God Wants Us to Prosper

ApplesofGold · Aug 25, 2003

Hello everyone this my first time posting here at Christian Forums and I hope you are encouraged by my teachings.

God Wants Us to Prosper

3 John 1
2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.

Prosperity
The Lord wants us to prosper in areas of our lives
Psalm 35
27 Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.
Proverbs 10
22 The blessing of the LORD, it maketh rich, and he addeth no sorrow with it

Body-Health
The Lord wants us to prosper in our health:
Psalm 103
2 Bless the LORD, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits:
Who forgiveth all thine iniquities; who healeth all thy diseases;
Psalm 107
20 He sent his word, and healed them, and delivered them from their destructions.
Jeremiah 17
14 Heal me, O LORD, and I shall be healed; save me, and I shall be saved: for thou art my praise.

Soul
The Lord wants us to prosper in our soul. Our soul consist of three parts:
Mind --- to think and reason
Will --- to choose and decide
Emotions to express feelings
Psalm 103
1 Bless the LORD, O my soul: and all that is within me, bless his holy name.
Isaiah 55
3 Incline your ear, and come unto me: hear, and your soul shall live; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.
Matthew 22
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

May you be blessed by reading this teaching.

In his service,
Catherine Harris

ZiSunka · Aug 26, 2003

Good post, but not the total picture.

Sometimes God lets bad things come into our lives too, not to punish us, but to make us grow.

Do a study on when He allows us to suffer, then you will have a more balanced view of God's

Magisterium · Aug 27, 2003

Hey apples, I know you mean well, but your contemporaries are running that "God wants to bless you" gospel of prosperity to death. It's so profoundly incomplete that it misses the meat and potatoes of Christianity.
While this may get the crowds jumpin' at the local storefront, it does little to stop immorality and bring people closer to the Father. In fact, is is actually counter productive. This "gospel of health and prosperity" incorrectly leads people to believe that once they "get in good" with God, health comes and problems disappear.
This couldn't be further from the truth. Suffering is a necessary part of the Christian's journey to the Father. Often, we associate happiness with certain things like health, financial security, even companionship. As we seek to move closer to the Father, He often begins to strip away the very things we cling to in order that we can more profoundly understand that HE is the only true Source of happiness and security. This stripping away is painful and certainly suffered through. However, such is the way of true christinaity. To teach Christians this sort of this for that" Christianity is to do profound harm to the body of Christ.

I also understand that protestant ministers today can't really preach against sin and vice anymore because they'll probably be voted out or fired. That's a problem that needs to be corrected.

In closing, I need to state that I do understand that God does indeed want the best for His people. However, that best is not usually in the form of material possessions. A faith in God based upon hope for material prosperity is profoundly contrary to Jesus message. The rich young man was already righteous but saught further sanctification. Jesus' reply was to get rid of his earthly posessions and follow Him. Later our lord instructs us that we cannot serve God and Wealth.
Lk 12:29-34
29 As for you, do not seek what you are to eat and what you are to drink, and do not worry anymore.
30 All the nations of the world seek for these things, and your Father knows that you need them.
31 Instead, seek his kingdom, and these other things will be given you besides.
32 Do not be afraid any longer, little flock, for your Father is pleased to give you the kingdom.
33 Sell your belongings and give alms. Provide money bags for yourselves that do not wear out, an inexhaustible treasure in heaven that no thief can reach nor moth destroy.
34 For where your treasure is, there also will your heart be.

ApplesofGold · Aug 28, 2003

Lets do a study on the Word of God. Gods word cannot be bound restrain, compelled, or constrained.
Hebrews 4
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

The definition of SUFFER means-to endure, to allow, to tolerate.

2 Timothy 3
12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
Luke 14
27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.
Mark 8
34 And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Those that live godly lives will SUFFER in the flesh. When we endure chastening by the Lord he deals with his sons and daughters. The Lord always prunes his children a little snip here and a little snip there. The flesh has to be crucified because hes coming back to receive his Bride with out spot and wrinkle. We are suppose to humble ourselves under the mighty hand of God and be receptive to his cleansing us by the washing of the water of the word. If one doesnt submit to his chastening that is called Disobedience or Rebellion then we SUFFER the consequences. Always remember Obedience is better than sacrifice.
Read:

Matthew 24
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
3 John 1
2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.

Again its three fold; God is not an unbalanced God. I did not just teach on Prosperity of wealth but overall prosperity in our day to day lives.

