Homosexuality is wrong....so you fail

keith99 · Sep 25, 2009

levi501 said:
Great point... why hasn't someone posted this master list of sins?

If I had a copy I would. I have seen references to such, so I think it does exist. I remember because it was so funny, a character in a science fiction work was asked their favorite commandment. They replied number 234 (or somewhere close to it) because of the funny connotations.

When you make camp select a place where you will relieve yourselfs and dig latrines, because the Lord walks in your camp. Then something about the consequences if you did not and the Lord ends up with the same problem us dog owners have.

MoonLancer · Sep 25, 2009

So Christians want to make homosexual marriage illegal because homosexuality is a sin right? If its impossible to not sin, why bother. Just ask for forgiveness and keep sinning. I mean the sin is going to happen anyway.

I think its becuse they are bigots. and useing christainty as a shield. If they keep using it as a shield, it will break.

Belk · Sep 25, 2009

BlackSabb said:
Firstly, the Bible is not supposed to be read like a legal document. With an exhaustive list of do's and dont's. Sure, there are commandments of God. But the Bible is supposed to be followed as an instruction guide of living your life in accordance with God and his Son, Jesus. If you love God and accept Jesus as the Son of God and Saviour of mankind, you'll naturally be striving to live in accordance to God-in every aspect of your life, not just "laws" as you put it. Eg, living in accordance to God's will for your life.

It's not supposed to be some sort of heavenly checklist that you tick off. That's not loving God and following Jesus-that's mechanical obeying with no heart motive. The Bible is not supposed to be legalistic. You don't "not steal" merely because that's what it says in the Bible. Rather, you know that God hates theft and as you desire to serve him, you choose to follow his precepts and therefore you don't steal. Same results in both cases, but different motivation and heart attitudes.

And yes, there are dire consequences. There are consequences in the natural, such as STD's by being promiscous. Or mental/physical disorders by engaging in illicit drugs. And there are other consequences. Namely not receiving eternal life that Jesus promises.

But without an exhaustive list, how can you be sure that you are not living a willfully sinful lifestyle the same as you say homosexuals are? If, as you say here, the idea is to follow Gods commandments to the best of your ability why are homosexuals condemned if they truly believe they are not being sinful? The only way out of this I see is if you claim that they actually know that they are sinning, but suppress that in order to sacrifice eternal life for worldly pleasure.

MoonLancer · Sep 25, 2009

ak dp

conchobarm · Sep 25, 2009

lawtonfogle said:
My major annoyance with the pro-GLBT group is how they act like their oppressors to other sexual attractions.

For example. You get mad at someone for assuming you are a bad person based on the fact you are attracted to the same sex. I am betting (and since it is a bet, I could be wrong this time, but on average I am not) that you think people who are attracted to S/M, or more likely sexual sadism to the point of rape (but who refrain from actually doing it to anyone), or (just about the best example) those who are attracted to children, are bad people because of no other reason than their attraction. And you may be an exception, and be able to look past that, but most pro-GLBT people I encounter (and considering I am a member for GSA, that is a good deal of people) cannot.

Yes, this is a bit off topic...

That's true, unfortunately. I figure if it's legal, and everyone involved is a consenting adult, it really doesn't matter what happens in the bedroom.

lawtonfogle said:
Would you agree with the following statement?

If a man is in a polygamous (multiple men or women or both) relationship, he respect all his partners, and he's a faithful Christian, I don't think there'd be any consequences more harmful than less rewards in the afterlife.

Yes. If everyone involved is a consenting adult, who cares?

Here's a question: If a gay couple had a child(ren), and they began attending church, got baptised/saved/whatever and wanted to do God's will, should they separate?

Thistlethorn · Sep 25, 2009

lawtonfogle said:
My major annoyance with the pro-GLBT group is how they act like their oppressors to other sexual attractions.

