen? How was it revealed to you? How do you know for sure you were chosen? What would you do if when you died and were standing before God, he told you that you were, in fact, not chosen and that you would be going to hell? I mean, is there a way a person could think they were chosen, and really not be?

 

[bradfordl]

As a Calvinist who is chosen, how did you know you were chosen? How was it revealed to you? How do you know for sure you were chosen?

Rom 8:16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
Rom 8:17 and if children, then heirs--heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.

What would you do if when you died and were standing before God, he told you that you were, in fact, not chosen and that you would be going to hell? I mean, is there a way a person could think they were chosen, and really not be?

Obviously a person could think such a thing, as the Lord Himself said of the sheep and the goats, but then the assurance spoken of in the verses above would not have happened for that person, now would it?

Do you not have the assurance spoken of in Romans?

Brad

 

[DMagoh]

Rom 8:16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God

That is a very general response. HOW does the Spirit bear witness to you? I'm sure a lot of people feel saved, that arent. What specifically lets a chosen person know for sure they are chosen.

 

[UMP]

I am asking the following questions honestly, trying to understand. I do not plan to flame, ridicule, or reply with sarcasm.


As a Calvinist who is chosen, how did you know you were chosen? How was it revealed to you? How do you know for sure you were chosen? What would you do if when you died and were standing before God, he told you that you were, in fact, not chosen and that you would be going to hell? I mean, is there a way a person could think they were chosen, and really not be?

I agree with Bradfordl. However, another, and I believe just as biblical answer would be what you are resting your salvation on.
Are you resting on a decision you've made?
Are you resting on your work as a Christian after said decision?
I am resting on the FINISHED work of Christ and NOTHING else, for I have NOTHING to offer.
Like the old hymn from Isaac Watts says:

Show pity, Lord, O Lord, forgive,
Let a repenting rebel live:
Are not thy mercies large and free?
May not a sinner trust in thee?

My crimes are great, but not surpass
The power and glory of thy grace:
Great God, thy nature hath no bound,
So let thy pard'ning love be found.

O wash my soul from every sin,
And make my guilty conscience clean;
Here on my heart the burden lies,
And past offences pain my eyes.

My lips with shame my sins confess
Against thy law, against thy grace:
Lord, should thy judgment grow severe,
I am condemned, but thou art clear.

Should sudden vengeance seize my breath,
I must pronounce thee just in death;
And if my soul were sent to hell,
Thy righteous law approves it well.

Yet save a trembling sinner, Lord,
Whose hope, still hov'ring round thy word,
Would light on some sweet promise there,
Some sure support against despair.

 

[bradfordl]

That is a very general response. HOW does the Spirit bear witness to you? I'm sure a lot of people feel saved, that arent. What specifically lets a chosen person know for sure they are chosen.

Maybe general to you, very specific, and very scriptural to me. How does He bear witness? With my spirit. Not a feeling, friend. As the scriptures say again:

Gal 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

Here's what the Westminster Confession of Faith has to say:

