Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Medical procedures should be seen as such. It is folly to try addressing specific medical and political agendas by justifying them “scripturally”.Remember, the OP specifically request that a Christian biblically defends abortion. Do you have any scriptural justification for abortion. I provided a few verses against it in the OP. Unless you can biblically support abortion, I can only conclude that pro-abortion is an unbiblical position that a Christian ought not have. The floor is yours.
Such as?Is this how you operate on the forums? You haven’t answered a single question I’ve asked.
Exactly! GOD GRANTED, not woman decided.God granted
The Old Testament Law says that whatever harm you cause to an unborn child, you will receive the same fate. Hence, the Old Testament Law prescribed the death penalty for someone who caused the death of a baby in the womb in the same way as someone committing murder would have been put to death. Clearly indicating that the life of an unborn child is just as valuable as any other human life.
“If people are fighting and hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise." (Exodus 21:22-25)
This passage clearly shows that the punishment for killing an unborn child is death ("life for life") and that the life of the unborn child is just as precious as any other human life. Furthermore, this passage demonstrates that the unborn child has rights that are deserving of justice in the event that its health is threatened. Now, to be clear, I am not calling for the execution of women because "let he who is without sin cast the first stone." However, this is clearly seen as a sinful act that a Christian ought not support.I don’t support abortion for birth control but I don’t see Biblical justification to criminalize first term abortions.
Here are a number of questions you’ve either dodged or outright ignored.Such as?
Can you clarify what you mean? Are you saying that killing an innocent person created in the image of God is the lesser evil?
But surely as a Christian you believe that all humans are created in the image of God and possess inherent moral worth and value, right?
There are two victims in a rape where a woman becomes pregnant. The mother and the unwanted child. Do you think killing the unborn child is an appropriate and morally sound response?
Is there an alternative position that you can support other than “life begins at conception”?
Why do you draw the line at first trimester? A human is a human regardless of their level of development, why do you discriminate against a human like this?I don’t support abortion for birth control but I don’t see Biblical justification to criminalize first term abortions.
God granted you the right to pass a death sentence on a Mother having pregnancy complications? Nice that God has given you such authority.Exactly! GOD GRANTED, not woman decided.
We don’t agree on the human is a human thing. The law requires a definition. That’s mine based on fetal viability. When God terminates pregnancy it’s mostly in the first trimester.Why do you draw the line at first trimester? A human is a human regardless of their level of development, why do you discriminate against a human like this?
Nice Strawman. Point the post in which I said "God granted me or anyone the right to pass a death sentence on a Mother having pregnancy complications." Killing is simply taking life. Murder is taking life without cause or authority. God is the only being who creates life. Thus, God is the only being who can take life or give that authority to others. We see this authority being given in times of War, self defense, or as a result of capital punishment by those in authority to administer such punishments. God gave no authority to anyone to kill an innocent human life in the womb because the woman chose not to be a mother. Thus, abortion is murder. In cases in which the life of the mother is at risk and a C Section is unable to mitigate that risk (which hardly ever happens), God has already decided that either the mother or child will die. Thus, it wouldn't be murder to have a abortion in such cases because the baby has already received a death sentence from God. Not the mother.God granted you the right to pass a death sentence on a Mother having pregnancy complications? Nice that God has given you such authority.
I missed the part in the Bible where God authorized the invasion of Iraq.Nice Strawman. Killing is simply taking life. Murder is taking life without cause or authority. God is the only being who creates life. Thus, God is the only being who can take life or give that authority to others. We see this authority being given in times of War, self defense, or as a result of capital punishment by those in authority to administer such punishments. God gave no authority to anyone to kill an innocent human life in the womb because the woman chose not to be a mother. Thus, abortion is murder.