For example. You get mad at someone for assuming you are a bad person based on the fact you are attracted to the same sex. I am betting (and since it is a bet, I could be wrong this time, but on average I am not) that you think people who are attracted to S/M, or more likely sexual sadism to the point of rape (but who refrain from actually doing it to anyone), or (just about the best example) those who are attracted to children, are bad people because of no other reason than their attraction. And you may be an exception, and be able to look past that, but most pro-GLBT people I encounter (and considering I am a member for GSA, that is a good deal of people) cannot.

Yes, this is a bit off topic...

There is a big difference between homosexuality and heterosexuality and aggressive sexual orientations such as pedophilia and uncontrolled sexual sadism. Homosexuality and heterosexuality are practiced by two (or more) consenting people. Pedophilia and uncontrolled sexual sadism has a victim.

The controlled form of sexual sadism is perfectly in line with society's norms and morals. It's a role played situation between consensual parties. That's the thing that matters: Consent. With it, it's ok, as long as no laws are broken in the process. Without it, it's not ok.

ArgentBear · Sep 25, 2009

FaithInChrist324 said:
Ok- so this is to all of you homosexuals out there that claim to be "Christians" and "Believers in the Holy Spirit" <staff edit>. You know what our God says in the Bible about what he thinks about homosexual behavior. You know that he doesn't tolerate this abomination. <staff edit> But to those of you who are straight- you just keep doing what you're doing- live for the Lord!

Ok- so this is to all of you shrimp eaters out there that claim to be "Christians" and "Believers in the Holy Spirit" <staff edit>. You know what our God says in the Bible about what he thinks about eating shellfish. You know that he doesn't tolerate this abomination. <staff edit> But to those of you who are vegetarians- you just keep doing what you're doing- live for the Lord!

ArgentBear · Sep 25, 2009

BlackSabb said:
Well, for Christians, the "master list" as you put it, is in the Bible. However, for many people, their urges, desires etc contradict what Biblical teachings and therefore there is the attempt to "interpret" Biblical teachings in light of that.

The urge to eat shellfish
The urge to set slaves free
The desire to shave
The urge to not kill non-virgins on their wedding night
The desire to wear clothes made of mixed fabrics
The urge to wear gold jewelry

ArgentBear · Sep 25, 2009

Verv said:
Yes, and part of our work as Christians is to work towards avoiding sin that we could fall into in the future.

However, as Black Sab said, the Bible is not inherently a legalistic document meant to condemn us to hell but rather we are supposed to roll with the punches and seek to save ourselves from hell through living by the word of God.

Yet it is used as a legalistic document to attack and condemn gays and lesbians all the time

wanderingone · Sep 25, 2009

FaithInChrist324 said:
Ok- so this is to all of you homosexuals out there that claim to be "Christians" and "Believers in the Holy Spirit" <staff edit>. You know what our God says in the Bible about what he thinks about homosexual behavior. You know that he doesn't tolerate this abomination. <staff edit> But to those of you who are straight- you just keep doing what you're doing- live for the Lord!

Thanks for sharing your opinion on what God tolerates and doesn't tolerate... just remember you just told a bunch of straight people to keep on doing what they're doing... as if what they're doing might not be as sinful as you imagine same sex relationships to be... As long as you're straight you can sleep with whoever you want, whenever you want right, fail to give up all your material goods to follow Christ, fail to love your neighbor as you love yourself, get divorced, kill or maim a few people.. but it's okay as long as you're straight?

(oh that's not what you meant??? Well then be careful what message you deliver as you babble on about straight people and who they should keep doing what they're doing....)

lawtonfogle · Sep 26, 2009

conchobarm said:
That's true, unfortunately. I figure if it's legal, and everyone involved is a consenting adult, it really doesn't matter what happens in the bedroom.

What happens when the desire does not involve consenting adults (such a exhibitionist who like to show themselves nude to non-consenting adults)? Lets just assume they are mature enough to not act on these desires, but does the mere fact they have them make them as a person any worse?

Yes. If everyone involved is a consenting adult, who cares?

Good then, your views are consistent.

Here's a question: If a gay couple had a child(ren), and they began attending church, got baptised/saved/whatever and wanted to do God's will, should they separate?

