GW is Astrological

[sbvera13]

Is global warming a Cancer in the heart of the modern world? Perhaps a Gemini? Courtesy of your South Dakota elected officials.

2010 Session - Bill History

NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, by the House of Representatives of the Eighty-fifth Legislature of the State of South Dakota, the Senate concurring therein, that the South Dakota Legislature urges that instruction in the public schools relating to global warming include the following:
(1) That global warming is a scientific theory rather than a proven fact;

(2) That there are a variety of climatological, meteorological, astrological, thermological, cosmological, and ecological dynamics that can effect world weather phenomena and that the significance and interrelativity of these factors is largely speculative; and

(3) That the debate on global warming has subsumed political and philosophical viewpoints which have complicated and prejudiced the scientific investigation of global warming phenomena; and

BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that the Legislature urges that all instruction on the theory of global warming be appropriate to the age and academic development of the student and to the prevailing classroom circumstances.

No, it's not an article from The Onion. That's the actual SD government website up there. The number of things that must be gotten wrong to support this nonsense.... wow. This is as bad as Alabama declaring pi=3; except that was decent enough to be a hoax.

 

[Chesterton]

The number of things that must be gotten wrong to support this nonsense.... wow.

What's the number?

 

[Exiledoomsayer]

"scientific theory rather than a proven fact"
This just made me LOL and QQ at the same time. seriously these people are in change over there?

 

[sbvera13]

What's the number?

I've hardly counted, but it's pretty staggering that a bunch of highly educated men who have been chosen to be leaders can have such a profound misunderstanding of basic reality. In #3 they even suggest that opinions determine what should be regarded as fact. Of course, they're politicians, that kind of thing is normal for them. That's why everyone hates politicians.

 

[Spacewyrm]

NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, by the House of Representatives of the Eighty-fifth Legislature of the State of South Dakota, the Senate concurring therein, that the South Dakota Legislature urges that instruction in the public schools relating to global warming include the following:
(1) That global warming is a scientific theory rather than a proven fact;

(2) That there are a variety of climatological, meteorological, astrological, thermological, cosmological, and ecological dynamics that can effect world weather phenomena and that the significance and interrelativity of these factors is largely speculative; and

(3) That the debate on global warming has subsumed political and philosophical viewpoints which have complicated and prejudiced the scientific investigation of global warming phenomena; and

BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that the Legislature urges that all instruction on the theory of global warming be appropriate to the age and academic development of the student and to the prevailing classroom circumstances.

 

[Chesterton]

I've hardly counted, but it's pretty staggering that a bunch of highly educated men who have been chosen to be leaders can have such a profound misunderstanding of basic reality. In #3 they even suggest that opinions determine what should be regarded as fact. Of course, they're politicians, that kind of thing is normal for them. That's why everyone hates politicians.

That's not what #3 says. I don't see much wrong with any of it except the inclusion of the word "astrological".

 

[thatbusfromspeed]

That's not what #3 says. I don't see much wrong with any of it except the inclusion of the word "astrological".

" (3) That the debate on global warming has subsumed political and philosophical viewpoints which have complicated and prejudiced the scientific investigation of global warming phenomena"

That is exactly what number three says. They are saying that the opinions of politicians (who unfortunately are responsible for funding scientific research to a large degree) influences the results of scientific testing and observations designed to asses global warming. Any person educated in science or at all involved with the scientific community knows this is not true.

Any reasonable person reads the language in this bill and recognizes that the state of South Dakota has written this legislation in a way that not only allows for, but encourages teaching children of all ages to not trust science. For some of you who don't understand I will try to explain what each part of this means.

1. Global warming is a theory not a fact. Well of course this is true because any scientist knows that very little in science is a definitive fact, but that is not what is meant. What this says is "A fact is something that you cannot argue with at all because it has been proven without a doubt. A scientific theory, on the other hand, is only an idea based on completely sound logic and supported by all of the evidence gathered by thousands of the smartest people in this world who have worked on the subject for over forty years, and therefore you can disregard it completely if it is not supported by your individual political or religious ideology."

2. This says that there are many factors that contribute to climate change, so that no matter what observations we may make that indicate climate change is happening we cannot prove that current climate change is caused by man. Well the first part of this is correct (except the astrological explanation), but in fact we can and have proven that man is at least partly responsible for current climate change, because fundamental laws of thermodynamics do not allow for the conversion of fossil fuels into CO2 without the earth raising temperatures. For anyone that doesn't believe me or understand this feel free to ask and I will elaborate in detail how it is physically impossible for climate change not to be influenced by man.

3. I basically explained this above, but this says that we can teach kids not to trust science because politicians (ironically the people making this law) have corrupted them (as they have successfully done to almost every aspect of American life.)

Oh, and that little addendum at the end says we will teach (or brainwash however you wanna see it) young children not to trust scientists and then when they are older and ready to understand we will teach them why they shouldn't trust scientists.

