God put us here somehow - Don't be distracted with the question of how.

[dpartlow]

Creation Happened - Don't Be Distracted By Symantics
Creation happened, that’s obvious – but how?
God formed us of the same stuff as a cow?

Both say yes, but there is a difference in the symantics.
Now how could this cause such Fundemental & Atheist antics?

Is our faith so tenuous that we have some conditional reliance
Upon every pronouncement of the false god’s of science?

On the one hand…

We know God spoke in Euphemism and Parable.
Christ revealing truths through imagery comparable.

On the other…

Any theist would admit that beyond doubt God could
Create it all in moments whisper, and then decree it good.

On the one hand…

All the Bible’s verses are true in one or more ways.
But it isn’t always on the surface, visible to any passing gaze.

The story of the Sower told to the crowds is one such example.
But to understand it, even the disciples needed explanations ample.

The truth of the Bible comes in many forms
History, Prophecy, Wisdom, and Ethical norms.

So, the truth of the bible is not denied,
Indeed, let no one claim that Moses ever lied,

By considering creation as true ethically, or symbolically.
Indeed it is true, but maybe speaking to us prophetically.

On the other…

But, the truth can be multilayered at the same time:
As history and prophecy and true wisdom so sublime.

Perhaps creation was more nuanced than ancient Hebrew could capture.
Perhaps it is a coded description of some future type of rapture.

The point is – don’t let science become a stumbling block.
Guard your faith against the deceiver’s heretical talk.

Mixing science with lies may make a potent poisoned cocktail.
And drinking it may cause some to allow their faith to fail.

Such mysteries may be beyond our mental scope.
So, let not the atheist slay you faith and heart and hope.

So if God spoke the universe into existence
With a big-bang – a trillion miles in the distance
Science has no argument and offers no real resistance,
To my faith in His Truth. So what’s the difference?

Daniel Partlow
​

 

[Macca]

Creation Happened - Don't Be Distracted By Symantics
Creation happened, that’s obvious – but how?
God formed us of the same stuff as a cow?

Both say yes, but there is a difference in the symantics.
Now how could this cause such Fundemental & Atheist antics?

Is our faith so tenuous that we have some conditional reliance
Upon every pronouncement of the false god’s of science?

On the one hand…

We know God spoke in Euphemism and Parable.
Christ revealing truths through imagery comparable.

On the other…

Any theist would admit that beyond doubt God could
Create it all in moments whisper, and then decree it good.

On the one hand…

All the Bible’s verses are true in one or more ways.
But it isn’t always on the surface, visible to any passing gaze.

The story of the Sower told to the crowds is one such example.
But to understand it, even the disciples needed explanations ample.

The truth of the Bible comes in many forms
History, Prophecy, Wisdom, and Ethical norms.

So, the truth of the bible is not denied,
Indeed, let no one claim that Moses ever lied,

By considering creation as true ethically, or symbolically.
Indeed it is true, but maybe speaking to us prophetically.

On the other…

But, the truth can be multilayered at the same time:
As history and prophecy and true wisdom so sublime.

Perhaps creation was more nuanced than ancient Hebrew could capture.
Perhaps it is a coded description of some future type of rapture.

The point is – don’t let science become a stumbling block.
Guard your faith against the deceiver’s heretical talk.

Mixing science with lies may make a potent poisoned cocktail.
And drinking it may cause some to allow their faith to fail.

Such mysteries may be beyond our mental scope.
So, let not the atheist slay you faith and heart and hope.

So if God spoke the universe into existence
With a big-bang – a trillion miles in the distance
Science has no argument and offers no real resistance,
To my faith in His Truth. So what’s the difference?

Daniel Partlow
​

Interesting prose: but.
If you cannot literally believe the first 11 chapters of Genesis, you will be open to questioning all of the Bible's truth.

 

[philadiddle]

Interesting prose: but.
If you cannot literally believe the first 11 chapters of Genesis, you will be open to questioning all of the Bible's truth.

