Hating on Chickfila...Why??

Grace51 · Oct 7, 2012

Bethesda said:
neither do I - but the point I was making that, whilst I accept that many who say hate the sin not the sinner are sincere, I think that for a not insignificant number of Christians there is an underlying self righteous prejudice against the people too that is not too different to the homophobia of many non-Christians. We've seen in history how otherwise Godly people have been in situations where their prejudices show - Luther for example on the Jews (as said my personal difficult issue is dealing with people who are hard core racists) - of course thats because we are all works in progress as far as holiness etc is concerned. Such attitudes are not anyway confined to Christians, viz all the left/radical or what you will types who claim to love humanity but seem to have a great deal of difficulty loving their individual fellow citizens if they do not have the same enlightened views they have - my personal pet peeve being anyone who refers to other human beings as 'sheeple' - patronisingly arrogant or what. Reading Matthew 11. 18-19 the other day brought me back again to the point that Jesus went to where people were (resulting in him being called a friend of publicans and sinners by the religious folk and the authorities) rather than standing off from people and preaching at them without engaging with them as people - that doesn't of course mean he condoned certain behaviour (despite the attempts of people to imply - as they would today - that even just being there does)
Finally just as the Christian community is not a single body with a single voice, I think we have to be careful not to say 'the gay community do this or that' as that takes us back from dealing with human beings to entities and its much easier to characterise and stereotype entities (as people do re Radical Islam) - as there are of course gay people of all political and social persuasions and views - including to tie back into my earlier point, gay racists! What we often hear is the view point of particularly vocal groups.

yes i agree, i think you absolutely right that all Christians are work in progress, incl myself.

and yes, i can be quite vocal in the way i voice my stance

i guess for me the issue is while accept the fact Christians will always have prejudices and they will always hate the sinners. the matter really come down to whether or not they are letting that hate cross into any behaviors that hurt those "sinners"

you know, alot people probably surprised to hear this, esp those users i have having "heated" discussions. but i guess i can accept the fact people will always have weaknesses. As long as they acknowlege them and work on them, or even if they dont acknowledge them or think their thinking is wrong is fine by me. but when they started to express opinions to could influence others to adopt their views or worse still, encourage hurtful behaviors towards those sinners, that when i feel as a Christians, i have obligation to say something.

your point on not refering to them as a entity is a good one.

i used the term collectively because often those slanderous accusations are aiming at them collectively. Hence that is how i address them in response.

and yes, thanks heavens not all Christians are affiliated with that "hate" group focus on the families.

i have actually came across 1 christian user so far who realize focus on the family is an extreme Christian group.

and another, thankfully, after i confronted him with evidence, was willing to be objective about the whole things.

btw if you really want to know, i personally think focus on family is only notch above the kkk. they just target a diff group

and their tatic is far more subtle, through slanderous accusation rather than physical intimidation ( i just want to get that out my system)

oh yes, i like the fact they seem far more respectable too, associated them with the Lord and having a nice motto of supporting marriage and family (a motto i actually agree with)

Grace51 · Oct 7, 2012

LionofJudahDK said:
Ah...the classic "I'm a Christian, but I care more about what the world thinks than about what God thinks, and that's totally cool and all"-type....

yes yes, i supports the gays because it is such a "cool" issue

honestly, i am surprised you could think along such terms, because it never crossed my mind

anyway, if that is how your mind operates, i am honestly very concerned fo you.

Texan40 · Oct 8, 2012

Grace51 said:
LOL, did you actually read why Southern Poverty Law Center stated that focus on family is a hate group?

of course supporting marriage and family is not hate

but using dishonet tatics and twist the information in order to achieve their goals is.

it is rhetoric to evoke emotional response and not a rational argument?

I know exactly why they claim that Focus is a hate group but I disagree with their estimation and methodology. Dobson was against promoting the idea of "safe sex." Sex with a condom is some degree "safer" than without a condom but nonetheless decidedly unsafe as it reduces but not eliminates the risk. Koop himself was an advocate of monogamy and abstinence but had to be pragmatic about stemming the tide of AIDS. There was much confusion and fear about AIDS. While unfortunate and wrong it is not "hate."

Grace51 said:
how ironic for someone who has not even bothered to check the facts before open his mouth.

I think you're missing the irony a bit yourself.

Grace51 said:
if in your humble opinion, that lying and slander is ok just because the gays are involved? then i think that says alot about your state.