1 Thessalonians 5
23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Christians have to be tested and tried by God to strip away sin in our lives not to make us SUFFER if we are obedient to him and to allow him to cleanse us. Moses journey to the promise land was suppose to take 11 days but because of a stiff-necked and rebellious people it took 40 years. God brought the children of Israel out of Egypt with favor of God and they took the spoils of the Egyptians and not one was physical sick out of 3 million Israelites.

John 17
21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Thanks for the warm welcome.

Be Blessed,
Apples of Gold

Magisterium · Aug 29, 2003

Apples,
First, let me apologize for tone of my first post. My tone was less than cordial. I don't know if you're one of those preachers who re-packages the prosperity message day after day at the cost of the fullness of the faith. It is certainly true that our Lord intends the best for his children. I understand (and teach) that continuously.
That said, I find that this message is so over-emphasized, that the importance of living a moral christian life is left by the wayside. Often, the prosperity message is stated in such a way that the general congregation leaves feeling "fired up" about the windfall of temporal "blessings" they are sure to receive. Often, years can go by without a single sermon explaining what sin is, and why it needs to be avoided.
Additionally, this "gospel of gimme" focuses upon what you can get. However, ours is a faith of giving. I think it was mother Theresa who said "Charity is not measured by how much you give, but by how much you have left.".

Luchnia · Sep 11, 2003

God has pleasure in the prosperity of His servant

The Word is true.

Word up!

Mounts · Sep 19, 2003

Lets do a study on the Word of God. Gods word cannot be bound restrain, compelled, or constrained.

Yes, but it also shouldn't be taken without considering other scripture--specifically, Jesus' teachings. I'm afraid I disagree with your translations of those verses. I agree God wants us to be rich--in the spirit; and those verses speak of such wealth, not mammon.

Jesus said it was hard for a rich man to get into Heaven. Why would God want to give us earthly treasure that clouds and blinds us from our Heavenly treasure? Where a man's treasure is, there is his heart. Read the Gospel, Jesus had much to say about wealth and riches: and He wasn't throwing gold coins out to the crowd as He preached. Why did the apostles tell everyone to sell all of their possesions and give it all to the poor?

Your teachings are on the wrong things. Why do you take time talking of material wealth? Is it some kind of plot to attract unbelievers to Christianity? Because such a plot will attract them for the wrong reasons and then they will still, non-the-less, be unbelieving "Christians." No, we are to focus on heavenly things and not earthly--I find this doctrine very dangerous so please consider changing it.

Not only that, where is the focus? Is the focus on God, or is the focus on man? I think you honestly know the answer to that question. Where is Jesus? The Gospel is the message we are trying to preach. We are not trying to convince people to believe in God so they will be blessed with earthly possesions that will soon pass away anyway.

Christ does heal, and Christ does give some riches; but that shouldn't be the focus! Listen, the focus is on Christ dying and rising again to the right hand of God, paying for our sins because of God's love. I honestly don't understand why certain preachers and TBN can't talk of nothing else but, "God wants you rich." Expecially since it is contradictory to the teachings of Jesus and the epistles (Matt. 19:23, [plus to make note; Jesus specifically told His disciples NOT to seek out earthly riches (Matt. 6:19-31); but you are to seek out the kingdom of God and He will provide you food and cloths--not gold and silver.

Another quick point: Why would God not want His children to go through tribulation? Do you not know what tribulation does? Read James 1:2-4! Why, also, did Christ say blessed is a man whom suffers for My sake? A man is blessed when he suffers for Christ, and his reward is in Heaven, not on earth.

The teaching that God wants us physically rich is dangerous, unbiblical (I disagree with your translations of those verses; spirtual riches), unprofitable, and focuses on the wrong things. Please consider my warnings.

Judilyn · Sep 19, 2003

ApplesofGold said:
Hello everyone this my first time posting here at Christian Forums and I hope you are encouraged by my teachings.

God Wants Us to Prosper

3 John 1
2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.

Prosperity
The Lord wants us to prosper in areas of our lives
Psalm 35
27 Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.
Proverbs 10
22 The blessing of the LORD, it maketh rich, and he addeth no sorrow with it

Body-Health
The Lord wants us to prosper in our health:
Psalm 103
2 Bless the LORD, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits:
Who forgiveth all thine iniquities; who healeth all thy diseases;
Psalm 107
20 He sent his word, and healed them, and delivered them from their destructions.
Jeremiah 17
14 Heal me, O LORD, and I shall be healed; save me, and I shall be saved: for thou art my praise.

