Happy all the time?

[blackribbon]

Is it anti-Christian to not be "happy" all the time or act like "everything will turn out fine"?

In nursing, we are not allowed to tell someone that "I am sure that everything will be fine" because we can't make that assumption or that guarantee. We learn to reassure without making empty promises.

I wish real life was more like that. I think it is almost insulting and disregards my feeling when someone tries to convince me that my life isn't as bad as it feels. Yes, others do have it worse...but that doesn't mean that my "bad" isn't bad too. Feeling low or looking at my life realistically does not mean I do not believe that God is in control or that my low spot isn't part of God's plan. God never promised us a "happy" problem-free life. We live in a sinful world that is not all roses and happiness. Even the roses have thorns and if you don't acknowledge that the thorns exist, you can end up wounded more than if you are watching out for them.

 

[dayhiker]

I understand what your saying, black.

I think its easy to say a nice platitude with out thinking of a thought that actually fits the situation.

The people that do what our looking for have very good empathy. I'm better at it, but I remember how I was terrible at showing empathy when I was younger.

We can be a Christian and be happy or not happy ... while I think its a good Christian trait to show empathy, I don't think the prophets were good at showing empathy. So a lot of variations in how we express our Christianity.

 

[Doctor Strangelove]

I have basically a tragic view of life (but hopefully not self-pitying or, any more, too cynical). We live in a fallen world and bad things happen to good people. I do have periods where I view my life in particular and human history in general as little more than an empty struggle. Then sometimes I will think of something or see a work of art or hear great music and I will dimly see that there might be more to life than vain struggle.

I have said something like, "things can't be this bad forever" to someone discouraged or depressed and then felt stupid and ashamed of myself that I could not think of anything meaningful to say.

I have had to deal with legalistic Christians who will tell you if something bad happened in your life that it is God's plan so you should be happy about what happened and if you aren't happy, it is a sin. Once they have finished beating you up with that they will switch to another weapon. They will say that maybe you are so sinful you are living out of God's will so you are getting what you deserve. I don't have such a narrow reward/punishment view of God. But evidently to some people, if I admit that I don't know why something bad happened and I have no idea how it fits in with God's will, that makes me a "carnal Christian" or perhaps even "unsaved." Most Christians I know have a more mature view of things than that but I have known people who were beaten down with what I consider to be spiritual abuse.

 

[dayhiker]

I went thru some of what your talking about as far as spiritual goes. But I'm generally so easy going that blow it off in a few minutes. It seems to me most people are don't spend a lot of time planning to hurt people. I can't remember the last time some one intentionally set out to hurt me. So I see most of the bad that the Bible talks about as people that don't give God His due.

I guess I'm in my own happy bubble oblivious to the real world. . I love it.

 

[blackribbon]

I have said something like, "things can't be this bad forever" to someone discouraged or depressed and then felt stupid and ashamed of myself that I could not think of anything meaningful to say.

I actually find this a better ... and maybe a more comforting response that when someone throws some flippant Bible verse in Old English that often is completely out of context of what the original writer intended it to mean.

I don't have a fatalistic viewpoint but I do have a life that isn't very pretty in several areas...and not because of anything I have done or haven't done. God has always provided but I hate when people pick the items out of my life that are good and someone think they should counterbalance the bad...or even erase the bad.

 

[Doctor Strangelove]

Years ago I read, A Cry of Absence: Reflections for the Winter of the Heart
by Martin E. Marty. Some of us are going through "winter" experiences in life. Some of us have more "winter" in our personality than "summer," but we are expected to only put a "positive" spin on things and to have a more sober view is somehow less "spiritual" or "unchristian." The book addresses issues like that and I found it helpful.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

Well it HAS been a full moon lately .

In all seriousness though I feel alot like you. My life isn't TERRIBLE and some of why I am struggling is my own fault and I know and own this. BUT that doesn't mean that sometimes I'm down still, and that I should just go around singing "Don't worry be happy" all the time either.