I think that it is obvious by your tone and the content of your reply that you already have already preformed an idea about who and what I am and represent. Are you are so emotionally engaged that you don't see the prejudice? Obviously we are at different ends of the political spectrum but we don't have to treat each other with disdain or make sweeping statements about whole states full of people.

wordsoflife · Oct 9, 2012

There is a Chickfla opening soon in the town I live in. Yum yum bring on the anti gay chicken sandwiches! I can't wait.

wordsoflife · Oct 10, 2012

Bring on the chicken!

FtcdatSAPoD · Oct 11, 2012

Bethesda said:
neither do I - but the point I was making that, whilst I accept that many who say hate the sin not the sinner are sincere, I think that for a not insignificant number of Christians there is an underlying self righteous prejudice against the people too that is not too different to the homophobia of many non-Christians. We've seen in history how otherwise Godly people have been in situations where their prejudices show - Luther for example on the Jews (as said my personal difficult issue is dealing with people who are hard core racists) - of course thats because we are all works in progress as far as holiness etc is concerned. Such attitudes are not anyway confined to Christians, viz all the left/radical or what you will types who claim to love humanity but seem to have a great deal of difficulty loving their individual fellow citizens if they do not have the same enlightened views they have - my personal pet peeve being anyone who refers to other human beings as 'sheeple' - patronisingly arrogant or what. Reading Matthew 11. 18-19 the other day brought me back again to the point that Jesus went to where people were (resulting in him being called a friend of publicans and sinners by the religious folk and the authorities) rather than standing off from people and preaching at them without engaging with them as people - that doesn't of course mean he condoned certain behaviour (despite the attempts of people to imply - as they would today - that even just being there does)
Finally just as the Christian community is not a single body with a single voice, I think we have to be careful not to say 'the gay community do this or that' as that takes us back from dealing with human beings to entities and its much easier to characterise and stereotype entities (as people do re Radical Islam) - as there are of course gay people of all political and social persuasions and views - including to tie back into my earlier point, gay racists! What we often hear is the view point of particularly vocal groups.

Homophobia is hatred against gays. What is hatred? You spoke of racism. Racism is hatred against another race. What is racism though? These words are very hard to define and bring to a consensus.

Bethesda · Oct 14, 2012

FtcdatSAPoD said:
Homophobia is hatred against gays. What is hatred? You spoke of racism. Racism is hatred against another race. What is racism though? These words are very hard to define and bring to a consensus.

Well we usually use the OED in Blighty in the courts etc:

Hate: An emotion of extreme dislike or aversion; detestation, abhorrence, hatred.

Hatred: The condition or state of relations in which one person hates another; the emotion or feeling of hate; active dislike, detestation; enmity, ill-will, malevolence.

Some people of course claim that they can hate or have hatred without it effecting what they do or how they deal with a person. I'm not so sure - the thought is father to the deed in many cases.

So if someone hates black people and think they are less then human, then thats racism - they only people who won't agree with that are the KKK etc.

Btw the Janet Reno quote in your sig is an urban myth - it was allegedly said on 60 Minutes some time after Waco - this was the DOJ reponse dated 7 March 1995 to a letter from Rep. James V. Hansen of Utah:

This responds to your January 23 letter inquiring about Attorney General Reno's alleged statement on the television program "60 Minutes" defining a "cultist." The plain fact is that the quote is a hoax. The Attorney General has never been interviewed on "60 Minutes." She has never discussed cults, or tried to define one. There is nothing in the counterfeit quote that guides government policy.
The quote first appeared, to our knowledge, in the August 1993 "Paul Revere Newsletter" of the Christian Defense League in Flora, Illinois. The information came by telephone from a woman in Florida whose name was not noted. The newsletter subsequently ran a retraction.

I won't comment as a Brit on a newsletter named after a rebel ;-) but surely if it took place then someone should be able to produce the time and date, detail of the interviewer and either a full transcript of the interview or a recording. Its too easy to claim that it was suppressed by the forces of ZOGism, the Illuminati or whoever. I understand that as is the way of things after it was challenged, proponents then moved it on to claim it was said at a meeting of those hate figures of the US far right, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. I must say that the people I met from the latter seemed human enough (they gave me a nice hat) and whilst neither Waco or Ruby Ridge were anything but mishandled, events in our own country such as the shooting of a Brazilian electrician mistaken for a Muslim suicide bomber show that no plan survives removal from the printer.

FtcdatSAPoD · Oct 15, 2012

Bethesda said:
Well we usually use the OED in Blighty in the courts etc:

Hate: An emotion of extreme dislike or aversion; detestation, abhorrence, hatred.

