Examples for Us

[Christsfreeservant]

Friday, December 30, 2016, 6:19 p.m. – The Lord Jesus put in mind the song “Draw Me Close to You.” Speak, Lord, your words to my heart. I read 1 Corinthians 9:24-10:13 (ESV).

Running the Race (9:24-27)

“Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable. So I do not run aimlessly; I do not box as one beating the air. But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified.”​

Evidently the race Paul had in mind here was an athletic contest similar to the Olympics. The athletes went into the strictest of training for these games. The athletes had to be fully dedicated to the contest, doing what it took to win, for them even to be considered as contestants (or participants), I believe. And, they had to be very self-disciplined, exercising self-control in all things, always keeping before them the goal of winning the prize.

And, so we should be, not in our own strength and power, but in the strength and power of the Spirit of God living within us. We should have the same type of commitment to our Lord and to the race he has set before us, which is our walk of faith in Christ Jesus, our Lord. We should not be meandering around aimlessly, with no real direction, doing what pleases ourselves, with little thought to what we were saved from, and to what we were saved for (or to). For Jesus died, not just so we could escape hell and go to heaven when we die. He died that we might die to sin and live to righteousness (1 Pet. 2:24).

“Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, 2 looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God” (Heb. 12:1-2).

“An athlete is not crowned unless he competes according to the rules” (2 Tim. 2:5).​

We can’t serve God and our flesh, too. We can’t walk in the Spirit and walk according to our sinful flesh, to fulfill our fleshly desires. This does not mean we will be perfect, or that we will never sin, but it means that when we believe in Jesus we die to sin so that we might live to righteousness. The Holy Spirit of God transforms our hearts and minds away from living in sin to living in victory over sin because of what Jesus did in dying for our sin. We now have the Holy Spirit living within us teaching, guiding, empowering, strengthening, encouraging, counseling, correcting and convicting us so that we know the direction not to go, and so we know the way we ought to go.

The Christian life is not free from rules. The New Testament is our rule book for Christian living, and it contains many, many rules by which we are supposed to live as followers of Christ. There are all kinds of dos and don’ts, and put ons and put offs, and warnings of the consequences should we decide to ignore the rules and to go our own way instead. Those who would tell you that God requires nothing of us at all are telling you lies. Jesus and his NT apostles taught repentance and obedience as required for salvation and for forgiveness of sins. So, we need to put off sin, and put on Christ and his righteousness, getting rid of even the things which might lead us into sin, so that we can run the race God has marked out for us to run.

God was Not Pleased (10:1-5)

For I do not want you to be unaware, brothers, that our fathers were all under the cloud, and all passed through the sea, and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, and all ate the same spiritual food, and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank from the spiritual Rock that followed them, and the Rock was Christ. Nevertheless, with most of them God was not pleased, for they were overthrown in the wilderness.​

There is a popular teaching today, even in evangelical churches, that says that once you believe in Jesus that God is pleased with you no matter what you do. That is blatantly false. It is not what the Bible teaches at all. And, some take it a step further by saying that God delights in us even when we are steeped in sin and rebellion against him, and we are ignoring his commands, and we are boldly and willfully choosing to sin against him, and right in his face, too. At least, that is what is implied.

Yet, consider these verses: “Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God” (Ro. 8:8). “So we make it our goal to please him, whether we are at home in the body or away from it” (2 Co. 5:9). “Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life” (Gal. 6:8). “No one serving as a soldier gets entangled in civilian affairs, but rather tries to please his commanding officer” (2 Tim. 2:4). “And do not forget to do good and to share with others, for with such sacrifices God is pleased” (Heb. 13:6). "...and find out what pleases The Lord" (Eph. 5:10).

Don’t Put Christ to Test (10:6-13)

Now these things took place as examples for us, that we might not desire evil as they did. Do not be idolaters as some of them were; as it is written, “The people sat down to eat and drink and rose up to play.” We must not indulge in sexual immorality as some of them did, and twenty-three thousand fell in a single day. We must not put Christ to the test, as some of them did and were destroyed by serpents, nor grumble, as some of them did and were destroyed by the Destroyer. Now these things happened to them as an example, but they were written down for our instruction, on whom the end of the ages has come. Therefore let anyone who thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall. No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but with the temptation he will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it.​

So, because God was not pleased with the Israelites whom he had delivered out of slavery in Egypt, but who continually rebelled against him in the desert, even turning to false gods in rejection of the One True God, he killed them all off so that they were not able to enter the Promised Land. Only those who remained faithful to God and believed him and did what he said were able to enter. And, this was written down for us (Christians) as an example to us so that we don’t do like they did, and end up not being able to enter our “promised land,” i.e. eternal life with God in glory.