There could be many possibilities for "problems" in our lives. Job's friends were a great help to him when he was down, right? NOT!
What about David? He had alot of sorrowful Psalms that he wrote.

I do NOT think that if we are unhappy or sad, or mad or whatever, that it is a sin, and I do NOT think God is surprised when we DO get sad.

A few months ago, I saw my previous Pastor's wife in Kohl's. She looked a little frantic as I said hi to her. It was just before Christmas. Her MIL had just died. They were there to return Christmas presents to buy clothes for the funeral which was in another state. Anyway, when she told me what happened, my reply was "oh that sucks!" and she looked at me with a sigh of relief and said "Thank you for saying that!" See because she is a Pastor's wife I'm sure many people were sharing the "oh you will see them again in eternity" and "they are in a better place now" and all the other usual things people say. We all know those things, but at that moment WE are still sad and WE are still here, and WE hurt! Sometimes people don't want to acknowledge other people's pain, and/or they don't know what to say or do and we all want to help "fix" the "problem" but sometimes we can't and God certainly knows this.

I have a friend with cancer. I don't think ANY of my problems compare to her having a life threatening disease for which treatment makes you sick. BUT I still HAVE my problems and they still affect ME. Do I go on and on about them with my friend? No of course not, but I also do not feel guilty feeling sad about MY life because my life IS hard FOR ME! Just like your life is hard for you ( and you are much more busy than I am and I cannot imagine being THAT busy so I feel for ya)

And besides all that......IF we as christians are always happy, how will non-believers see that? They will either think we are big fakers, or they will just think we are weird. When we, as christians go thru life and people see that we struggle with hard things, BUT still have faith, THAT says more than a million words in putting forth the gospel, IMO. Believe it or not, no matter what people say....they are watching us. Christians and non-christians alike especially because we have lost a loved one, they are watching to see how we handle it. I know because people have told me that.
What I lack in my friendships, with the exception of one friend, is a friend that I can vent to....that doesn't try to give me advice or tell me what they would do, or throw me a scripture. Just someone that will acknowledge that YES this is a problem....God will help me work it out, I'm not sure how or when, but I DO trust in God, but right now I feel pretty yucky about it and I want/need to talk. But I hear ya!!!

 

[blackribbon]

Thank you for the affirmation. I am tired of being surrounded by fake happiness. It makes me want to avoid Christians. I don't know...maybe a lot of them are in the "fake it until you make it" attitude so in that way it is not necessarily fake...but I have a hard time if we are not allowed to be "real" when we are in a Christian setting. I have no energy to pretend anymore... I wish I was strong enough to say "take me or leave me" like I used to be but I still have days where I can't take anymore rejection either...

 

[Niels]

I think there's a healthy balance, but such things often reinforce themselves. Positive attitudes tend to spread positivity, whereas negative attitudes tend to spread negativity. I'd rather hang out with a bunch of people who at least seem like they're trying to be happy than those who essentially treat misery as a virtue. In my experience, when people feel that they will only be considered honest by focusing on the negative, it brings the social dynamic down a notch. It seems to me that most of us experience a broad range of emotions, and those emotions shouldn't be dismissed as invalid when they don't match the expectations of others. However, the ramifications of negativity breeding more negativity strike me as worse than the vague sense that some people somewhere may be feigning happiness. At least a culture that strives for positivity encourages the people who genuinely do feel happy to express it, and perhaps brightens the day for others. Not that I think depression, traumatic events, or other emotionally stressful things should be dismissed or ignored, but I don't think we should let negativity fester. In short, I don't think it's wrong to feel bad from time to time, as the human experience involves both good and bad, but it's more advantageous to err on the side of positivity when we can.

That said, I'm not particularly into the expected displays of happiness that some groups seem to require. The idea of being "on" like that all the time doesn't sit well with me. When I'm genuinely happy, my happiness doesn't necessarily look like what they want to see, so I may resist it more on the grounds of empty posturing than objection to actual happiness. One can be every bit as happy as the happy-clappy types without the bouncy clappy part. Perhaps when quietly meditating, going about one's work etc. Not that people can't be genuinely bouncy when happy, but outward expressions of happiness don't look the same for everyone.