Hatred: The condition or state of relations in which one person hates another; the emotion or feeling of hate; active dislike, detestation; enmity, ill-will, malevolence.

Some people of course claim that they can hate or have hatred without it effecting what they do or how they deal with a person. I'm not so sure - the thought is father to the deed in many cases.

So if someone hates black people and think they are less then human, then thats racism - they only people who won't agree with that are the KKK etc.

Btw the Janet Reno quote in your sig is an urban myth - it was allegedly said on 60 Minutes some time after Waco - this was the DOJ reponse dated 7 March 1995 to a letter from Rep. James V. Hansen of Utah:

This responds to your January 23 letter inquiring about Attorney General Reno's alleged statement on the television program "60 Minutes" defining a "cultist." The plain fact is that the quote is a hoax. The Attorney General has never been interviewed on "60 Minutes." She has never discussed cults, or tried to define one. There is nothing in the counterfeit quote that guides government policy.
The quote first appeared, to our knowledge, in the August 1993 "Paul Revere Newsletter" of the Christian Defense League in Flora, Illinois. The information came by telephone from a woman in Florida whose name was not noted. The newsletter subsequently ran a retraction.

I won't comment as a Brit on a newsletter named after a rebel ;-) but surely if it took place then someone should be able to produce the time and date, detail of the interviewer and either a full transcript of the interview or a recording. Its too easy to claim that it was suppressed by the forces of ZOGism, the Illuminati or whoever. I understand that as is the way of things after it was challenged, proponents then moved it on to claim it was said at a meeting of those hate figures of the US far right, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. I must say that the people I met from the latter seemed human enough (they gave me a nice hat) and whilst neither Waco or Ruby Ridge were anything but mishandled, events in our own country such as the shooting of a Brazilian electrician mistaken for a Muslim suicide bomber show that no plan survives removal from the printer.

Thank you very much for your information on Janet Reno. I'll look into it.

Is, perhaps, you definition of hate too vague? I've worked for black supervisors who made no bones abouting hating white people (according to your definition). They spouted all kinds of stuff which I would consider as lies almost everyday. But, I ask, what did those emotions have to do with me? I had to go to work and, in God's eyes, obey my boss, which I did. When his "hatred" of me results in a physical action of some kind such as not paying me or adjusting my pay, then its real hatred. But if it's a feeling that means he would rather not talk to me, so what. No one likes everyone else equally all the time. I can be around other whites who don't want to talk to me either. I am not concerned about that though. I am concerned that we do the right thing to each other where we are supposed to.

Bethesda · Oct 17, 2012

FtcdatSAPoD said:
Thank you very much for your information on Janet Reno. I'll look into it.

Is, perhaps, you definition of hate too vague? I've worked for black supervisors who made no bones abouting hating white people (according to your definition). They spouted all kinds of stuff which I would consider as lies almost everyday. But, I ask, what did those emotions have to do with me? I had to go to work and, in God's eyes, obey my boss, which I did. When his "hatred" of me results in a physical action of some kind such as not paying me or adjusting my pay, then its real hatred. But if it's a feeling that means he would rather not talk to me, so what. No one likes everyone else equally all the time. I can be around other whites who don't want to talk to me either. I am not concerned about that though. I am concerned that we do the right thing to each other where we are supposed to.

Well racism either way is equally reprehensible. Of course not all hatred translates into action (at least immediately) but eventually it will as Hitler's Germany and Yugoslavia demonstrated (in terms of countries not too far from here). I'd agree that not everyone likes everyone but racism is not about that - as someone in the church said about The Colour Purple what struck them was that in Georgia of that time the most uneducated white person was still better (in the eyes of racists) that the most intelligent, cultured black person solely on account of their skin colour.

Texan40 · Oct 17, 2012

The sad fact is that in many people's eyes if I disagree fundamentally with the notion that homosexuality is "healthy and normal" then I am bigoted or full of hatred. This not only abuses my rights to free speech but introduces a potentially damaging stigma to me personally.

sniperelite7 · Oct 17, 2012

Any sane rational person has a reason to hate on chic a fila. They donate money to these loons.

Fischer: "Political Leadership Ought To Be Reserved For The Hands Of Males" - YouTube

Bethesda · Oct 17, 2012

Texan40 said:
The sad fact is that in many people's eyes if I disagree fundamentally with the notion that homosexuality is "healthy and normal" then I am bigoted or full of hatred. This not only abuses my rights to free speech but introduces a potentially damaging stigma to me personally.