Ask the same thing of a couple where the husband/wife comes from a previous no fault divorce.

lawtonfogle · Sep 26, 2009

Thistlethorn said:
There is a big difference between homosexuality and heterosexuality and aggressive sexual orientations such as pedophilia and uncontrolled sexual sadism. Homosexuality and heterosexuality are practiced by two (or more) consenting people. Pedophilia and uncontrolled sexual sadism has a victim.

Not when it isn't acted upon. But see, there you go. A similar attitude as the one you are claiming is so oppressive.

Thistlethorn · Sep 26, 2009

lawtonfogle said:
Not when it isn't acted upon. But see, there you go. A similar attitude as the one you are claiming is so oppressive.

How is the attitude similar in any way?

Supreme · Sep 26, 2009

Is this thread a joke? Am I missing the punchline?

For all the homosexual Christians out there having to put up with discrimination like this from your narrow minded brothers; my prayers are with you.

Steezie · Sep 26, 2009

Supreme said:
Is this thread a joke? Am I missing the punchline?

For all the homosexual Christians out there having to put up with discrimination like this from your narrow minded brothers; my prayers are with you.

And see when I see this, I think that, considering what Jesus said in the bible, this is the kind of mentality he'd probably have agreed with. He doesnt strike me as a terribly uptight dude.

Alunyel · Sep 26, 2009

Religious homophobia, like any other type of homophobia, is simply because the homophobes in question are arrogant, narrow minded bigots.

It's simple enough to understand.

Chazemataz · Sep 26, 2009

FaithInChrist324 said:
Ok- so this is to all of you homosexuals out there that claim to be "Christians" and "Believers in the Holy Spirit" <staff edit>. You know what our God says in the Bible about what he thinks about homosexual behavior. You know that he doesn't tolerate this abomination. <staff edit> But to those of you who are straight- you just keep doing what you're doing- live for the Lord!

Some people don't think exactly like I do

and this makes me ANGRRRRRYYYYY ragghhH!!!

Not when it isn't acted upon. But see, there you go. A similar attitude as the one you are claiming is so oppressive.

How many pedos and sadists do you know?
You're arguing hypotheticals and going through mental hurdles.

There are millions of out GLBT people in America. Something like 40% of the population supports them and that number is steadily growing. They are legally allowed to act on their homosexual urges, and in some areas are allowed to get married.

Pedophiles and sadists are not allowed to act on those urges.

Society evolves, and changes. If at one point in time pedophilia is accepted and is legal, then we can have this conversation.

It just sort of gets on my nerves, that whole "What about my right to discriminate? You're discriminating against me by not allowing me to discriminate". It's a mental loophole and you could go around and around and around until you get to "You're discriminating against people who discriminate against me for discriminating against them against discriminating against this certain discriminatory group".

Think however you want, just don't shove it down other's throats. That goes for anyone who is, say, necking in the pews of your church to shove their sexuality on you. That's highly innapropriate, but that hasn't really happened, has it? It's more often historically and currently churches saying "Nope, you can't get married because it disagrees with our religious convictions", not "Sorry, guys, you can't practice your religion because it disagrees with our love lives".

Therefore, they are the ones most often discriminating against others in the legal sector, not the other way around.

lawtonfogle · Sep 26, 2009

Thistlethorn said:
How is the attitude similar in any way?

You are mixing up the attraction and the action, and then condemning the attraction based on the action. Basically what many if not most Christians do in regards to homosexuals.

TeutonKnight · Sep 26, 2009

FaithInChrist324 said:
You know what our God says in the Bible about what he thinks about homosexual behavior.

Or is it what man has said God has said?

Thistlethorn · Sep 26, 2009

lawtonfogle said:
You are mixing up the attraction and the action, and then condemning the attraction based on the action. Basically what many if not most Christians do in regards to homosexuals.

No, I'm not. I clearly differentiated between "aggressive" sadism and "passive" sadism. It's never the feeling itself that is wrong, and always the action. In the case of sadism and pedophilia because of the victim. There is no victim in homosexuality. Consent. That's what's important.

Homosexuality is wrong....so you fail

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