How do you know if someone really is a Christian?

[Lia]

Hi everyone,

This is gonna be quite long but please bear with me.

I have a very close male friend. Let's call him B. I know B inside and out pretty much. He claims to be a Christian, reads the bible (not really sure about the frequency and quality). He told me he read the whole bible once before. Sseems to know quite a lot from the bible too. We had discussion about God a couple times before...he knows about salvation and believes that he is saved.

He is a good person. Doesn't drink, doesn't smoke. He is discipline, hardworking, etc. But he's doing all these things just because he wants to be a good person (that's the impression that I have). A strong guy with strong principles.

The things that bother me, is that B doesn't make going to Church on Sunday a priority. I know there are some people who can't go to church because of different circumstances, but I know he can and he has the time, but many times he chose not to go because he has "other things" to do.

Not that I intend to judge him.. but it doesn't seem to me that he loves God and passionate about his faith. He doesn't put God as a center of His life. I asked him once if he can live without God...he said he can try, but it's gonna be kind of hard. Hmmmmm!!??

I've seen his responses many times in handling his problems - it is the same way the world handles theirs...weighing what's the best option and just go for it. No waiting on God. And we know from Romans 12:2, that we are not to live according to the pattern of this world, but to be transformed by the renewing of our mind. Then we will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will.

So, these things about him..make me question if he really is a Christian. I thought he has always been one, but lately I have just been thinking that he is probably not saved yet. He thought he is but he is actually not. What do you think? Is there any parameter to know if someone really is saved?

I care a lot about him.. I mean if he's really not saved, I better start praying about his salvation and share more about relationship with God.

Any opinions are appreciated. Thanks.

 

[whatseekye]

So, these things about him..make me question if he really is a Christian. I thought he has always been one, but lately I have just been thinking that he is probably not saved yet. He thought he is but he is actually not. What do you think? Is there any parameter to know if someone really is saved?

I care a lot about him.. I mean if he's really not saved, I better start praying about his salvation and share more about relationship with God.

Any opinions are appreciated. Thanks.

Good question. I am guessing that most sincere Christians wonder this from time to time because there are just so many carnal Christians around. Basically, I think you know the true Christians by the fruit they are bearing in their life. I tend to think that signs of good fruit are being less self-oriented and more other-oriented. What does it mean to be Christ-like? I think it means having less focus on your own needs and drives and becoming more interested in what God wants, and how we can serve others in love. I know that all Christians are not totally perfect until they go to heaven, perhaps, but we all need to realize that sanctification is a necessary thing, and is a result of an active, growing relationship with Jesus Christ. How can you know him and yet not be changed or made more loving? The book of James is good reading on this subject. I think that since there is a tendency for us to deceive ourselves, we shouldn't rest too comfortably in our salvation. We each need to do the work of examining ourselves to see if we truly are in the faith. I know that a person should have assurance in Jesus Christ to do all the work of justification, so we don't boast in earning our salvation, but at the same time, without any effort to follow Jesus, how can the Spirit work in us to sanctify us? We Christians reek of the flesh the most when we aren't focused on God and other people but are instead, thinking about me, myself and I all the time. You'd think we would have learned the lesson a long time ago that the self can do nothing to change itself, other than recognize God and follow him as closely as possible.

P.S. There are some who say that there is no such thing as a "carnal christian", so therefore, if a person is behaving in a conspicuously carnal manner, then they were never knew Him to begin with. But I have a softer viewpoint on this. I believe that in and of ourselves, we are so depraved that a person can come to faith and yet still do nothing with their faith. They think that if they profess belief, and sometimes read a little bible, they are "saved". I tend to think that God can use them and perhaps they will grow in their faith at some future point. It seems like this has to be the case because otherwise, heaven would be very empty, at least of the generations in the last 50 to hundred years.

The Wedding Feast parable is interesting for this topic:

Matthew 22


The Parable of the Wedding Banquet

1Jesus spoke to them again in parables, saying: 2"The kingdom of heaven is like a king who prepared a wedding banquet for his son. 3He sent his servants to those who had been invited to the banquet to tell them to come, but they refused to come.
4"Then he sent some more servants and said, 'Tell those who have been invited that I have prepared my dinner: My oxen and fattened cattle have been butchered, and everything is ready. Come to the wedding banquet.'
5"But they paid no attention and went off--one to his field, another to his business. 6The rest seized his servants, mistreated them and killed them. 7The king was enraged. He sent his army and destroyed those murderers and burned their city.
8"Then he said to his servants, 'The wedding banquet is ready, but those I invited did not deserve to come. 9Go to the street corners and invite to the banquet anyone you find.' 10So the servants went out into the streets and gathered all the people they could find, both good and bad, and the wedding hall was filled with guests.
11"But when the king came in to see the guests, he noticed a man there who was not wearing wedding clothes. 12'Friend,' he asked, 'how did you get in here without wedding clothes?' The man was speechless.
13"Then the king told the attendants, 'Tie him hand and foot, and throw him outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'
14"For many are invited, but few are chosen."