Soul
The Lord wants us to prosper in our soul. Our soul consist of three parts:
Mind --- to think and reason
Will --- to choose and decide
Emotions to express feelings
Psalm 103
1 Bless the LORD, O my soul: and all that is within me, bless his holy name.
Isaiah 55
3 Incline your ear, and come unto me: hear, and your soul shall live; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.
Matthew 22
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

May you be blessed by reading this teaching.

In his service,
Catherine Harris

YES He does, Glory to God!

ApplesofGold · Sep 19, 2003

Thank you very much for those that have agreed with me on the truth.I really feel blessed by your comments.

Mounts · Sep 20, 2003

ApplesofGold,

If you are preaching something to be the truth, you must be able to defend it. Why do you ignore the attack I brought against your doctrine? Will you at least consider what I said, and consider the verses I gave?

If you cannot rightfully defend it, you should not preach it.

ten-k · Sep 20, 2003

James 5:1-2-3

Go to now you rich men, weep and howl
for your miseries that shall come upon you.
Your riches are corrupted and your garments
are motheaten.
Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust
of them shall be a witness against you and shall
eat your flesh as it were fire.
You have heaped treasure together for the
last days.

1Tim.6:117-18-19
Charge them that are rich in the world that they
be not highminded nor trust in uncertain riches,

but in the (living God, who giveth us richly ALL
things to enjoy
That they do good, that they be (RICH in
good works) ready to distribute, willing to
communicate;
Laying up in store for themselves a (good
foundation) against the (time to come, that they
may lay hold on Eternal Life.)

1Cor.10:24
Let no man (seek) his own,
but every man another's wealth.

Mounts · Sep 20, 2003

Thank you ten-k for further backing me up. ApplesofGold, I hope you are seeing that the focus should not be on riches, but on Christ. The doctrine you preach counters many other verses in the Bible along with the teachings of Jesus; therefore, your natural view of those riches in scirpture is unbibilical and dangerous and you need to cease in preaching it.

patrick · Sep 20, 2003

I believe that God wants us to prosper. And to prosper abundantly, not only in the things of the spirit, but in the financial realm, and in the realm of the soul.

But read the following carefully, He wants to Bless us for His purposes, and plans. He will not bless us so that we may waste it all upon our selfish desires.

A lot of the prosperity message falls on greedy ears of men and women that once they get wealth forget God. If we put God's will and purposes first there is no limit to the wealth that may pass thru our hands for His Glory. Look at how rich men like Abraham and David were when they sought to do God's will first; Also Not to forget Joseph, and Solomon.

Grace and Peace Patrick

Mounts · Sep 21, 2003

A lot of the prosperity message falls on greedy ears of men and women that once they get wealth forget God.

I agree exactly with that, and that is why I see preaching on it is unprofitable and dangerous. If God makse you rich, He makes you rich. Poor, poor. The main view should be Jesus Christ, Lord and Savior and that's my basic problem with such doctrine. I also believe it counters much scripture.

However, I cannot accept that God want's us rich financially on earth. But thanks for giving me your view in a resonable, civilized manner. (I have had some... ungodly experiences on some other threads.)

ApplesofGold, all I ask is that you consider my words. Confirm to me that you have considered it at heart rather than ignored and I will be satisfied. I truly believe it is not the will of God to preach on such earthly things, and that it is damaging/hindering to man's view on God.

patrick · Sep 21, 2003

Hi Mounts:

I do understand where you are coming from. There is a deceitfulness in the very midst of the riches message. But if we taught the proper attitude for the people to understand then any deceitfulness of attitudes of the heart would be overcome.

If we want riches so that we may receive praise and admiration solely from others, than our attitude is selfish and wrong. And your concern is well founded.

But if we teach that the only reason to become prosperous is so that we can do something for the advancement of the Kingdom of God than there is nothing wrong with whatever the Lord blesses us with. As in anything that is done for the Lord our attitude is the critical factor toward receiving a blessing or not.

For instance many will not be delivered simplly because they want deliverance from whatever is oppressing them, so that they can continue to live however they want to live. The only reason that we can get someone delivered permentaly is to make sure that their attitude is deliver me so that I may serve you, no matter where you lead.

God wants us to receive His glory (John 17:5,20-22) and to shine it forth for the world to see the Father's very own presence in us. And when they see this light of His glory upon us then they will begin to bring great wealth to the church, who manifests that glory of His presence.