 

[BigMat]

It has been many years ago since I saw an interview on TV with a man who researched happiness. The gist of the interview was about this exact thing -- Christians don't ever seem happy. It has been so long ago now that I don't remember the guys name or the exact figures. What he found though was that something like only 1 out of 8 people are capable of being truly happy and upbeat a majority of the time. He found that it's only a minority of the human race who's brains are wired with a happy upbeat personality and are able to be that way all of the time. He said most people, most of the time, are not happy. They aren't necessarily depressed or sad or experiencing negative emotion but, they almost never experience the level of joy and happiness that the one out of eight do on a near full time basis. What he did find was that the positive and fulfilling emotion that the majority of people experience in lieu of joy and happiness is being occupied, contented, or satisfied -- usually on an intellectual level but, in other ways as well.

I remember the interview because it described me to a tee. Most of the time I don't even desire to be happy. Peace, calm, contentedness -- those are more enjoyable emotions to me than happiness. Being intellectually or spiritually stimulated is more enjoyable for me than happiness. Happiness requires lots of emotional energy -- something I don't have a great deal of -- and exhausts me pretty quickly.

 

[Doctor Strangelove]

In the Buddhist religion you have supposedly reached a high spiritual plane when you are indifferent to everything. I wonder if the idea of a Christian "happiness" that denies or spiritualizes the reality of death, sickness, tragedy, injustice, etc. is actually a pseudo-Christian version of the Buddha's indifference to all things. In the Christian realm this indifference as the ideal would come from Gnosticism and not Buddhism.

On a less philosophical note, there is much of the attitude that the more "spiritual" you are, the less moved you will be by things because you have the "big picture" and any view less than this is lack of faith and sin. There is also the perfectionist idea that we can be "strong" all of the time and be strong mostly in our own power. That is what happens when our faith becomes the object of our faith (rather than God). We either become "strong" and we try to impress God and others with how strong we are - and here we can profess a perfect "Christian" happiness. Or else, since we have been putting our faith in our faith and finally realize how weak it really is, we give in to despair.

 

[blackribbon]

I normally am one of those annoyingly upbeat people...or at least used to be. For the first time in my life, a smile is not always my "neutral" face. I could almost always find something good in every situation...even in my husband's death. After he died, I ended up having to move my family a thousand miles away to escape the people that thought I should just "bounce back" and become the same "happy person". Everyone was leaning on me to lift their moods and it completely drained me. My sister-in-law even chewed me out for not helping her husband (my husband's brother) through his grief because I was "doing so well". As the strain got to be too much and the loneliness started to overwhelm me, people started to avoid me because I wasn't the person they wanted or expected me to be.

By moving, nobody knew who I used to be and didn't have expectations of who I "should" be. The sad part is that as I struggle to put "good things" in my children's and my life, people from my old life see them as being evidence that I don't suffer anymore. Yes, I am in school...but I should still be a stay at home mom not gone more hours than I am home...yes, I will make good money someday in the future as a result of the hard work, but truthfully, the bills aren't willing to wait and my kids are growing up RIGHT NOW. My kids are supportive but the evidence of how much I am gone is that my daughter came up to verify that I won't forget her upcoming birthday this year. Sad to say, I won't have much time to focus on her that day because I have to be at the hospital. However, people will still be jealous because she is getting a relatively expensive electronic device that my mother is helping me buy (assuming I don't forget to go buy it.)

In our society, grief seems to have an expiration date. There is a day when we are not allowed to miss our loved ones beyond the very surface. However, the reality is that hearts don't really work that way. My kids miss their dad every time they have a major or minor event that their dad should have been at. I don't care if it is their first dance or opening day of another ball season (daddy used to coach both kids so this IS a big deal). People don't see that standing out on a ball diamond trying to play catch with my son who throws hard enough to scare me to death is a major heart ache because I know he isn't even able to throw like he could if daddy was here. I also see it in his eyes, that I am just not the same.... This isn't a situation where a mental attitude adjustment will change the reality of our lives. The "thinking positive" is what has us even trying and making do with what we have. Too bad it hasn't even dawned on another dad to recognize this shortage in my son's life and invited my boy to practice with him and his own son. Because we "seem" find, most people don't bother to see the hurt.