We are the street people, all gathered in indiscriminately, both good and bad, but then it seems to be necessary that we put on the wedding clothes.

 

[e8514]

I agree--we know Christians by thier fruits. That is somrthing that cannot be hidden.


God Bless. I will keep him in prayer.

 

[Endure2]

well,
i think that kind of situation happens more times than not in the body of Christ today.
people know what the bible says and know a little about the Lord, enough to be confident in a few things, namely that they are right with the Lord and not in danger of hell.

but those people dont have a real relationship with the holy spirit.

this problem surfaces when they do things like you named about your friend, making decisions souly upon their natural ability to judge and analyse in their minds, often choosing their own things over the Lord things, not having the fiery passion for the things God is passionate about.

its like having a 2nd and 3rd hand relationship with a person.
you want the benefits that person brings, but you dont neccesarilly want a thriving relationship with him, or have the same concerns that he has, or you arent really going to ask him about everything.

this is the way we become without a continual secret converse with the holyspirit and asking him to change us and create in us a clean heart and a right spirit.



God will show you many things about many people, by giving you feelings of peace or trouble in your spiritman. or hell simply speak to you and tell you things about them.

it isnt just that you can always look at the outward things they do, though sometimes you can becuase there are things that we can do that prove we are not saved.

the bible says the spirit of a man is the candle of the Lord.

or in other words, if God wants to bring light to an issue, like using a candle in a darkroom to bring light, he will speak to you in your spirit. or give you a sense in your spirit. thats why we often dont have words to say what we feel, but we feel an inner peace or an inner troubling about issues or things.
and thats the Lord leading you by your spirit.

though i feel i must warn you,
the things God will show you in your spirit are not always to be told to anyone else, but simply for you to pray for.
God can show a person something, and if that person goes and puts it on the 6 oclock news, that will the last thing God will ever show that person.

God wants us to be made right in diffrent issues by bringing things to light so they can be prayed for, but often not enough to see you or anyone else fall away from him completely. thats why people who feel its their duty to expose false preachers before as people as they can, are wrong.

pray about what God shows you, but be very hesitant about what you actually talk to people about, becuase people can be offended and fall away, and that wasnt what God wanted.

i hope that helps.

 

[Sharky]

Hey if you go to www.wayofthemaster.com

there is a preaching on true and false conversion that you can download in the audio section.

Basically a true christian is someone who produces the fruits peace, patience, love, kindness, self control, meekness, good works, repentance, temperance. I'll check up the fruits of the spirit for you.

 

[Sharky]

Hi everyone,

This is gonna be quite long but please bear with me.

I have a very close male friend. Let's call him B. I know B inside and out pretty much. He claims to be a Christian, reads the bible (not really sure about the frequency and quality). He told me he read the whole bible once before. Sseems to know quite a lot from the bible too. We had discussion about God a couple times before...he knows about salvation and believes that he is saved.

He is a good person. Doesn't drink, doesn't smoke. He is discipline, hardworking, etc. But he's doing all these things just because he wants to be a good person (that's the impression that I have). A strong guy with strong principles.

The things that bother me, is that B doesn't make going to Church on Sunday a priority. I know there are some people who can't go to church because of different circumstances, but I know he can and he has the time, but many times he chose not to go because he has "other things" to do.

Not that I intend to judge him.. but it doesn't seem to me that he loves God and passionate about his faith. He doesn't put God as a center of His life. I asked him once if he can live without God...he said he can try, but it's gonna be kind of hard. Hmmmmm!!??

I've seen his responses many times in handling his problems - it is the same way the world handles theirs...weighing what's the best option and just go for it. No waiting on God. And we know from Romans 12:2, that we are not to live according to the pattern of this world, but to be transformed by the renewing of our mind. Then we will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will.

So, these things about him..make me question if he really is a Christian. I thought he has always been one, but lately I have just been thinking that he is probably not saved yet. He thought he is but he is actually not. What do you think? Is there any parameter to know if someone really is saved?

I care a lot about him.. I mean if he's really not saved, I better start praying about his salvation and share more about relationship with God.

Any opinions are appreciated. Thanks.

I don't know your circumstances but i'm thinking that he's one of the people Jesus described as 'stony ground' hearers, this is my interpretation from what you describe it. You know the story of the seeds falling in 4 different grounds? Road, rocky, thorn and good soil. MATT 13:3

If he is false, you will see it soon. He'll fall away as time goes by, he will be casual about God's love and forgiveness. Which is exceedingly joyful for me because it's not small thing He done.

