How Can Molecules Think?

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 20, 2022

"In September 2015, a second meeting was held in Tucson, called The Final Transition Conference. Organized by consciousness researcher Stephan A. Schwartz, the purpose of the meeting was to explore the questions: What happens when we die, and what constitutes humane, decent care of the dying? The conference faculty was composed of therapists, clinicians, scholars, and researchers from the US and Europe, all of whom are involved in various ways in end-of-life care. It became clear that an exclusively materialist view of consciousness — the notion that consciousness is produced by the brain and is annihilated with physical death — cannot account for the rich, variegated experiences that surround the dying brain and body, and that a post-materialist science is required. A key feature of a post-materialist approach is that of nonlocal consciousness, in which consciousness is not considered to be localized or confined to specific points in space, such as the physical brain and body, nor to specific points in time, such as the present."

Nonlocal Consciousness - Pim van Lommel

AV1611VET · Sep 20, 2022

Akita Suggagaki said:
Homo sapiens?

Yup.

durangodawood · Sep 20, 2022

Neogaia777 said:
@durangodawood

In short, or the very, very short answer is: "God the Father's good pleasure", etc, which is why any of us (or this) are (is) even here, etc, including God the Son and God the Spirit, etc, but there is also very much more to it than just that also, etc, especially when it comes down to the rest of us not the Father, etc...

Want to hear it, etc...?

God Bless!

What I dont understand is how a being of surpassing creativity could get pleasure out of seeing a machine wind down to a predetermined end. Its like me watching a music box.

Neogaia777 · Sep 20, 2022

Neogaia777 said:
@durangodawood

In short, or the very, very short answer is: "God the Father's good pleasure", etc, which is why any of us (or this) are (is) even here, etc, including God the Son and God the Spirit, etc, but there is also very much more to it than just that also, etc, especially when it comes down to the rest of us not the Father, etc...

Want to hear it, etc...?

God Bless!

@durangodawood

It pleased the Father to be able to make beings and give rise to a reality where those beings could, reveal Him in the case of two, and where some others could become like Him or Them (the other Two who would also become like Him, etc) and did this through great hardships or difficulty or by being mistreated by some others (who will not be going beyond this life) in order to learn a very valuable lesson before being able to go beyond this life and into the realm of Heaven or the afterlife, etc...

But that is still just only still mainly about the Father only, etc...

Want to hear any more, etc...?

God Bless!

Neogaia777 · Sep 20, 2022

durangodawood said:
What I dont understand is how a being of surpassing creativity could get pleasure out of seeing a machine wind down to a predetermined end. Its like me watching a music box.

His pleasure from it comes when those who are destined to go beyond this life, finally get to go beyond this life, and when His primary Two have finally become One with Him finally after finally revealing Him to those other ones getting to go beyond this life, etc...

He is a very, very patient man/being, etc...

God Bless!

Neogaia777 · Sep 20, 2022

durangodawood said:
What I dont understand is how a being of surpassing creativity could get pleasure out of seeing a machine wind down to a predetermined end. Its like me watching a music box.

You don't enjoy the music, etc...?

Or the completed already work of art...?

Like a painting maybe...?

Do you not hang it up in your house and admire it sometimes, etc...?

God Bless!

durangodawood · Sep 20, 2022

Neogaia777 said:
You don't enjoy the music, etc...?

God Bless!

Actually I much prefer to hear the music made by other genuinely creative beings than the recorded music Ive made. I say this as a musician. In fact Id go off my rocker having to listen to just my own recordings.

Astrid · Sep 20, 2022

Akita Suggagaki said:
Do you really think such a reductionist view can adequately account for consciousness? For your consideration:

"The modern scientific worldview is predominantly predicated on assumptions that are closely associated with classical physics. Materialism—the idea that matter is the only reality—is one of these assumptions. A related assumption is reductionism, the notion that complex things can be understood by reducing them to the interactions of their parts, or to simpler or more fundamental things such as tiny material particles.

"During the 19th century, these assumptions narrowed, turned into dogmas, and coalesced into an ideological belief system that came to be known as "scientific materialism." This belief system implies that the mind is nothing but the physical activity of the brain. The ideology of scientific materialism became dominant in academia during the 20th century. So dominant that a majority of scientists started to believe that it was based on established empirical evidence, and represented the only rational view of the world.

"At the end of the nineteenth century, physicists discovered empirical phenomena that could not be explained by classical physics. This led to the development, during the 1920s and early 1930s, of a revolutionary new branch of physics called quantum mechanics (QM). QM has questioned the material foundations of the world by showing that atoms and subatomic particles are not really solid objects—they do not exist with certainty at definite spatial locations and definite times. Most importantly, QM explicitly introduced the mind into its basic conceptual structure since it was found that particles being observed and the observer—the physicist and the method used for observation—are linked. According to one interpretation of QM, this phenomenon implies that the consciousness of the observer is vital to the existence of the physical events being observed, and that mental events can affect the physical world. The results of recent experiments support this interpretation. These results suggest that the physical world is no longer the primary or sole component of reality, and that it cannot be fully understood without making reference to the mind.

"The shift from materialist science to post-materialist science may be of vital importance to the evolution of the human civilization. It may be even more pivotal than the transition from geocentrism to heliocentrism."