Thinking that something is not literal and thinking that something is not true are two very different things. I believe the whole bible is true, but i don't think it's all literal.

 

[Macca]

Thinking that something is not literal and thinking that something is not true are two very different things. I believe the whole bible is true, but i don't think it's all literal.

Which parts are not literal, in your opinion?

 

[philadiddle]

Which parts are not literal, in your opinion?

I couldn't go through it passage by passage right now, but since this forum is about origins, I would have to say that the creation account isn't literally true, although I still believe the theological and philosophical points that it makes are 100% true.

 

[Macca]

I couldn't go through it passage by passage right now, but since this forum is about origins, I would have to say that the creation account isn't literally true, although I still believe the theological and philosophical points that it makes are 100% true.

Can you explain your views on origins?

 

[TheReasoner]

Interesting prose: but.
If you cannot literally believe the first 11 chapters of Genesis, you will be open to questioning all of the Bible's truth.

Do you believe that revelations is to be read literally?

 

[Raydon]

Creation Happened - Don't Be Distracted By Symantics

Creation happened, that’s obvious – but how?
God formed us of the same stuff as a cow?

Both say yes, but there is a difference in the symantics.
Now how could this cause such Fundemental & Atheist antics?

I'm an atheist, but where it comes to creation that doesn't matter if you're talking about Creationism vs Evolution. Theistic Evolution believers would side with atheists on this one. Creationism is like a virus that wipes out logic based reason in individuals brought up in its backwards nonsense, it's seen all over these boards. So people at the individual level are corrupted by it. But on a scarier level, human advancement is corrupted by it. There's the saying "nothing in biology makes sense without evolution". Therefore, all research into cures for diseases and scientific endeavours of that nature show the Theory of Evolution to be correct every day. However, if Creationism was adopted and the ToE dropped from academic curriculums then there'd be no such research, and many more people would get sick. This is just one reason why the debate between Creationists and ToE acceptors is important.

What annoys me most is the movement to get Creationism taught as an alternative to evolution in schools. No doubt some students would side with Creationism due to pressure and deceit from parents, and they would be lost to faulty beliefs for perhaps the remainder of their lives, destined to be a laughing stock to the rest of the enlightened world.

The point is – don’t let science become a stumbling block.
Guard your faith against the deceiver’s heretical talk.

Science has nothing to do with atheism, it's practised by people of all faiths or non-faiths. And atheists are not trying to deceive you, we're trying to open your eyes to reality and change the world for the better.

Mixing science with lies may make a potent poisoned cocktail.
And drinking it may cause some to allow their faith to fail.

Very true.

So, let not the atheist slay you faith and heart and hope.

Atheists who debate with theists are simply trying to open your eyes to the truth, much in the same way you believe you are to us.

So if God spoke the universe into existence
With a big-bang – a trillion miles in the distance
Science has no argument and offers no real resistance,
To my faith in His Truth. So what’s the difference?

Where it comes to the origin of the universe, personally I don't have an invested interest in debating this as it's not taught to school level students as far as I know, it's taught in university (at least in my day in Ireland). As I said before, it's the creationism/evolution "debate" that grinds my gears.

 

[TheReasoner]

I'm an atheist, but where it comes to creation that doesn't matter if you're talking about Creationism vs Evolution. Theistic Evolution believers would side with atheists on this one. Creationism is like a virus that wipes out logic based reason in individuals brought up in its backwards nonsense, it's seen all over these boards. So people at the individual level are corrupted by it. But on a scarier level, human advancement is corrupted by it. There's the saying "nothing in biology makes sense without evolution". Therefore, all research into cures for diseases and scientific endeavours of that nature show the Theory of Evolution to be correct every day. However, if Creationism was adopted and the ToE dropped from academic curriculums then there'd be no such research, and many more people would get sick. This is just one reason why the debate between Creationists and ToE acceptors is important.

I couldn't agree more.