You got a pretty big heart to be concerned with his salvation. Personally, church is not the big requirement BUT it is a place of fellowship. A true christian will want to get into fellowship. Are you inviting him to church?

 

[Lia]

Are you inviting him to church?

Yes, I have been praying and inviting him to my church for more than a year now but he only comes out on special occassions. But he found a church close to where he lives, so he goes there on and off lately.

I talked to him last night and the Lord gave me the chance to bring this issue up and encourage him to start committing more to the Lord and going to church. Yes, I know church is not the #1 place to grow your faith but it will help. He said he is going to commit slowly and prioritize Sunday morning for church. We'll see how it goes. Please keep him in prayer.

Thanks for all the responses, everyone. It has been very informative/enlightening.

 

[Endure2]

Lia

i feel like i must tell or rather remind you, im sure you already know though...

that it isnt about whether or not the persons salvation was true or untrue in the beginning. it is about whether he has a healthy relationship with the holyspirit right now. a person can be genuinely saved and full of the holyghost, but if they give occasions to their flesh, if they do not walk in the spirit, if they do not stay close to the heart of God in prayer and in the word, if they do not daily put on the whole armor of God... they will grow cold, the fire of the Lord will burn low in them and they can fall away from the Lord.
Paul said the spirit of a man must be renewed day by day. it isnt determined by one experience with God and the quality of that experience.

 

[whatseekye]

Lia

i feel like i must tell or rather remind you, im sure you already know though...

that it isnt about whether or not the persons salvation was true or untrue in the beginning. it is about whether he has a healthy relationship with the holyspirit right now. a person can be genuinely saved and full of the holyghost, but if they give occasions to their flesh, if they do not walk in the spirit, if they do not stay close to the heart of God in prayer and in the word, if they do not daily put on the whole armor of God... they will grow cold, the fire of the Lord will burn low in them and they can fall away from the Lord.
Paul said the spirit of a man must be renewed day by day. it isnt determined by one experience with God and the quality of that experience.

This is an excellent point. I think it hits the nail on the head. When I replied to this thread, I think I had another situation in mind. This is probably much closer to the situation at hand. Thanks for saying it!

 

[Lia]

Yeah I agree... thanks for pointing this out Endure2. It's very easy to be like that in general if we keep sowing to the flesh and not live by the Spirit. I think this is what the bible defines as "lukewarm". It's more dangerous than even not knowing God at all, I heard/read it somewhere before.

Revelation 3: 15-16
I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! So, because you are lukewarm--neither hot nor cold--I am about to spit you out of my mouth.

 

[Endure2]

thankyou for your kind words,
Godbless, im glad i was some help to you.
i hope this situation gets better for you and your friend.

 

[Christi]

Hi everyone,

This is gonna be quite long but please bear with me.

I have a very close male friend. Let's call him B. I know B inside and out pretty much. He claims to be a Christian, reads the bible (not really sure about the frequency and quality). He told me he read the whole bible once before. Sseems to know quite a lot from the bible too. We had discussion about God a couple times before...he knows about salvation and believes that he is saved.

He is a good person. Doesn't drink, doesn't smoke. He is discipline, hardworking, etc. But he's doing all these things just because he wants to be a good person (that's the impression that I have). A strong guy with strong principles.

The things that bother me, is that B doesn't make going to Church on Sunday a priority. I know there are some people who can't go to church because of different circumstances, but I know he can and he has the time, but many times he chose not to go because he has "other things" to do.

Not that I intend to judge him.. but it doesn't seem to me that he loves God and passionate about his faith. He doesn't put God as a center of His life. I asked him once if he can live without God...he said he can try, but it's gonna be kind of hard. Hmmmmm!!??

I've seen his responses many times in handling his problems - it is the same way the world handles theirs...weighing what's the best option and just go for it. No waiting on God. And we know from Romans 12:2, that we are not to live according to the pattern of this world, but to be transformed by the renewing of our mind. Then we will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will.

So, these things about him..make me question if he really is a Christian. I thought he has always been one, but lately I have just been thinking that he is probably not saved yet. He thought he is but he is actually not. What do you think? Is there any parameter to know if someone really is saved?

I care a lot about him.. I mean if he's really not saved, I better start praying about his salvation and share more about relationship with God.

Any opinions are appreciated. Thanks.

Hi Lia, I'm just going to throw this out there, but my first thought when I read you're post was this:

I think he is a Christian, but we all tend to grow at different rates and intervals. Maybe he's a "baby"" Christian still, in his heart? It sounds encouraging that he's trying to follow God in many areas and loves God. You're concern for him is evident and maybe that's why God has placed you in his life? Maybe by your friendship and example you can show him how much more there is......and how satisfying his relationship with Christ can actually be. I believe that relationship comes first, then actions follow. The most powerful thing you can do for him is pray for and love him, I think.