Chapter 18:
Of Assurance of Grace
and Salvation​

18:1 Although hypocrites and other unregenerate men may vainly deceive themselves with false hopes, and carnal presumptions of being in the favour of God, and estate of salvation (Deu_29:9; Job_8:13, Job_8:14; Mic_3:11; Joh_8:41); which hope of theirs shall perish (Mat_7:22, Mat_7:23): yet such as truly believe in the Lord Jesus, and love Him in sincerity, endeavouring to walk in all good conscience before Him, may, in this life, be certainly assured that they are in the state of grace (1Jo_2:3; 1Jo_3:14, 1Jo_3:18, 1Jo_3:19, 1Jo_3:21, 1Jo_3:24; 1Jo_5:13), and may rejoice in the hope of the glory of God, which hope shall never make them ashamed (Rom_5:2, Rom_5:5).
18:2 This certainly is not a bare conjectural and probable persuasion, grounded upon a fallible hope (Heb_6:11, Heb_6:19); but an infallible assurance of faith, founded upon the divine truth of the promises of salvation (Heb_6:17, Heb_6:18), the inward evidence of those graces unto which these promises are made (2Co_1:12; 2Pe_1:4, 2Pe_1:5, 2Pe_1:10, 2Pe_1:11; 1Jo_2:3; 1Jo_3:14), the testimony of the Spirit of adoption witnessing with our spirits that we are the children of God (Rom_8:15, Rom_8:16): which Spirit is the earnest of our inheritance, whereby we are sealed to the day of redemption (2Co_1:21, 2Co_1:22; Eph_1:13, Eph_1:14; Eph_4:30).
18:3 This infallible assurance doth not so belong to the essence of faith, but that a true believer may wait long, and conflict with many difficulties before he be a partaker of it (Psa_77:1-12; 88:1-18; Isa_1:10; Mar_9:24; 1Jo_5:13): yet, being enabled by the Spirit to know the things which are freely given him of God, he may without extraordinary revelation, in the right use of ordinary means, attain thereunto (1Co_2:12; Eph_3:17-19; Heb_6:11, Heb_6:12; 1Jo_4:13). And therefore it is the duty of everyone to give all diligence to make his calling and election sure (2Pe_1:10); that thereby his heart may be enlarged in peace and joy in the Holy Ghost, in love and thankfulness to God, and in strength and cheerfulness in the duties of obedience, the proper fruits of this assurance (Psa_4:6, Psa_4:7; Psa_119:32; Eph_1:3, Eph_1:4; Rom_5:1, Rom_5:2, Rom_5:5; Rom_14:17; Rom_15:13): so far is it from inclining men to looseness (Psa_130:4; Joh_3:2, Joh_3:3; Rom_6:1, Rom_6:2; Rom_8:1, Rom_8:12;1Co_7:1; Tit_2:11, Tit_2:12, Tit_2:14; 1Jo_1:6, 1Jo_1:7; 1Jo_2:1, 1Jo_2:2).
18:4 True believers may have the assurance of their salvation divers ways shaken, diminished, and intermitted; as, by negligence in preserving of it, by falling into some special sin, which woundeth the conscience and grieveth the Spirit; by some sudden or vehement temptation, by God’s withdrawing the light of His countenance, and suffering even such as fear Him to walk in darkness and to have no light (Psa_31:22; Psa_77:1-10; 88:1-18; Son_5:2, Son_5:3, Son_5:6; Isa_1:10; Mat_26:69-72; Eph_4:30, Eph_4:31): yet are they never utterly destitute of that seed of God, and life of faith, that love of Christ and the brethren, that sincerity of heart, and conscience of duty, out of which, by the operation of the Spirit, this assurance may, in due time, be revived (Job_13:15; Psa_51:8, Psa_51:12; Psa_73:15; Isa_1:10; Luk_22:32; 1Jo_3:9); and by the which, in the mean time, they are supported from utter despair (Psa_22:1; 88:1-18; Isa_54:7-10; Mic_7:7-9).

Maybe that's specific enough for you. Do you not have that assurance? Does the Spirit not bear witness with your spirit? Seek the Lord, if peradventure He will give you repentance to the acknowledging of the truth.​

SDG,​

Brad​

 

[bradfordl]

Like the old hymn from Isaac Watts says:

Gotta love Isaac Watts. Sang "Jesus, My Great High Priest" in Church Sunday. The old logician always knew how to proclaim the beauty of the Lord and His love.

1. Jesus, my great High Priest,
Offered His blood and died;
My guilty conscience seeks
No sacrifice beside.
His powerful blood did once atone,
And now it pleads before the throne.

2. To this dear Surety's hand
Will I commit my cause;
He answers and fulfils
His Father's broken laws.
Behold my soul at freedom set;
My Surety paid the dreadful debt.

3. My Advocate appears
For my defense on high;
The Father bows His ears
And lays His thunder by.
Not all that hell or sin can say
Shall turn His heart, His love, away.

4. Should all the hosts of death
And powers of hell unknown
Put their most dreadful forms
Of rage and mischief on,
I shall be safe, for Christ displays
Superior power and guardian grace.

And of course, his books, "Logic: the Right Use of Reason after the Inquiry of Truth" and "Logic: Continuing Discourse". What a mind for the Lord!

SDG,

Brad

 

[Paleoconservatarian]

How do you know if you're elect? It's very simple. If you believe in Christ, and you are a Christian, then you are elect. No ifs, ands, or buts. You are not allowed to look for your election anywhere else but Christ: certainly not if you are an unbeliever, but even as a believer you must look not in yourself, not in speculation, not even in God the Father.