For you see, Jesus said that if we would come after him we must deny self and take up our cross daily and follow him. He said if we hold on to our old lives (of living for sin and self), we will lose them for eternity. But if we lose our lives (are crucified with Christ in death to sin), we will gain eternal life. Paul reiterated this when he said that if we walk according to our sinful flesh, we will die (in our sins), but if by the Spirit we are putting to death the deeds of the flesh, we will live (with Christ for eternity). And, John said that if we say we have fellowship with God, but we walk (in lifestyle) in the darkness, we are liars, and we don’t live by the truth (See: Lu. 9:23-25; Ro. 8:1-14; 1 Jn. 1:6).

So, don’t put Christ to the test, i.e. don’t test the limits of his grace. You know the rules. Live by them, and do not do what you know is contrary to his commands (his teachings/instructions to us). If you do, you are playing with fire, and the end result may not be what you are expecting at all. He died that you might no longer live for yourself, but for him who gave his life up for you, so choose to live to please him in all things from now on.

Draw Me Close to You / Donnie McClurkin

Draw me close to You
Never let me go
I lay it all down again
To hear You say that I'm Your friend

You are my desire
And no one else will do
'Cause nothing else can take Your place
To feel the warmth of Your embrace

Help me find a way
Bring me back to You
You’re all I want…

 

[John Hyperspace]

And, John said that if we say we have fellowship with God, but we walk (in lifestyle) in the darkness, we are liars, and we don’t live by the truth (See: Lu. 9:23-25; Ro. 8:1-14; 1 Jn. 1:6).

What John meant by "walking in darkness" means hating your brother: 1 John 2:9, to walk in the light is to love your brother: 1 John 1:7, 1 John 2:9-11. Light is love, darkness is hate. Pretty simple (for some people, others I suppose have a difficult time loving others). But all of the commandments are summed up in one neat little commandment of the new covenant, the new commandment of the Son: John 13:34-35, 2 John 1:5.

So speak the apostles rightly: James 2:8. Love your neighbor? You do well. Don't get tangled up in the "many, many" rules of rule-mongering: Matthew 23:4. But Jesus said His yoke was easy: Matthew 11:30. It doesn't get much easier than "love your neighbor" and whosoever loves: 1 John 4:7-8 To walk after the flesh is to walk after the law; only death can result; but to walk after the Spirit is to walk after grace in love unfeigned. Now, this love will cause one to become a "law unto themselves" have the law written on their heart by the finger of God, which is love; and not on stone by the finger of fire. Thus, one who truly loves others will not murder them, nor bear false witness of them, nor covet them (but rejoice with them in the things wherein they are blessed by God). Love will not allow one to hurt another; and by so, fulfill the law by their very nature, instead of by threat of wrath. Romans 13:10, Galatians 5:14

If you claim to be in Christ, yet the only reason you do not hurt others is because you are commanded to refrain from working ill toward your neighbor under threat of consequences; then you are not really in Christ, and walk in darkness (though you do no harm, it is not because your have a loving heart, but only because you cannot get away with it)

For them that attempt to place rules upon rules upon rules on your shoulders (while they themselves not lifting a finger to ease your burden) keep in mind, the apostles at the first did no such thing, but gave scant counsel: Acts 21:25: not many "rules" there, are there? But there is one commandment from the Son, to those who would be joined to Him by His new covenant: John 13:34-35, so if you truly love others: James 2:8 you do well.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

QUOTE="Christsfreeservant, post: 70619057, member: 158768"For Jesus died, not just so we could escape hell and go to heaven when we die. He died that we might die to sin and live to righteousness (1 Pet. 2:24).

“Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, 2 looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God” (Heb. 12:1-2).

“An athlete is not crowned unless he competes according to the rules” (2 Tim. 2:5). QUOTE
Amein !

 

[Christsfreeservant]

What John meant by "walking in darkness" means hating your brother: 1 John 2:9, to walk in the light is to love your brother: 1 John 1:7, 1 John 2:9-11. Light is love, darkness is hate. Pretty simple (for some people, others I suppose have a difficult time loving others). But all of the commandments are summed up in one neat little commandment of the new covenant, the new commandment of the Son: John 13:34-35, 2 John 1:5.