The Manifesto for a Post-Materialist Science - OpenSciences.org

Terrif. A screed from a woo woo site

Neogaia777 · Sep 20, 2022

durangodawood said:
Actually I much prefer to hear the music made by other genuinely creative beings than the recorded music Ive made. I say this as a musician. In fact Id go off my rocker having to listen to just my own recordings.

Well, who is supposed to make or create for Him, etc...?

And I think the difference between good musicians, or great musicians (no offense) is all of their passion in getting all caught up in making it or producing it (their own) for others to be a part of and/or enjoy or get into and/or hear, etc...

For some it is (or becomes) their entire life, etc...

And they either love it or hate it in the end, but God loves it, and loves His though, etc...

God Bless!

Neogaia777 · Sep 20, 2022

Neogaia777 said:
Well, who is supposed to make or create for Him, etc...?

And I think the difference between good musicians, or great musicians (no offense) is all of their passion in getting all caught up in making it or producing it (their own) for others to be a part of and/or enjoy or get into and/or hear, etc...

For some it is (or becomes) their entire life, etc...

And they either love it or hate it in the end, but God loves it, and loves His though, etc...

God Bless!

You gotta admit that these illustrations though, while sometimes useful to us, are almost completely inadequate when it comes to God though, etc...

Painting, music, etc, etc, etc...

I do believe He is an artist though, etc...

And that this, is only just one of His great works of art though, etc...

God Bless!

Hans Blaster · Sep 20, 2022

Akita Suggagaki said:
"At the end of the nineteenth century, physicists discovered empirical phenomena that could not be explained by classical physics. This led to the development, during the 1920s and early 1930s, of a revolutionary new branch of physics called quantum mechanics (QM). QM has questioned the material foundations of the world by showing that atoms and subatomic particles are not really solid objects—they do not exist with certainty at definite spatial locations and definite times. Most importantly, QM explicitly introduced the mind into its basic conceptual structure since it was found that particles being observed and the observer—the physicist and the method used for observation—are linked. According to one interpretation of QM, this phenomenon implies that the consciousness of the observer is vital to the existence of the physical events being observed, and that mental events can affect the physical world. The results of recent experiments support this interpretation. These results suggest that the physical world is no longer the primary or sole component of reality, and that it cannot be fully understood without making reference to the mind.

"The shift from materialist science to post-materialist science may be of vital importance to the evolution of the human civilization. It may be even more pivotal than the transition from geocentrism to heliocentrism."

The Manifesto for a Post-Materialist Science - OpenSciences.org

Sorry you fell for this post-modernist, New Age, woo, twaddle from people who don't understand QM.

QM isn't "post-materialist". It just characterizes matter differently than some shrunken, microscopic version of the macroscopic world (particles as hard spheres, etc.)

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 20, 2022

Hans Blaster said:
It just characterizes matter differently than some shrunken, microscopic version of the macroscopic world (particles as hard spheres, etc.)

How do you characterize "matter"?

durangodawood · Sep 20, 2022

Neogaia777 said:
Well, who is supposed to make or create for Him, etc...?....

Creative beings who can surprise Him.

Astrid · Sep 20, 2022

Akita Suggagaki said:
How do you characterize "matter"?

Maybe before making further demands of others, try making some
on yourself?
That you did not quickly see that you are quoting from
a woo woos ite is a clear indication of a deep failing of i
ntellectual rigour on your part.
Nobody can correct that for you.

Neogaia777 · Sep 20, 2022

durangodawood said:
Creative beings who can surprise Him.

Did you read what I linked...?

Because I think you might need to go back and re-read it again...?

God the Father cannot be surprised, because there is nothing He does not already know fully from the beginning, etc, but God the Son, and God the Spirit (God in the OT) can sometimes be surprised though, sometimes anyway, etc...

God Bless!

Astrid · Sep 20, 2022

durangodawood said:
Creative beings who can surprise Him.

What could be more fantastically boring than knowing
absolutely everything that ever did or will happen.

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 20, 2022

Estrid said:
Maybe before making further demands of others, try making some
on yourself?
That you did not quickly see that you are quoting from
a woo woos ite is a clear indication of a deep failing of i
ntellectual rigour on your part.
Nobody can correct that for you.

"woo"? Easy thoughtless discount.

AV1611VET · Sep 20, 2022

durangodawood said:
What I dont understand is how a being of surpassing creativity could get pleasure out of seeing a machine wind down to a predetermined end.

You'd think He would intervene before His creation reaches maximum entropy, wouldn't you?

Neogaia777 · Sep 20, 2022

Estrid said:
What could be more fantastically boring than knowing
absolutely everything that ever did or will happen.

There may or may not be a free will in the afterlife, that part I can't know right now, etc...

Or there might be a "level" of afterlife where it might be possible, or that beyond that point maybe even God the Father does not know after that maybe, etc...?

But that would be so very, very, very far down the road that it is very, very much highly, highly theoretical right now, and is more than I am probably even able to speak of or about, even in or from the immediate life in the afterlife hereafter right now, etc...

God Bless!

durangodawood · Sep 20, 2022

Estrid said:
What could be more fantastically boring than knowing
absolutely everything that ever did or will happen.

The "Rings of Power" show?

How Can Molecules Think?

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