I love how clear and pastoral the Second Helvetic Confession is on this question:

Whether We Are Elected. We therefore find fault with those who outside of Christ ask whether they are elected. And what has God decreed concerning them before all eternity? For the preaching of the Gospel is to be heard, and it is to be believed; and it is to be held as beyond doubt that if you believe and are in Christ, you are elected. For the Father has revealed unto us in Christ the eternal purpose of his predestination, as I have just now shown from the apostle in 2 Tim. 1:9-10. This is therefore above all to be taught and considered, what great love of the Father toward us is revealed to us in Christ. We must hear what the Lord himself daily preaches to us in the Gospel, how he calls and says: "Come to me all who labor and are heavy-laden, and I will give you rest" (Matt. 11:28). "God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life" (John 3:16). Also, "It is not the will of my Father that one of these little ones should perish" (Matt. 18:14).

Let Christ, therefore be the looking glass, in whom we may contemplate our predestination. We shall have a sufficiently clear and sure testimony that we are inscribed in the Book of Life if we have fellowship with Christ, and he is ours and we are his in true faith.

 

[DMagoh]

How do you know if you're elect? It's very simple. If you believe in Christ, and you are a Christian, then you are elect. No ifs, ands, or buts...

I read online yesterday a Cavinist that was criticizing Baptists for having an "altar call". He said that you were putting your faith in doing something, like "praying the sinner's prayer", or "making a decision for Jesus", or "asking Jesus into your heart". So if an altar call is not correct, and these acts of placing your faith in Jesus are not appropriate, what is the correct way to "believe in Christ" as you stated in your post?

 

[Paleoconservatarian]

I read online yesterday a Cavinist that was criticizing Baptists for having an "altar call". He said that you were putting your faith in doing something, like "praying the sinner's prayer", or "making a decision for Jesus", or "asking Jesus into your heart". So if an altar call is not correct, and these acts of placing your faith in Jesus are not appropriate, what is the correct way to "believe in Christ" as you stated in your post?

The problem with altar calls is that what underlies them is the error of revivalism. These things are treated as means of grace, whereas the actual means that God ordained, preaching and the sacraments, are not considered by most of these Baptists to be means of grace. When someone comes forward in an altar call or prays the sinner's prayer, he is told that if he did this thing, congratulations, you are a Christian! And so later on when someone asks this person why he is a Christian, or how he knows he'll be in heaven, or some such thing, he'll probably respond with "Well, the pastor called and I came forward," or, "I prayed a prayer one time," or, "I made a decision for Christ," rather than the only correct answer, which is that God the Son came down and took on flesh in the womb of the Virgin, suffered God's wrath on the cross for me, and was raised to life on the third day, for me, and His perfect righteousness has been imputed to me as if it were mine.

 

[DMagoh]

The problem with altar calls is that what underlies them is the error of revivalism. These things are treated as means of grace, whereas the actual means that God ordained, preaching and the sacraments, are not considered by most of these Baptists to be means of grace. When someone comes forward in an altar call or prays the sinner's prayer, he is told that if he did this thing, congratulations, you are a Christian! And so later on when someone asks this person why he is a Christian, or how he knows he'll be in heaven, or some such thing, he'll probably respond with "Well, the pastor called and I came forward," or, "I prayed a prayer one time," or, "I made a decision for Christ," rather than the only correct answer, which is that God the Son came down and took on flesh in the womb of the Virgin, suffered God's wrath on the cross for me, and was raised to life on the third day, for me, and His perfect righteousness has been imputed to me as if it were mine.

So if you believe those things (that God the Son came down and took on flesh in the womb of the Virgin, suffered God's wrath on the cross for me, and was raised to life on the third day, for me, and His perfect righteousness has been imputed to me as if it were mine), then how do you appropriately respond to be saved? Or do you have to respond at all, other than just believe that?

 

[Paleoconservatarian]

So if you believe those things (that God the Son came down and took on flesh in the womb of the Virgin, suffered God's wrath on the cross for me, and was raised to life on the third day, for me, and His perfect righteousness has been imputed to me as if it were mine), then how do you appropriately respond to be saved? Or do you have to respond at all, other than just believe that?

If you believe this, you are Christ's and He is yours. Your sins have been washed away and you have eternal life. You don't do anything to make this happen. Justification is attributed to faith alone because it is faith that receives Christ. Of course you're going to respond to God's grace, but that is not what's saving.

 

[heymikey80]

So if you believe those things (that God the Son came down and took on flesh in the womb of the Virgin, suffered God's wrath on the cross for me, and was raised to life on the third day, for me, and His perfect righteousness has been imputed to me as if it were mine), then how do you appropriately respond to be saved? Or do you have to respond at all, other than just believe that?

You respond by relying on Christ for your salvation. Not simply acknowledging these facts as true, but as reasons why you rely on Christ.