They had abortions in the Old Testament, (Num. 5:21,22)I first wanted to clarify upfront that I am in absolutely no way challenging that someone who is pro-choice isn't a Christian. My question is more centered around their logic and justification in supporting abortion. With so much scripture that condemns abortion, how can a Christian hold true to the Word of God and support abortion at the same time? It seems as though you would have to throw the word of God out the window to justify it. Please explain to me why I am wrong for having this point of view? I also want to clarify that I want to keep this discussion centered around the biblical justification. This is not a discussion about women's rights (unless you can show me in the Bible where woman have the right to an abortion). I also don't want to hear emotional responses or assertions without any biblical support or justification. I want to keep this centered around biblical truths in order to explain to me why pro-choice Christians are not disregarding the Word of God. Here are some examples of blatantly pro-life (anti-abortion) scripture.
God knew us before He formed us in the womb.
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you,
before you were born I set you apart;
I appointed you as a prophet to the nations. (Jeremiah 1:5)
God was an active role in our creation and formation in the womb.
For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother’s womb.
14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.
15 My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place,
when I was woven together in the depths of the earth.
16 Your eyes saw my unformed body;
all the days ordained for me were written in your book
before one of them came to be.
17 How precious to me are your thoughts, God!
How vast is the sum of them!
18 Were I to count them,
they would outnumber the grains of sand—
when I awake, I am still with you. (Psalm 139:13-16)
The Old Testament Law says that whatever harm you cause to an unborn child, you will receive the same fate. Hence, the Old Testament Law prescribed the death penalty for someone who caused the death of a baby in the womb in the same way as someone committing murder would have been put to death. Clearly indicating that the life of an unborn child is just as valuable as any other human life.
“If people are fighting and hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise." (Exodus 21:22-25)
Biologically we know that a new human being comes into existence at fertilization and begins about a 25 year developmental period. Yet at no point in their development are they not a human being.We don’t agree on the human is a human thing. The law requires a definition. That’s mine based on fetal viability. When God terminates pregnancy it’s mostly in the first trimester.
Next?
They had lots of stuff in the OT you don’t hear in Sunday School.They had abortions in the Old Testament, (Num. 5:21,22)
That wasn't an abortion. That was a jealousy offering. Some propose that Numbers 5:11-31 refers to God causing an abortion. The 2011 edition of the NIV mistakenly states that the drink will cause miscarriage in Numbers 5:21-22, 27. However, this is not what the passage is talking about. Pregnancy is nowhere mentioned, or even hinted at, in the text. The only thing that even sounds like pregnancy is the guilty wife’s stomach becoming bloated, but even in that instance, it has nothing to do with pregnancy. Further, the passage does not say that drinking the concoction would cause an abortion/miscarriage. While drinking a poisonous mixture of ingredients could very well cause a miscarriage, that is not what this text is speaking of.They had abortions in the Old Testament, (Num. 5:21,22)
An embryo is not a human being. Even with our advanced technology, a fetus is not viable at thirteen weeks. Sorry to give you that bad news.Biologically we know that a new human being comes into existence at fertilization and begins about a 25 year developmental period. Yet at no point in their development are they not a human being.
On what scientific foundation are you arguing for the notion that before viability there is not a human being in the womb? It’s certainly not science or Scripture. Can you explain yourself?
Numbers 5 wasn't taking about abortions. If a man became jealous and suspected his wife of having an affair, this ceremony was performed so that the man wouldn't continue in his jealousy. Of course, if the woman was found guilty, a bloated belly is the last of her concerns because she would be stoned to death.They had lots of stuff in the OT you don’t hear in Sunday School.
WWJD?Numbers 5 wasn't taking about abortions. If a man became jealous and suspected his wife of having an affair, this ceremony was performed so that the man wouldn't continue in his jealousy. Of course, if the woman was found guilty, a bloated belly is the last of her concerns because she would be stoned to death.
Like the conquest of Canaan, they were ordered to kill every man, woman and xhild.They had lots of stuff in the OT you don’t hear in Sunday School.
What is it if not a human being? What is the basis for this assertion ? It’s certainly not the mainstream scientific position.An embryo is not a human being. Even with our advanced technology, a fetus is not viable at thirteen weeks. Sorry to give you that bad news
A fertilized egg is a human being? Learn that in Sunday school science?What is it if not a human being? What is the basis for this assertion ? It’s certainly not the mainstream scientific position.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?