Faith Conversion is Not Allowed in Some Countries

[Servant222]

Here is an interesting item from today's BBC news http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/6327487.stm

A Malaysian Chinese couple are considering taking legal action against a hospital for sending them home with the wrong baby nearly 30 years ago.

The couple, who had always suspected a mix-up, were reunited with their biological son after a chance meeting in a shopping centre.

But the family may now face a battle with Malaysia's religious authorities.

As well as taking a Chinese name, the son wants to renounce Islam - something which is very difficult in Malaysia.

In a number of countries, your faith is officially registered on your birth certificate or other legal record, and it can be very difficult for a person to convert to another faith without risking political or personnel harassment.

Freedom of speech, and freedom from religious or ethnic intolerance, are two of the defining characteristics of a democracy and a country that doesn't allow its citizens to choose which religion they wish to embrace is, in my opinion, being repressive.

The thing that totalitarian regimes and terrorists fear the most is democracy and free speech. If we are to bring others to know Christ, then a valuable first step is do what we can to encourage these countries to adopt democratic principles.

 

[jesusxchick]

That's a sad story. It must be tough seeing a child grow up and then find out that it's not yours.

And about not being able to convert, talk about taking away peoples rights...

 

[norbie]

That's a sad story. It must be tough seeing a child grow up and then find out that it's not yours.

And about not being able to convert, talk about taking away peoples rights...

yes i agree it's a tragedy, but this is the reality of life: ones you are a muslem then you are for life. this is their believe.
the only way out would be to migrate to other country like the states or australia.
norbie

 

[Servant222]

Democracy gives us freedom, and the ability to more easily examine what we believe. I am sure that more Muslims learn about and are able to consider Christianity in North America and Europe than in any Islamic country.

So either we help establish democracies in some of these totalitarian regimes, or we allow more people who want peace and stability to emigrate to our Western democracies.

 

[billwald]

Doesn't matter as long as mosque attendance is not tracked. My driver's license says I weigh . . . .

 

[UberLutheran]

In countries such as Saudi Arabia, Iran, and northern Nigeria, conversion from Islam to Christianity (or any other religion, for that matter) is a crime punishable by death.

In fact, Christian churches, Baha'i temples, Hindu and Buddhist temples are not allowed to exist and adherents of these religions very often have to bribe local authorities to allow them to worship and conduct their religious services in movie theaters.

Under these kinds of circumstances, Christians (especially) learn to let go of their denominational differences and worship together. One would not find the kind of denominational arguments which all too frequently occur in CF messageboards because what few Christians there are HAVE to figure out a ways of getting along and coming to common ground -- or they won't be able to worship as a group at all.

 

[jesusxchick]

yes i agree it's a tragedy, but this is the reality of life: ones you are a muslem then you are for life. this is their believe.
the only way out would be to migrate to other country like the states or australia.
norbie

Very true.

One reason why I'm SO thankful to live in America because I have freedom of choice to be a Christian and rejoice in God's glory.

 

[Servant222]

So is it by God's design that we end up in a democratic country where we are free to choose Him?

I think a lot of Christians in democratic countries don't appreciate what a gift from God that is; really something to be thankful for.

 

[jesusxchick]

So is it by God's design that we end up in a democratic country where we are free to choose Him?

I think a lot of Christians in democratic countries don't appreciate what a gift from God that is; really something to be thankful for.

God has supplied our government for us and if that's what we have, then it's what we're meant to have. Doesn't mean that we don't get persecuted, but it's not the extreme as it is in foreign countries.

Many people do take it for granted because they don't realize how lucky we are to be able to express our love for God and thankfulness for Christ's sacrifice without being beaten or killed.

 

[Rusticus]

It must be said that the idea of "freedom of religion" is not a Christian virtue, but comes out of the value system of (secular) Liberal Democracies.

Not too long ago, Christians were persecuted and killed by other Christians either because they had converted to different Sect of Christianity, or because they were refusing to convert to a different Sect of Christianity.

 

[Servant222]

There are basic human rights that I think are universal and that we should always be striving to have societies adopt- freedom of speech and the freedom to chose one's religion being two.

"Christian" societies or organizations that are actually dictatorships, like some societies today, or organizations like the early churches that threatened to burn at the stake anyone that didn't believe in an earth-centered Universe, are no different in not respecting some of these fundamental values- but that doesn't mean we shouldn't continue to strive to have those values adopted.

Dictatorships that are suspicious about efforts to instill human rights are usually motivated by what they perceive to be a threat to their power. They will then use whatever excuse they can to stifle efforts to introduce human rights- for example, by claiming that others are trying to ram our system of values, or our religious beliefs, down their throats.

So we need to be very clear here: there is a fundamental difference between basic human rights and the unique characteristics of a given culture. We should always respect cultural differences- but strive hard to instill in all societies those basic human rights that I think are universal.

 

[Rusticus]

Iagree, Servant222, that these are noble ideals to aspire to....but looking at history we see that they are of very recent origin.

(Please don't misunderstand me: I personally hold freedom and religion, and many other "human rights" very dear.)

But we must remember that up to not very long ago it was accepted that a Nation was best placed to survive and prosper if all the Citizens within it were adherents of the same religion. It may just be so that this was the correct view, and that our love affair with "freedom of religion" will be prove to be our downfall.

 

[standingstones]

Who cares what the birth certificate says?

A man-made document is not binding with the Almighty. Renounce it and move on.

 

[Servant222]

Easier said than done in some countries. We who live in democracies have no idea how difficult it is to be a Christian, never mind converting to Christianity, in a repressive society- remember, even Jesus and his disciples were able to proselytize; in some countries today, that would probably land you in jail or worse.

Of course, God can do anything to anyone living anywhere. I wonder, though, whether part of His choosing us also involves determining what country in the world we happen to be born in.

 

[soblessed53]

yes i agree it's a tragedy, but this is the reality of life: ones you are a muslem then you are for life. this is their believe.
the only way out would be to migrate to other country like the states or australia.
norbie

This is not always possible before they are killed,nor is it a guarantee of safety if they do get away,if a cleric issues a "Fatwah" against them,which is the same as putting a contract out on them!

 

[Servant222]

So is the U.S. pursuing a rational policy by announcing yesterday that they will allow at least 7,000 Iraqi's to immigrate to the U.S.?

One could argue that this will allow people who have shown by their flight out of Iraq, and loss of all they own, that they reject violence and want to live in a democratic society.

Of course, this also means that these immigrants must accept the right of anyone to question and change, without retribution, their religious beliefs, and also to accept people who may have different religious beliefs than their own.