Isa 60:1-7 Arise, shine; for thy light is come, and the glory of the LORD is risen upon thee. (2) For, behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people: but the LORD shall arise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee. (3) And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising. (4) Lift up thine eyes round about, and see: all they gather themselves together, they come to thee: thy sons shall come from far, and thy daughters shall be nursed at thy side. (5) Then thou shalt see, and flow together, and thine heart shall fear, and be enlarged; because the abundance of the sea shall be converted unto thee, the forces of the Gentiles shall come unto thee. (6) The multitude of camels shall cover thee, the dromedaries of Midian and Ephah; all they from Sheba shall come: they shall bring gold and incense; and they shall show forth the praises of the LORD. (7) All the flocks of Kedar shall be gathered together unto thee, the rams of Nebaioth shall minister unto thee: they shall come up with acceptance on mine altar, and I will glorify the house of my glory.

Psa 1:1-3Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. (2) But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. (3) And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.

In the scripture is says that we are new creatures in Christ.

2Co 5:17-19 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. (18) And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; (19) To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

In the old testament there is a story where Elisha just received a double portion annointing and was waiting at Jericho. The people of Jericho showed Him how blesent the place was to dwell, and how bad the waters were. The fountain only produced death and barren lands. Elijah told them to bring Him a new cruse and put salt within it. The new cruse is a man or woman who is in Christ, and therefore is a new creature. Salt is His presence that brings His savour into us.

Mat 5:13 Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have losthis savor, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.

The salt was then poured out at the spring, Elisha then prophesied that there would be no more death or barren land and there was no more death or barren land.

I said all of this to point out something about the cruse.

In the Strong's concordance the word cruse means:

H6746
tselôchîyth tsel-o-kheeth'
From H6743; something prolonged or tall, that is, a vial or salt cellar: - cruse.

And comes from:

H6743

צלח צלח

tsâlach tsâlêach

tsaw-lakh', tsaw-lay'-akh

A primitive root; to push forward, in various senses (literally or figuratively, transitively or intransitively): - break out, come (mightily), go over, be good, be meet, be profitable, (cause to, effect, make to, send) prosper (-ity, -ous, -ously).

Now the Brown Diver Briggs says this for tsalach:

H6743

צלח / צלח

tsâlach / tsâlêach

BDB Definition:

1) (Qal) to rush

2) to advance, prosper, make progress, succeed, be profitable

2a) (Qal) to prosper

2b) (Hiphil)

2b1) to make prosperous, bring to successful issue, cause to prosper

2b2) to show or experience prosperity, prosper

Being a new creature, cruse in Christ will bring you into experiencing prosperity, it will make you prosperous, it will bring to a successful issue whatever the Lord is desiring to bring to pass. It will cause you to succeed.
And it is not just limited to the spiritual success, but it involves the whole man prospering in the spirit, soul and in the physical realms of life. This is not the selfish prosperity of lifting up self. No this prosperity is so that the Kingdom may be advanced in the earth as He wills.

Grace and Peace Patrick

SoldierofChrist · Oct 2, 2003

Here is a list from Willmingtons Book of Bible lists in regards to why we as Christians suffer:

1. To produce the fruit of patience

Rom. 5:3; James 1:34; Heb. 10:36

2. To produce the fruit of joy

Ps. 30:5; 126:56

3. To produce the fruit of maturity

Eccles. 7:3; 1 Pet. 5:10

4. To produce the fruit of righteousness

Heb. 12:11

5. To silence the devil

Job 1:9, 10, 2022

6. To teach us

Ps. 119:67, 71

7. To purify our lives

Job 23:10; Ps. 66:1012; Isa. 1:25; 48:10; Prov. 17:3; 1 Pet. 1:7

8. To make us like Christ

Heb. 12:9, 10; 1 Pet. 4:1213; Phil. 3:10; 2 Cor. 4:710

9. To glorify God

Ps. 50:15; John 9:13; 11:14; 21:1819; Phil. 1:1920

10. To prevent us from sinning

2 Cor. 12:7, 910

11. To make us confess when we do sin

Judg. 10:67, 1516; Ps. 32:35; Hos. 5:15; 6:1; 2 Chron. 15:34

12. To chasten us for our sin

1 Pet. 4:17

13. To prove our sonship

Heb. 12:56

14. To reveal ourselves to ourselves

Job 42:6; Luke 15:18

15. To help our prayer life

Isa. 26:16

16. To become an example to others

2 Cor. 6:45; 1 Thess. 1:67

17. To qualify us as counselors

Rom. 12:15; Gal. 6:2; 2 Cor. 1:35

18. To further the gospel witness

Acts 8:15; 16:2534; Phil. 1:1213; 2 Tim. 4:68, 1617

19. To make us more than conquerors

2 Cor. 2:14; Rom. 8:35, 37

20. To give us insight into Gods nature

Job 42:5; Rom. 8:1415, 18

21. To drive us closer to God

1 Pet. 4:14; 2 Cor. 12:10

22. To prepare us for a greater ministry

1 Kings 1718; John 12:24

23. To provide for us a reward

Matt. 5:1012; 19:2729; Rom. 8:1617; 2 Cor. 4:17

24. To prepare us for the kingdom

2 Thess. 1:5; 2 Tim. 2:12

25. To show Gods sovereignty

Rom. 8:28; 1 Cor. 10:13; Ps. 66:1012; Gen. 45:58; 50:20

Willmington, H. L. (1987). Willmington's book of Bible lists. Wheaton, Ill.: Tyndale House.

Ecclesiastes · Oct 4, 2003

It is probably so emphasized now, since it has been gone from the body for such along time. Yes, God wants us to prosper: physically, spiritually, emotionally, and financially.

Now about test and trials,

Yes, we do have tests and trials in our life, they can be: self inflicted, sin inflicted, or life inflicted. Some people can bring tribulation on themselves. (i.e. Job) People can step into sin and bring troubles on their life. Then life can throw troubles at you. Life is full of tests. But that doesn't mean you have to fail them, you can pass them with flying colors and come out more prosperous than before and stronger and prospering in all areas of your life. I know alot of the top "Charismatic" and "Prosperity" teachers of today. I do know they have gone through challenges, but they come out victoriously.

ECC

ian · Oct 10, 2003

Hi AppleofGold,

THanks for your sharing

May I ask that if that is the case, then those poor people like me does that means that there is something wrong with us? Are we out of GOd's will?

Should I pray for riches then?

There are many heros of the faith who truely had no riches in this world but a true heart aching for the Lost. "Jim Elliot, Amy Carmichael, Hudson Taylor +++" and Apostle Paul who had to tent make to support His ministry to our Lord.

Even when I go to Heaven, with the streets of Gold. I rather be dazzled by my Lord Jesus and the wounds on his hands, feet, side, an expression of His love for me...even me.

Thanks for your sharing.
(God wants to prosper us, in His way, in Due Time.)

Your brother in Christ
ian

(I am a young CHristian so pls correct me if I am wrong and pls dun anyone be offended in anyway)
Thanks

Ecclesiastes · Oct 10, 2003

Hey Ian,

The prosperity message isn't all about money. (some people upon hearing this will bug out their eyes.)

But the prosperity message is basically about obediance. And it is not just prospering in the financial arena, but in every area: spiritual, emotional, relationships, and physical. There is a reason why God gives His children money. Yes, He wants His kids to have the best! Yes, He wants us to be blessed!

But apart from the blessings, he also gives us money to fund His gospel across the earth. With money we are able to send missionaries and evangelists across the globe and fund believer's meeting and evangelistic outreaches.

In the case of Paul, yes Paul worked in the three years while God was training him in Arabia and probably a little bit afterwards. but soon, the people who he ministered to, began to fund him.

Phillipians 4:15 You yourselves also know, Philippians, that at the first preaching of the gospel, after I left Macedonia, no church shared with me in the matter of giving and receiving but you alone; 16 for even in Thessalonica you sent a gift more than once for my needs. 17 Not that I seek the gift itself, but I seek for the profit which increases to your account. 18 But I have received everything in full and have an abundance; I am amply supplied, having received from Epaphroditus what you have sent, a fragrant aroma, an acceptable sacrifice, well-pleasing to God. 19 And my God will supply all your needs according to His riches in glory in Christ Jesus.

See, the Phillipians obeyed God and gave to Paul. And Paul through the Phillipians and other givers Paul had more than enough and was "in abundance." And after that, he said God would supply all their needs. What's left after all? Nothing. So that includes every need in every area. It is a Seed-Time-Harvest Principle.

I'll post more if you need me to. Feel free to ask questions.

Wrapped In His Glory,
ECC

ian · Oct 12, 2003

Hi thanks for all the explanation for me...a very young Christian...

So meaning not everybody should be rich financially, right?

So it is in the will of God that some are financial not in abundance on this earth, right?

Because if it is in the will of God that every body should be financially well to do, then those who are not rich (poor) financially probably have done something that remove them from the will of God, true?

What about the poor woman who gave the two mites which is all she got as written in the bible, and Jesus said that she gave more than the rich man?

Pls advise
ian

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