George Best

LiberatedChick · Dec 3, 2005

Martin^^ said:
I understand your frustration, but the truth is that people with alcohol abuse problems have to take responsibility themselves, before anyone else can help them.

*nods in agreement*

theFijian · Dec 3, 2005

Some people are unable to take responsibility for themselves, such as chronic alcoholics. It seems Thatcher was right, there is no such thing as society if we can simply wash our hands of our responsibility to help these people.

Martin^^ · Dec 4, 2005

theFijian said:
Some people are unable to take responsibility for themselves, such as chronic alcoholics. It seems Thatcher was right, there is no such thing as society if we can simply wash our hands of our responsibility to help these people.

Helping is indeed our responsibility.

But seeking help is theirs...

theFijian · Dec 5, 2005

As I already said, some people are unable to take responsibility for themselves, they are unable to seek help. SO..do we still wash our hands of them?

Martin^^ · Dec 5, 2005

theFijian said:
As I already said, some people are unable to take responsibility for themselves, they are unable to seek help. SO..do we still wash our hands of them?

This is getting off-topic, since there was much more to George Best's life than alcoholism, but maybe he would welcome the idea of it being discussed.

What would you do? Section them?
There is no way of forcibly curing somebody of an addiction - would you keep them permanently locked up for their own protection?

We all have the right to choose for ourselves how we live our lives, and that carries responsibility. Alcoholics are not insane - they understand the consequences of their actions. We can support them in making better choices in life, but those choices remain theirs.

Nobody has said we should 'wash our hands' of them. But most people who help to support addicts know that they have to want to be helped.

The first step is to admit they have a problem, the next is to seek help. You cannot force another person to believe they have a problem. You cannot force them to seek help. They have to take those first steps for themselves. Only then can the rest of us help them up.

There is a separate forum for these issues, so I don't want to get too deeply involved here, but...

http://www.aa.org/default/en_about_aa_sub.cfm?subpageid=84&pageid=13

the original 12-step program, for anyone interested.

zaire · Dec 5, 2005

George Best = Legend.

theFijian · Dec 5, 2005

Martin^^ said:
There is no way of forcibly curing somebody of an addiction - would you keep them permanently locked up for their own protection?

No, but whilst not disagreeing with the rest of your post my original point was that if I ran an off-licence or pub I would not serve them alcohol. But apparently I'm in a minority there.

kurabrhm · Dec 6, 2005

theFijian said:
Right after you leave with your sycophant attitude. Celebrity idolarty is alive and well among Christians it seems.

That's a bit unfair on Paul_Norn_Iron. He obviously admires the late George Best.

There's a reason why he's referred to as the "Best"!

He was definitely "up there" alongside the likes of Pele. Today's footie stars are crawling in a pit fully of money which corrupts them and their fans, badly lacking in natural talent or charm. Best will be missed..

Aileen · Dec 6, 2005

Idolising someone we didn´t know? No, we Northern Irish folk didn´t idolise George Best...we loved him. warts and all. We all knew him...to all of us he was a local lad with a great gift (football), charisma, and also with the honesty to admit he had a problem that was bigger than him. He never tried to be something he wasn´t. Never tried to put on a posh accent but until the last spoke with a beautiful Belfast accent.
He made mistakes, sad ones but as Pastor Gordon said at the funeral, instead of criticising we should remember that there but for the grace of God go I.

To us he wasn´t just a footballer, he was wee Georgie Best, one of us.

irenemcg · Dec 7, 2005

Did anyone see the funeral on TV, the Gospel was preached?

Paul_Norn_Iron · Dec 7, 2005

It certainly was, my grandmother's a friend of Roy Gordon the request of the Best family, much to the fustration of the power's (not too powerful in this instance, however) that be.

George Best never blamed any one else but himself. I'm sure he's grateful for all the pity.

Aileen · Dec 8, 2005

To those who point a finger at George Best...remember three fingers are pointing at you yourself. If you get to heaven before I do say hello to Georgie for me.

FishandChips · Dec 8, 2005

Nepenthe said:
Perhaps not ironic at all, perhaps perfect timing. I noticed Bests picture on the front page of one newspaper last week (forget which one), sitting in a hospital bed, looking pretty grim with the tag 'These are the pictures George Best wants you to see' or words to that effect.

I only saw the paper in passing, so I didn't read the details, but it did cross my mind as to why would you want people to see you like that if not to make them understand how dire things were? Then again, I may well be overanalysing.

I reckon you've hit the nail on the head. I heard he was approached to support an alcohol awareness charity called thirst for life but died before he gave an answer.

theFijian · Dec 8, 2005

Aileen said:
If you get to heaven before I do say hello to Georgie for me.

I was not aware that Best was in fact a born-again Christian. It's a shame his lifestyle did not reflect his profession of faith.

Aileen · Dec 9, 2005

Jesus Christ said to the thief on the cross....Today you will be with me in heaven. His life style? That is the wonderful work of grace.

The Bible also says that some will be saved " by the skin of their teeth" "pulled like a brand from the fire" and that some will suffer punishment in heaven.

Tangnefedd · Dec 9, 2005

Seems mighty unfair to me if some creep has a deathbed conversion, and goes to heaven, yet an atheist who has led a very good life goes to hell, no justice in that at all imo!

Paul_Norn_Iron · Dec 9, 2005

Tangnefedd said:
Seems mighty unfair to me if some creep has a deathbed conversion, and goes to heaven, yet an atheist who has led a very good life goes to hell, no justice in that at all imo!

Goodness me...

Tangnefedd · Dec 9, 2005

BTW I wasn't referring to George Best!

Paul_Norn_Iron · Dec 9, 2005

I know.

theFijian · Dec 13, 2005

Aileen said:
Jesus Christ said to the thief on the cross....Today you will be with me in heaven. His life style? That is the wonderful work of grace.

The Bible also says that some will be saved " by the skin of their teeth" "pulled like a brand from the fire" and that some will suffer punishment in heaven.

And you have evidence of Georgie's death bed coversion of course.

Tangnefedd said:
Seems mighty unfair to me if some creep has a deathbed conversion, and goes to heaven, yet an atheist who has led a very good life goes to hell, no justice in that at all imo!

Well thank goodness we are saved by grace and not by works, if that's what you're clinging to then you had better be very very good this Christmas.

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