Help Greek scholars

[DeaconDean]

Trying to understand Greek. Could someone explain to me how:

"oti ouV proegnw, kai prowrisen summorfouV thV eikonoV tou uiou autou, eiV to einai auton prwtotokon en polloiV adelfoiV:"

-Romans 8:29 (GK)​

"oti ouV" is translated "For whom" when "oti" is a conjunction that means: that, because, seeing that, since. And "ouV" - before a consanant (ou), ouk before a vowel w/smooth breathing mark, and (ouc) before a vowel w/rough breathing mark, adverb, of negation, no, not. acc. pl. sg. m. realitive pronoun (Mk. 2:26)

Should this not read: "oti ouV" - that not, that no, because not, because no, seeing that not, seeing that no, since not, since no. So why is it "For whom," and not one of these other combinations?

Could not the first three words be translated "Because he did forsee not,"? Since ouV is in the accusative case, and the accusative case receives the action of the verb, wouldn't ouV follow proegnw because proegnw is a verb, and is in the third person, singular, aorist, active indicative?

If I hadnt said it yet, thank you for your help. If you cannot see the text, here is a link:http://www.greekbible.com/index.php Romans 8:29 (the first two words)

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[DeaconDean]

By the way, I am not using Strong's Concordance. I have The New Analytical Greek Lexicon. By Wesley J. Perschbacher. Hendrickson Publishers.

"oti ouV proegnw, kai prowrisen summorfouV thV eikonoV tou uiou autou, eiV to einai auton prwtotokon en polloiV adelfoiV:" -Rom. 8:29

What I have is this tentative roughly translation:

"Because he (has/did/hath) foreseen not, and/likewise he (has/did/hath) predestinated conformed of the image of the Son of Him, for Him to be First-born of many brothers." -Rom. 8:29

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Nazaroo]

First of all, ouV doesn't mean 'not'. This is not some form of the negative particle. Its a different word altogether.

You have mis-identified the word you are trying to translate.


Try looking in BAG under,

ouV, wtoV, to on about page 600.

for idiomatic examples of the usage of this word.

In this case, actually Thayer's lexicon is probably more informative for a beginner:

look there on page 465 under,


ouV, Gen. wtoV, plur. wta, dat. wsin, to, [cf. Latin, auris, ausculto, audio, etc.; akin to aiw, aisqanomai ]

 

[DeaconDean]

The lexicon I have has some 23 different parsings for ou, with this being the root. I have been learning from "New Testament Greek For Beginners" By:J. Gresham Machen. I have a Hebrew/Greek Interlinear Bible and The New Anaylitcal Greek Lexicon. That is why I say ouV has its root in ou. Lexicon number: 3739

Thanks

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[TheGMan]

It's still not from ou.

Here's the relevant entry in Liddell & Scott

 

[DeaconDean]

Thanks for the link. I think I also will try looking it up in my Kittel's Theological Dictionary of the New Testament.

Thanks for all your input guys.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Nazaroo]

Actually I think your Liddle & Scott link is off:

the correct entry in LS is here:

Liddle & Scott (Persius Onlinehttp://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext?doc=Perseus:text:1999.04.0057:entry=#76029) for ouV

 

[TheGMan]

Sorry it was. But 'V' is a very odd character with which to transliterate a sigma.

 

[DeaconDean]

So "ouV" would be translated who, whom, whosoever, etc. just as the Strong's has it?

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Beasley]

'ous' is the masculine, accusative plural of the relative pronoun 'os - hos. See 'Basics of Biblical Greek' by Mounce.

 

[DeaconDean]

I have "New Testament Greek For Beginners" By:J. Gresham Machen

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Nazaroo]

'ous' is the masculine, accusative plural of the relative pronoun 'os - hos. See 'Basics of Biblical Greek' by Mounce.

I think this book (or 4 chapters of it) is online free too:


http://www.teknia.com/index.php?page=bbgtextbook


In chapter 10 (pg 82) in the .pdf file, he actually gives the declensions (word endings) in a chart that mimicks the declension for 'os'.


An online printable chart for this word can be downloaded in pdf format here;


THE CHART YOU NEED <--CLICK HERE!

And here is another link to some grammatical helps:




http://www.biblicalgreek.org/grammar/#pronouns

 

[Beasley]

Thanks for the links. I like Perseus also.

 

[DeaconDean]

One more question. Is there any place where one can download for free a Koine Greek font for typing in MSWord?

Thanks,

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Nazaroo]

Here are some useful fonts that are mapped to the SYMBOL set etc.

http://ca-design.awardspace.com/NEWFONTS/TestFont2.htm

http://ca-design.awardspace.com/NEWFONTS/TestFont1.htm

The two pages are similar but some chars might not show up on your browser depending upon various factors. The TestFont2.htm page allows dowloads of the three fonts I have created. Just click on the links.
I started a thread a while back on this, you might look for back-threads on this topic, which will give a smorgasbord of links.

They can be used with MSword97 and the Windows font system.