So speak the apostles rightly: James 2:8. Love your neighbor? You do well. Don't get tangled up in the "many, many" rules of rule-mongering: Matthew 23:4. But Jesus said His yoke was easy: Matthew 11:30. It doesn't get much easier than "love your neighbor" and whosoever loves: 1 John 4:7-8 To walk after the flesh is to walk after the law; only death can result; but to walk after the Spirit is to walk after grace in love unfeigned. Now, this love will cause one to become a "law unto themselves" have the law written on their heart by the finger of God, which is love; and not on stone by the finger of fire. Thus, one who truly loves others will not murder them, nor bear false witness of them, nor covet them (but rejoice with them in the things wherein they are blessed by God). Love will not allow one to hurt another; and by so, fulfill the law by their very nature, instead of by threat of wrath. Romans 13:10, Galatians 5:14

If you claim to be in Christ, yet the only reason you do not hurt others is because you are commanded to refrain from working ill toward your neighbor under threat of consequences; then you are not really in Christ, and walk in darkness (though you do no harm, it is not because your have a loving heart, but only because you cannot get away with it)

For them that attempt to place rules upon rules upon rules on your shoulders (while they themselves not lifting a finger to ease your burden) keep in mind, the apostles at the first did no such thing, but gave scant counsel: Acts 21:25: not many "rules" there, are there? But there is one commandment from the Son, to those who would be joined to Him by His new covenant: John 13:34-35, so if you truly love others: James 2:8 you do well.

I am planning to respond to you as soon as time allows.

 

[John Hyperspace]

QUOTE="Christsfreeservant, post: 70619057, member: 158768"For Jesus died, not just so we could escape hell and go to heaven when we die. He died that we might die to sin and live to righteousness (1 Pet. 2:24).

“Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, 2 looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God” (Heb. 12:1-2).

“An athlete is not crowned unless he competes according to the rules” (2 Tim. 2:5). QUOTE
Amein !

I surely agree with those passages you quote. The question is, what do they mean; by what way are these things accomplished? People often quote passages thinking that the passages support what they think the passages mean. But, all passages will mean to us what we think they mean. The original post used John's words of "walking in the light" as though it meant "lifestyle" without defining what that lifestyle was. The poster was reading their own understanding into the message. But, John is defining his words to mean, love and hate. Walking in light is walking in love of brother, while walking in darkness, is walking in hatred of brother (as additionally cited): this is a lifestyle, but it has nothing to do with sin in the flesh; it has to do with sin in the heart: love and hate.

The verses you cite don't explain themselves, in and of themselves. What does the writer mean by "lay aside every weight, and sin which clings"? By what way do we do this? If a man sins, has he failed to "lay aside every sin": what does it mean to "lay aside every sin"? Does it mean to allow the flesh to work no sin? If so, how does the man have sin to lay aside to begin with?

The second passage: what are the "rules"? By what way does a person strive? What is the contest of which Paul speaks?

 

[Christsfreeservant]

What John meant by "walking in darkness" means hating your brother: 1 John 2:9, to walk in the light is to love your brother: 1 John 1:7, 1 John 2:9-11. Light is love, darkness is hate. Pretty simple (for some people, others I suppose have a difficult time loving others). But all of the commandments are summed up in one neat little commandment of the new covenant, the new commandment of the Son: John 13:34-35, 2 John 1:5.

So speak the apostles rightly: James 2:8. Love your neighbor? You do well. Don't get tangled up in the "many, many" rules of rule-mongering: Matthew 23:4. But Jesus said His yoke was easy: Matthew 11:30. It doesn't get much easier than "love your neighbor" and whosoever loves: 1 John 4:7-8 To walk after the flesh is to walk after the law; only death can result; but to walk after the Spirit is to walk after grace in love unfeigned. Now, this love will cause one to become a "law unto themselves" have the law written on their heart by the finger of God, which is love; and not on stone by the finger of fire. Thus, one who truly loves others will not murder them, nor bear false witness of them, nor covet them (but rejoice with them in the things wherein they are blessed by God). Love will not allow one to hurt another; and by so, fulfill the law by their very nature, instead of by threat of wrath. Romans 13:10, Galatians 5:14

If you claim to be in Christ, yet the only reason you do not hurt others is because you are commanded to refrain from working ill toward your neighbor under threat of consequences; then you are not really in Christ, and walk in darkness (though you do no harm, it is not because your have a loving heart, but only because you cannot get away with it)

For them that attempt to place rules upon rules upon rules on your shoulders (while they themselves not lifting a finger to ease your burden) keep in mind, the apostles at the first did no such thing, but gave scant counsel: Acts 21:25: not many "rules" there, are there? But there is one commandment from the Son, to those who would be joined to Him by His new covenant: John 13:34-35, so if you truly love others: James 2:8 you do well.