This is utterly disgusting and the fact that people like this are actually running a state is scary.

 

[Chesterton]

" (3) That the debate on global warming has subsumed political and philosophical viewpoints which have complicated and prejudiced the scientific investigation of global warming phenomena"

That is exactly what number three says. They are saying that the opinions of politicians (who unfortunately are responsible for funding scientific research to a large degree) influences the results of scientific testing and observations designed to asses global warming. Any person educated in science or at all involved with the scientific community knows this is not true.

They don't mention politicians, they mention "political and philosophical viewpoints". You don't have to be a politician to hold viewpoints; you just have to be human, and scientists are human.

 

[Spacewyrm]

That's not what #3 says. I don't see much wrong with any of it except the inclusion of the word "astrological".

What about this?

(1) That global warming is a scientific theory rather than a proven fact;

Sure, it might technically be true, but it's clear intent is to play on public misconceptions about what a theory means in science. Plus, global warming basically is a fact; we've got the measurements of temperature to show it; whether or not it is caused by man might not be "proven fact" but it sure is close to it.

 

[Chesterton]

Sure, it might technically be true, but it's clear intent is to play on public misconceptions about what a theory means in science.

I don't know, seems a bit paranoid to read that into it.

 

[Smidlee]

I believe we fill up the land fields with trash before GW becomes a serious problem. This is a case of "staining a gnat and swallow a camel". It's just makes people feel good while solving nothing. AL Gore uses enough electricity for 12 households and that's with using Green. It's like someone filling their plate up until food is falling off then reach for a diet drink like the diet drink will make any difference.
I think ultimately GW is about controlling the world's resources and who get to use them.

 

[thatbusfromspeed]

They don't mention politicians, they mention "political and philosophical viewpoints". You don't have to be a politician to hold viewpoints; you just have to be human, and scientists are human.

You're absolutely right they do not mention politicians and every person does have their own political and philosophical viewpoints. In re-reading what I wrote I realize that I misrepresented myself. What I meant is that they are claiming that scientists influence the data and results that they publish in order to encourage people to do something about it. I have seen on this forum at least one case of this being true, and I am sure it does happen to some extent, but the scientists fudging data are the vast vast minority of people in science.

That being said, so what if scientists fudge data about global warming to encourage change about it. the fact is climate change is happening, as all of our observations indicate. Not only is the global average temperature increasing, but animals of all kinds are changing behaviors that have been static for thousands of years. Frogs living on mountain tops are moving to higher and higher altitudes because of the temperature; migratory birds are begining to migrate north earlier and south later. Almost 20 species of moths native to Great Britain have moved their territories northward, and hundreds of species of insects are going extinct because they now exit larval stages earlier than the flowers that they feed on begin to bloom. Any one of these events happening could be considered an anomaly, but together they are conclusive evidence that global temperatures are rising.

My point is climate change is happening and if scientists are fudging results to encourage change then good for them. We have sat around and done nothing for so long it might be too late to do anything. As the climate warms, sea levels rise, and close to 70% of the world's population lives in coastal areas. The displacement of suck a huge amount of people will cause inconceivable civil unrest. The fact is we need to do something about global warming now and people like those who wrote this bill are doing all of us harm.

People who deny global warming is happening or use that fact that it might not be caused by man (even though it is absolutely without a doubt caused by man as I can explain if need be) are a plague to humanity and an embarrassment to themselves.

 

[Smidlee]

What's embarrassing is being were found fudging the data. This is like in the Wizard of Oz when the dog pull back the curtain the wizard still tried to pull off the act by saying "Don't pay attention to the man behind the curtain."

"Don't pay attention to all the liars. They are lying for your good."

 

[Spacewyrm]

I believe we fill up the land fields with trash before GW becomes a serious problem.

Perhaps. But then, we'll be covered with trash and have to deal with the consequences of global warming. Sounds nasty.

This is a case of "staining a gnat and swallow a camel". It's just makes people feel good while solving nothing. AL Gore uses enough electricity for 12 households and that's with using Green. It's like someone filling their plate up until food is falling off then reach for a diet drink like the diet drink will make any difference.

Al Gore is irrelevant. He's a politician; of course he's a hypocrite. The question of whether or not global warming is happening does not rise or fall based on the behavior of Al Gore. Would you stop flossing if Hitler said it was good for your teeth?

I think ultimately GW is about controlling the world's resources and who get to use them.

Good grief. Just who do you think will benefit from that, that they'd go to so much trouble? Do you have any evidence that all the world's climatologists are in on this diabolical conspiracy?

That being said, so what if scientists fudge data about global warming to encourage change about it.

[...]

My point is climate change is happening and if scientists are fudging results to encourage change then good for them. We have sat around and done nothing for so long it might be too late to do anything. As the climate warms, sea levels rise, and close to 70% of the world's population lives in coastal areas. The displacement of suck a huge amount of people will cause inconceivable civil unrest. The fact is we need to do something about global warming now and people like those who wrote this bill are doing all of us harm.