What annoys me most is the movement to get Creationism taught as an alternative to evolution in schools. No doubt some students would side with Creationism due to pressure and deceit from parents, and they would be lost to faulty beliefs for perhaps the remainder of their lives, destined to be a laughing stock to the rest of the enlightened world.

the rest of the enlightened world?
Sir, I believe you are too kind. It would in my opinion exclude your nation from that league. At least as far as biology goes.

Science has nothing to do with atheism, it's practised by people of all faiths or non-faiths. And atheists are not trying to deceive you, we're trying to open your eyes to reality and change the world for the better.

I would not say that is exclusive to atheists. I would apply the same to myself and my friends. And we're Christians
But you are right. Science has nothing to do with religion. Be that atheism, Islam or Christianity. Science is truly areligious. It is not Atheistic. Not Christian. Not Hindi...
It is about understanding this world and making it better. And that is good. Sure, scientific results can be used for evil as well as good. Nukes are an example. But, to avoid or shun science because of that would be exactly like shunning sex because of rape.

Atheists who debate with theists are simply trying to open your eyes to the truth, much in the same way you believe you are to us.

Personally I am a Christian. My faith is strong. I am certain in my beliefs, and I honestly believe you could - well, would. gain a lot from this faith. Lose too, your life would change. It is my strong opinion that it would be good for you, and that it is not at all contrary to science or an informed lifestyle.
You seem an informed individual. I will not try to preach to you, but please keep in mind that just as some atheists are uninformed the same is true of Christians. Sad to say, some of us are also so far from the ideal Christ set before us they don't spread love, but rather seeds separation and conflict.
Oh, I will stick to my beliefs. You can believe homosexuality is wrong without sowing discord. Something some of my brothers and sisters in the faith could learn.

Where it comes to the origin of the universe, personally I don't have an invested interest in debating this as it's not taught to school level students as far as I know, it's taught in university (at least in my day in Ireland). As I said before, it's the creationism/evolution "debate" that grinds my gears.

aye. agreed.

Sir, I believe reps are in order for your post.
Have some!

 

[Raydon]

the rest of the enlightened world?
Sir, I believe you are too kind. It would in my opinion exclude your nation from that league. At least as far as biology goes.

Hehe, well I'm not a biologist myself so I don't know where Ireland stands on the advanced biology knowledge scale, be it for the layman or the professionals. Just out of pure curiosity, what would be your impression of us on this front?

Personally I am a Christian. My faith is strong. I am certain in my beliefs, and I honestly believe you could - well, would. gain a lot from this faith. Lose too, your life would change. It is my strong opinion that it would be good for you, and that it is not at all contrary to science or an informed lifestyle.

Like a lot of atheists, I was once a Christian, not too long ago actually, maybe a year ago I described myself as a "Liberal Christian". I was never strong in faith though, it waned steadily all through my teenage to adult life. Not to get off topic, but I'll agree to disagree on what I'd gain from reconverting

aye. agreed.

Sir, I believe reps are in order for your post.
Have some!

Thanks for your kind words and reps. I don't post that much, but I will again thanks to your positive and constructive reply

 

[gluadys]

Interesting prose: but.
If you cannot literally believe the first 11 chapters of Genesis, you will be open to questioning all of the Bible's truth.

Noonsense. Millions of Jews and Christians accept figurative interpretations of Genesis 1-11 without questioning the truth of even Genesis 1-11 much less the rest of the bible.

"figurative" =/="false" and "literal"=/="true".

Sometimes the truth is better seen in a figurative than in a literal reading.

 

[crawfish]

Interesting prose: but.
If you cannot literally believe the first 11 chapters of Genesis, you will be open to questioning all of the Bible's truth.

When you put literal truth in a place where it wasn't intended, don't be surprised when your faith is shattered when it's shown otherwise.

Read the posts on how a literal reading of the bible shows a flat earth, the sun revolving around the earth, grouping the stars with the moon (rather than the sun), and other issues. You have ALREADY started to question the bible's literal truth if you don't believe that stuff. The floodgates are already open.