Would you please give your definition of love, both what it means to love God and what it means to love others? thanks!

 

[Christsfreeservant]

What John meant by "walking in darkness" means hating your brother: 1 John 2:9, to walk in the light is to love your brother: 1 John 1:7, 1 John 2:9-11. Light is love, darkness is hate. Pretty simple (for some people, others I suppose have a difficult time loving others). But all of the commandments are summed up in one neat little commandment of the new covenant, the new commandment of the Son: John 13:34-35, 2 John 1:5.

So speak the apostles rightly: James 2:8. Love your neighbor? You do well. Don't get tangled up in the "many, many" rules of rule-mongering: Matthew 23:4. But Jesus said His yoke was easy: Matthew 11:30. It doesn't get much easier than "love your neighbor" and whosoever loves: 1 John 4:7-8 To walk after the flesh is to walk after the law; only death can result; but to walk after the Spirit is to walk after grace in love unfeigned. Now, this love will cause one to become a "law unto themselves" have the law written on their heart by the finger of God, which is love; and not on stone by the finger of fire. Thus, one who truly loves others will not murder them, nor bear false witness of them, nor covet them (but rejoice with them in the things wherein they are blessed by God). Love will not allow one to hurt another; and by so, fulfill the law by their very nature, instead of by threat of wrath. Romans 13:10, Galatians 5:14

If you claim to be in Christ, yet the only reason you do not hurt others is because you are commanded to refrain from working ill toward your neighbor under threat of consequences; then you are not really in Christ, and walk in darkness (though you do no harm, it is not because your have a loving heart, but only because you cannot get away with it)

For them that attempt to place rules upon rules upon rules on your shoulders (while they themselves not lifting a finger to ease your burden) keep in mind, the apostles at the first did no such thing, but gave scant counsel: Acts 21:25: not many "rules" there, are there? But there is one commandment from the Son, to those who would be joined to Him by His new covenant: John 13:34-35, so if you truly love others: James 2:8 you do well.

John 14:23-24: “Jesus answered him, “If anyone loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. Whoever does not love me does not keep my words. And the word that you hear is not mine but the Father's who sent me.”

1 John 2:3-6: “By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.”

1 John 3:24: “Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.”

1 John 5:3: “This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome…”

2 John 1:6: “And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love.”

Commandments are divine rules; instructions. If we love God, we obey his commandments (rules). If we love God, we love others, because God's love is living within us. We love because he first loved us, and he gave his life up for us. We don't love just because we are commanded to love, but we love because God loved us and because his love is within us. And, we don't obey just because we are commanded to obey, but because we love God and we desire to please him above all else. It is all based in love - love for God and love for others because God is love, and because he loved us, and because his love is within us.

 

[Christsfreeservant]

What John meant by "walking in darkness" means hating your brother: 1 John 2:9, to walk in the light is to love your brother: 1 John 1:7, 1 John 2:9-11. Light is love, darkness is hate. Pretty simple (for some people, others I suppose have a difficult time loving others). But all of the commandments are summed up in one neat little commandment of the new covenant, the new commandment of the Son: John 13:34-35, 2 John 1:5.

darkness - Cognate: 4653 skotía (a feminine noun) – darkness, a brand of moral, spiritual obscurity (i.e. which blocks the light of God when faith is lacking). Strong's Greek: 4653. σκοτία (skotia) -- darkness

darkness - 4655 skótos (a neuter noun) – properly, darkness (obscurity); (figuratively) the principle of sin with its certain results. Strong's Greek: 4655. σκότος (skotos) -- darkness