So what!? IT'S UNETHICAL!!! So its okay to lie if you've got good intentions? Except that, you know, when people find out you've fudged your data, they'll think everyone else is lying too! This only makes the problem worse! The evidence for global warming is solid without such deception! People who care about the truth and who care about the future of humanity do not need the help of such fools and villians! Don't make excuses for bad behavior.

 

[thatbusfromspeed]

<staff edit>

I believe we fill up the land fields with trash before GW becomes a serious problem. This is a case of "staining a gnat and swallow a camel". It's just makes people feel good while solving nothing. AL Gore uses enough electricity for 12 households and that's with using Green. It's like someone filling their plate up until food is falling off then reach for a diet drink like the diet drink will make any difference.
I think ultimately GW is about controlling the world's resources and who get to use them.

Who exactly do you think will benefit from widespread famine and general civil chaos. Global warming is happening all evidence proves this, and when the temperatures rise so do the sea levels and as I said before 70% of the worlds population lives in coastal regions. Furthermore the single most important resource that exists is fertile land and global warming will lead to nothing but its decrease.

What's embarrassing is being were found fudging the data. This is like in the Wizard of Oz when the dog pull back the curtain the wizard still tried to pull off the act by saying "Don't pay attention to the man behind the curtain."

"Don't pay attention to all the liars. They are lying for your good."

So you are telling me that the international scientific community which consists of tens of thousands of people from all different ethnic and national backgrounds is engaged in a conspiracy theory which involves lying about scientific finding on a global scale in order to gain economic dominance? Who exactly benefits from this? America? Scientists? who? there is no scheme to control resources except by those opposed to global warming like oil companies.

Besides you act like all scientific data is made up. You are a complete idiot. You disregard science as a means of explaining the world but have no problem benefiting from the technology it produces. If it weren't for science you wouldn't ave the computer you are using to propagate your idiocy and would not have the internet as a medium to do so. You trust your doctor I assume. Would it surprise you to learn that he/she is a scientist. When he prescribes you vicodin after a surgery I bet you don't say "well how do I know this isn't a mind control pill formulated by those crazy scientists to make me want to have sex with my dog to breed a race of super human hybrids with an incredible sense of smell and an unrelenting desire to chase balls?"

 

[thatbusfromspeed]

So what!? IT'S UNETHICAL!!! So its okay to lie if you've got good intentions? Except that, you know, when people find out you've fudged your data, they'll think everyone else is lying too! This only makes the problem worse! The evidence for global warming is solid without such deception! People who care about the truth and who care about the future of humanity do not need the help of such fools and villians! Don't make excuses for bad behavior.

You make a good point, and as a practicing scientist I understand the ethical issues. I worded it poorly, but the point I was trying to make is that if lying is what it takes to aver a global crisis like nothing man has ever seen then I'm all for lying. Of course this could never happen on the global scale needed so you are right that any benefits from the few instances of fudged results are far outweighed by detriment it causes us.

Let me also say, however, that "people who care about truth and who care about the future of humanity" are far outnumbered by ignorant people too blinded by ideology to see reason.

 

[thatbusfromspeed]

Hey, thatbusfromspeed. Why don't you take a deep breath and calm down. You're not going to explode. It's true!

Did you see the movie? Because I do explode in the end. I am perfectly calm, but because reason has time and time again failed to enlighten these people to their own hypocrisies I thought speaking in their language might work better, although to be honest that has never worked either.

The simple fact is Global Warming is happening, and if we sit back and do nothing, there likely will be catastrophic consequences.

 

[Greatcloud]

It is unstoppable GW and it happens every 1,500 years. Oh and temperatures are going down now anyway.

 

[thatbusfromspeed]

It is unstoppable GW and it happens every 1,500 years. Oh and temperatures are going down now anyway.

The type of climate change you are referring too happens because of irregularities in the earths orbit around the sun and happens on a scale closer to ever 150,000 years.

The current trend in temperature decrease you may have been noticing is called winter. In the coming months you might notice the temperature beginning to rise, plants beginning to show leaves and eventualy flowers blooming. This is referred to as spring. However much you may not want to believe, this will happen next year as well.

If you mean something other then the seasonal changes in temperature, then you should realize that climate change (a more apt name than global warming because it doesn't as easily lend itself to misconceptions) causes irregular weather patterns because temperatures increase at different rates across the globe. The climate changes more rapidly at the poles causing shifts in global air circulation.

 

[Chesterton]

The current trend in temperature decrease you may have been noticing is called winter. In the coming months you might notice the temperature beginning to rise, plants beginning to show leaves and eventualy flowers blooming. This is referred to as spring.

This is why I love the Science Forum. I'm always learning something.