But as much as one person has the right to free speech so does another - if someone is a member of the KKK and believes that inter-racial relationships are not healthy or right then me saying that I fundamentally disagree with them and that they are utterly wrong to say that (and in the case of the KKK wicked) is not abusing their free speech (and I would need myself to remember not to hate the individual but just their perverse beliefs). I btw believe that people of course do have the right to say that they disagree with the homosexual lifestyle (as I do) but its the way its said that is the thing

Enahs4Him · Oct 18, 2012

As a man who has been involved in the homosexual lifestyle, I have no problem with Chick fil A's views. Personally, I have repented of my lifestyle and am trusting in Jesus as my Lord and Savior. Homosexuality is a sin. God loves us, but not our sin. I know that love the sinner not the sin is an old cliche but it is so true.
Christians should love the homosexual, not condone the lifestyle, but the love person as a person.
Marriage should be between a man and a woman,
The owners/CEO of Chick Fil A are NOT haters for believing in traditional marriage.
The Holy Bible was inspired by God(Holy Spirit). And God is not a hater.
So if someone believes in biblical principles why are they considered haters?

Almighty's humble servant · Oct 19, 2012

songofsolomon72 said:
As a man who has been involved in the homosexual lifestyle, I have no problem with Chick fil A's views. Personally, I have repented of my lifestyle and am trusting in Jesus as my Lord and Savior. Homosexuality is a sin. God loves us, but not our sin. I know that love the sinner not the sin is an old cliche but it is so true.
Christians should love the homosexual, not condone the lifestyle, but the love person as a person.
Marriage should be between a man and a woman,
The owners/CEO of Chick Fil A are NOT haters for believing in traditional marriage.
The Holy Bible was inspired by God(Holy Spirit). And God is not a hater.
So if someone believes in biblical principles why are they considered haters?

GREAT POST brother.

And this is exactly why, and how we should think irt to this issue.

As believers, the Holy Spirit convicts us and brings us to repentance. It is not the govt's job to do this.

The owner of Chickfila, rather than spending millions, giving to causes to promote a ban on gay marriage, may have been better off, building faith based counseling centers, where people with homosexual thoughts could go and give them up to God.

I wish I had a few hours to talk with you personally. Your comment shows us it is very possible to turn away from sin, but I would love to know how you felt from the moment of your conviction, and tell you of my own.

God bless you brother. May the Lord keep you and hold you and bless you abundantly all the days of your life.

Texan40 · Oct 19, 2012

songofsolomon72 said:
As a man who has been involved in the homosexual lifestyle, I have no problem with Chick fil A's views. Personally, I have repented of my lifestyle and am trusting in Jesus as my Lord and Savior. Homosexuality is a sin. God loves us, but not our sin. I know that love the sinner not the sin is an old cliche but it is so true.
Christians should love the homosexual, not condone the lifestyle, but the love person as a person.
Marriage should be between a man and a woman,
The owners/CEO of Chick Fil A are NOT haters for believing in traditional marriage.
The Holy Bible was inspired by God(Holy Spirit). And God is not a hater.
So if someone believes in biblical principles why are they considered haters?

Using "hate speech" rhetoric has become a popular tactic for trying to silence those who disagree with you. It seems to work not because it is "anti-hatred' but because people are seriously afraid of being labeled as such. I don't see it as any different than other forms of terrorism. It is not an open discourse but a lesson in intimidation.

Afterthought: I am so awestruck that in the midst of such affliction you could find salvation. What we tell ourselves about who we are is one of the hardest strongholds to topple. God is truly good.

Enahs4Him · Oct 19, 2012

Almighty's humble servant said:
GREAT POST brother.

And this is exactly why, and how we should think irt to this issue.

As believers, the Holy Spirit convicts us and brings us to repentance. It is not the govt's job to do this.

The owner of Chickfila, rather than spending millions, giving to causes to promote a ban on gay marriage, may have been better off, building faith based counseling centers, where people with homosexual thoughts could go and give them up to God.

I wish I had a few hours to talk with you personally. Your comment shows us it is very possible to turn away from sin, but I would love to know how you felt from the moment of your conviction, and tell you of my own.

God bless you brother. May the Lord keep you and hold you and bless you abundantly all the days of your life.

Thanks brother for your post!
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ebedmelech · Oct 19, 2012

Ummmm...I'll have a Spicy Chicken Deluxe....

Hating on Chickfila...Why??

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