"...and walk in darkness; in the darkness of sin, ignorance, and unbelief, or are in a state of unregeneracy and blindness; whose understandings are darkened, and they know not God in Christ, nor have any true sight and sense of themselves, their sin and danger; and are ignorant of Christ and his righteousness, and the way of salvation by him; and are strangers to the Spirit of God, and the work of his grace; and are unacquainted with the truths of the Gospel; and not only so, but go on in darkness more and more; prefer it to the light, love it, and the works of it; have fellowship with them, and choose them; take pleasure in the ways of sin and wickedness, and continue, and walk on in them; if such persons pretend to fellowship with God, they are liars..." Gil's Exposition of the Bible

 

[Christsfreeservant]

To walk after the flesh is to walk after the law; only death can result; but to walk after the Spirit is to walk after grace in love unfeigned. Now, this love will cause one to become a "law unto themselves" have the law written on their heart by the finger of God, which is love; and not on stone by the finger of fire. Thus, one who truly loves others will not murder them, nor bear false witness of them, nor covet them (but rejoice with them in the things wherein they are blessed by God). Love will not allow one to hurt another; and by so, fulfill the law by their very nature, instead of by threat of wrath. Romans 13:10, Galatians 5:14

4561 (sarks) is generally negative, referring to making decisions (actions) according to self – i.e. done apart from faith (independent from God's inworking). Thus what is "of the flesh (carnal)" is by definition displeasing to the Lord – even things that seem "respectable!" In short, flesh generally relates to unaided human effort, i.e. decisions (actions) that originate from self or are empowered by self. This is carnal ("of the flesh") and proceeds out of the untouched (unchanged) part of us – i.e. what is not transformed by God. Strong's Greek: 4561. σάρξ (sarx) -- flesh

 

[Christsfreeservant]

To walk after the flesh is to walk after the law; only death can result; but to walk after the Spirit is to walk after grace in love unfeigned. Now, this love will cause one to become a "law unto themselves" have the law written on their heart by the finger of God, which is love; and not on stone by the finger of fire. Thus, one who truly loves others will not murder them, nor bear false witness of them, nor covet them (but rejoice with them in the things wherein they are blessed by God). Love will not allow one to hurt another; and by so, fulfill the law by their very nature, instead of by threat of wrath. Romans 13:10, Galatians 5:14

"Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God." Gal. 5:19-21

 

[John Hyperspace]

Would you please give your definition of love, both what it means to love God and what it means to love others? thanks!

If you need me to define love, I would think you don't know it. I mean this not as offense, but as truth. Do you not know what love is?

 

[John Hyperspace]

John 14:23-24: “Jesus answered him, “If anyone loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. Whoever does not love me does not keep my words. And the word that you hear is not mine but the Father's who sent me.”

1 John 2:3-6: “By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.”

1 John 3:24: “Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.”

1 John 5:3: “This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome…”

2 John 1:6: “And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love.”

Commandments are divine rules; instructions. If we love God, we obey his commandments (rules). If we love God, we love others, because God's love is living within us. We love because he first loved us, and he gave his life up for us. We don't love just because we are commanded to love, but we love because God loved us and because his love is within us. And, we don't obey just because we are commanded to obey, but because we love God and we desire to please him above all else. It is all based in love - love for God and love for others because God is love, and because he loved us, and because his love is within us.

Yes, and both Jesus and John give the commandment: John 13:34-35, John 15:12, 1 John 3:23, 2 John 1:5

Can I ask you, what commandments you would place onto others?

 

[John Hyperspace]

darkness - Cognate: 4653 skotía (a feminine noun) – darkness, a brand of moral, spiritual obscurity (i.e. which blocks the light of God when faith is lacking). Strong's Greek: 4653. σκοτία (skotia) -- darkness

darkness - 4655 skótos (a neuter noun) – properly, darkness (obscurity); (figuratively) the principle of sin with its certain results. Strong's Greek: 4655. σκότος (skotos) -- darkness

"...and walk in darkness; in the darkness of sin, ignorance, and unbelief, or are in a state of unregeneracy and blindness; whose understandings are darkened, and they know not God in Christ, nor have any true sight and sense of themselves, their sin and danger; and are ignorant of Christ and his righteousness, and the way of salvation by him; and are strangers to the Spirit of God, and the work of his grace; and are unacquainted with the truths of the Gospel; and not only so, but go on in darkness more and more; prefer it to the light, love it, and the works of it; have fellowship with them, and choose them; take pleasure in the ways of sin and wickedness, and continue, and walk on in them; if such persons pretend to fellowship with God, they are liars..." Gil's Exposition of the Bible

Gill's words are unnecssary, having the words of John himself, and that which he writes what he means by "walking in darkness" as opposed to "walking in light": 1 John 2:9-11

 

[Christsfreeservant]

If you need me to define love, I would think you don't know it. I mean this not as offense, but as truth. Do you not know what love is?