One of the most common lies told in our society is answering "I'm fine" when asked how they are doing.

 

[Doctor Strangelove]

Blackribbon, I think you are doing just fine to not be "just fine" about everything. I know you have a demanding schedule and are tired and one is expected to "get over it" and even if your life is broken in places - maybe broken in a lot of places - everything is supposed to be "normal," whatever that means. It is even worse when Christians lecture you on what you should do (often, what you should do for them, even though you are the one who suffered loss), or you will be lectured on how you should feel from people who perhaps have been spared some trials themselves.

Add to that our society does not deal maturely with a lot of things. We have death everywhere as part of our "entertainment," much like the decadent Romans, but there is a real fear in honestly speaking about it. Our culture is driven by people, some of them adults, who are of stunted growth spiritually and morally and people who have grown up in such a culture and have absorbed its values will tell a greiving person to "get over it" and not be ashamed to make demands on you as if you are a slave.

My parents were in their second marriage when I was born, their previous spouses died in accidents. Some of the sicker people on my father's side of the family did not like my mom, I guess because she herself was a widow and because she was seen as a "replacement" - there were a few really mean and sick people. These people had all sorts of problems. Others, who were more normal, accepted my mother as part of the family.

So I grew up seeing some adults act in strange, hateful ways. I grew up wondering about death and fate and what God allows to happen and what he controls. I have not lost a spouse or a child but I still think about my father and about some other relatives who have died. It is not like you can flip a switch ans say you are finally over that. Every severe trial and setback in my life has perhaps made me stronger in the long run but it has also taken something good away and left scars. So whatever this "victorious Christian living" is that is supposed to always make you "happy" has evidently passed me by. But I am not sure I would want to be "happy" the way some count happiness. I would like to think I have accumulated some wisdom even though the price of it is that my life has some ugly scars.

Blackribbon, have you been able to meet with other people, especially other women, in your situation?

 

[blackribbon]

The first year, we were in a grief program for families. It was best for my kids. I found support online with some young widow/widower groups. That helped me keep my sanity. I also tried a couple widow groups at my church and a neighboring church...but like the "widows" site here, I don't think people are honest about their lives or feelings much of the time. They are trying to "be Christian" which seems to mean denying their realities. It isn't until the very end when we pray for each other than people start to admit that they are losing their homes, can't find work that covers their expenses, or other realities of widowhood. Some is that they aren't complainers but other is this deep dark secret that you look at everyone else saying their "praises" or "how good they are doing" and wonder why God has forgotten you or thinks you are strong enough to carry so many extra burdens alone.

I am not "unhappy" or miserable. I am blessed more ways that I can count. I am grateful for a God who does provide. I also am human and am tired and lonely.

I will say that I am grateful with number of people in my life that quietly support me by not making me feel guilty when I absolutely can't attend a parent meeting or forget to bring cupcakes to a group party. As little as that is, having someone look me the eye and honestly mean that our attendance is more important than "carrying my fair share".

I also appreciate you all for just being here to talk about whatever....or having a place to vent occasionally. Part of the loneliness is having stupid things to say and no one to say them to.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

I think that is the saddest thing about society and people.....that we are not honest. We walk by someone and say "How are you today?" not really wanting to know how they are doing unless it is "great!"
Unfortunately or Fortunately I am a call a spade a spade person and I usually am honest (not on the random "how are you?").
I am totally with you. I am not totally depressed. Not overjoyed. It would be so much easier (and harder) if my husband was still here, or I had someone to share my burden with. Apparently that is not in God's plan. I try to be "happy" for myself. Doesn't always work and I let myself be sad when I can. This weekend I was home alone for all of Sunday which was wonderful. I made a fabulous dinner for myself (I planned for my son to be there but he decided to stay at a friends) and I rented a couple of redbox movies. Guilt Trip and Impossible. Guilt Trip is supposed to be a comedy (and it was) but at the end I CRIED! HARD! and as I was crying I was asking myself WHY am I crying? Only I could cry at a comedy. Impossible was about the Tsunami in Thailand so of course it was moving and sad. IMO it is OK to vent. I know what you are saying though, sometimes we just don't have anyone to vent to.
And for those that are saying they'd rather be around positive folks. Well wouldn't everyone? But shouldn't we also be there for each other when we feel down? isn't that life? I will not fake it til I make it, or try to be someone I'm not. People that know me personally think I am basically "happy", but more importantly "real" and they like that about me.

 

[blackribbon]

I think that sometimes people forget that "positive" people also have feelings and hurt or feel sad or let down from time to time. However, people who need to be around "positive" often harm their positive friends by not allowing them to be "real".

I am feeling better. I think it helped to just have a place to say all those things and be "real". I think one of the most exhausting parts of my life is to be living a highly stressed life with other people who are highly stressed...and not have the time or energy to reach out to all the sad, empty eyes I see around me. I think most of the nursing students think everyone else has friends...but the truth is that I think most of us are loners who spend much of our time fearful that we won't make it or be able to cut it as nurses. Even sadder is most people don't trust that someone really does notice them or care about them even when they do reach out.

 

[dayhiker]

Black ... I really see our society(government and industry) pushing us to work harder and longer to keep America on top of the world, or dominating the world both militarily and economically. probably other ways as well. But the result is we don't have time to be there for each other as we have work we have to do!

Positive people and hurt. Yes we all get hurt. I think the reason positive people can stay positive is we let the hurt go, we feel them for a while and then make a judgment as to how we are going to handle the hurt. I let hurts go quickly, as I have no desire to hang out feeling pain.

 

[blackribbon]

That is the little hurts. However, the things like my best friend in Texas went literally years before she finally admitted that her husband was abusing her and cheating on her. She wore a smile on her face and laughed through out it all....until the days that her eyes couldn't hide it anymore. Then she avoided me for a period because she knew I could see the hurt and she couldn't keep her composure around me. She actually had a long drawn out divorce without most people even knowing that she had marital problems. Another woman has been rejected by her "Christian" church friends because she "suddenly" divorced her husband. She confided to me that he had been sexually and physically abusing her for their entire marriage. She stayed married and protected him because she was a Christian wife. However, she looked at her pre-teen daughter and started worrying about what she was teaching her daughter about male/female relationships and was beginning to wonder at what point would her daughter become the target of abuse. Both...very positive "happy" women who let all the normal troubles of life just roll of their backs. However, both very damaged inside because of all the years that they chose not to share their hurts. The second one still smiles and wears the hurt her giant sin of "divorcing a good Christian man" where no one sees. The other has everyone fooled but avoids most social events because she can't smile so easily anymore. Some hurts are bigger than "just letting them go".

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

My BIL is the type of person that CANNOT hear anything negative. If you start to tell a story of something even that actually already happened to you that is negative he will change the subject, walk away or tell you lets think about the good things.
The problem is that he isn't being real. He has issues (as we all do) and he also used to have an alcohol problem so it's not that he is genuinely a positive person (like dayhiker ) but IDK it's just WEIRD.
Bad things DO happen and they happen to good and bad people. We need to be able to be honest. Jesus was honest about asking God if there was ANY other way besides Him dying on the cross, can he get out of it, but God was silent and of course there WAS no other way. God doesn't expect us to be perfect. Remember Job's friends? When they first came to see him they sat in silence for days just being there with Job.
I think we are called to encourage one another, but how can we encourage if we cannot listen to what is ailing the other person?

 

[blackribbon]

Agreed...and how can we encourage or help each other if we are not allowed to express our hurts or needs.