Yes, I do. See: Fathomless Love

 

[John Hyperspace]

Yes, I do. See: Fathomless Love

No need. I know what love is. Most people do.

 

[Christsfreeservant]

Yes, and both Jesus and John give the commandment: John 13:34-35, John 15:12, 1 John 3:23, 2 John 1:5

Can I ask you, what commandments you would place onto others?

Only the ones Jesus taught and his NT apostles taught as from God and for the church, i.e. for followers of Christ Jesus. Yes, they can be summarized in the 2 greatest commandments, but Jesus and his NT apostles still saw fit to spell them out for us time and time again.

 

[Christsfreeservant]

No need. I know what love is. Most people do.

I would say most people don't, since most people don't know Jesus Christ as Lord and as Savior of their lives.

 

[John Hyperspace]

Only the ones Jesus taught and his NT apostles taught as from God and for the church, i.e. for followers of Christ Jesus. Yes, they can be summarized in the 2 greatest commandments, but Jesus and his NT apostles still saw fit to spell them out for us time and time again.

Could you explain why the apostles did this: Acts 21:25? Why didn't the apostles re-iterate the law? The commandments? Why just those four things? And, why those four things? I'm not denying the commandments exist, nor that Paul often speaks of "works of the flesh"; but I'm disputing what these mean, how Paul means them to be understood. How we deal with "sin in the flesh" and what it means to "obey the commandment" and furthermore, which commandments?

Jesus states that as He fulfilled His Father's commandments, we should obey His commandment: John 15:10-12, His "new" commandment: John 13:34; and John explains this commandment in his letters very well: it is the difference between walking in light, and walking in darkness: 1 John 2:10-11, 1 John 3:14; of knowing God, and, not knowing God: 1 John 4:7-8. I don't believe the concept of "love" is difficult to grasp, or, needs defined out time and again. It is simple to them that know love.

But when speaking of things "of the flesh" I don't believe Paul is talking about something other than being, under law, or, under grace: by which thing this is manifest in the "children of the flesh" and the "children of the promise": Romans 9:7-8: so when Paul is differentiating between "works of the flesh" and "fruits of the spirit" he is talking about, whether or not one is "under law""of the flesh" or "under grace""of the promise": one who is "under law" is accused by the law, and all these "works of the flesh" are accused of him, and he retains his sin; yet them "under grace" have no sin imputed to them by the law, and have not these "works of the flesh" imputed to them, but being "under grace" have these "fruits of the spirit" instead.

So Paul isn't really talking about, what your flesh is doing; but, what is reckoned to a man depending on where he is, under law, or, under grace. Whoever is under law is wicked, and a transgressor, a murder, a thief, an idolater, an adultery, full of lust and envy; but them under grace are not these things because no sin is imputed, and instead, they bear the fruit of the spirit, against such there being no law.

Now, no man who has unfeigned love of God will be an idolater, and no man having unfeigned love of neighbor will work ill toward his name: he will not murder, nor bear false witness, no commit adultery or covet the neighbor's belongings; this is clear, but this is not "keeping commandments" this is an act of the spirit. Must you resist murder, to keep the commandment "do no murder"? Or, do you simply not even have to try because it is your nature in love of others to do no hurt?

 

[John Hyperspace]

I would say most people don't, since most people don't know Jesus Christ as Lord and as Savior of their lives.

There are a lot of people that aren't very loving people. But, love is known of them that love: 1 John 4:7-8. But it is clear that a man who hates his brother does not know God: 1 John 2:11. Now, this is not a difficult or complicated thing, to love others, but, the heart must know love, surely. I believe there are many who know Jesus and do not yet realize it, because Christian doctrine has muddied the waters of knowing Him; but whoever knows love, knows God, as John writes: this is also said by Paul when speaking of them "outside the covenant" i.e. the Gentiles: Romans 2:14-15. Now, how did these Gentiles without the covenant to the Lord, fulfill the law and are said to have the law "written in their hearts"? To believe in Jesus is to believe in love of others, that is His commandment: John 15:12.