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I don't claim "apparent age," chief.Your "apparent age" claims require God to plant fossils in the ground as part of the creation. That is Omphalos/Last Thursdayism.
I don't claim "apparent age," chief.
I claim "embedded age."
That claim, embedded age, requires God to plant fossils in the ground as part of the initial creation week.
That claim, embedded age, requires God to plant fossils in the ground as part of the initial creation week.
I am unaware of any examples of retroviruses taking the DNA out of one species and transferring it to another. Do you have references?
All of the reading that I have done shows that only the retroviral genes are inserted into the host genome.
Retroviral genes evolve to take on function as part of the host genome. This is evidence against evolution how?
I am saying that they are genetic markers, not missing links.
That claim, embedded age, requires God to plant fossils in the ground as part of the initial creation week.
Are you claiming that rocks date old by radiometric dating because of embedded age? Yes or no?
Sure you are, you just ignore the data is all.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horizontal_gene_transfer
"Horizontal gene transfer (HGT) refers to the transfer of genes between organisms in a manner other than traditional reproduction...
http://mbio.asm.org/content/2/1/e00005-11.long
Because you only read things that support your belief and dismiss everything that falsifies it. So of course you haven't, because you've never bothered to look for it.
http://www.pnas.org/content/105/44/17023.short
http://www.genengnews.com/gen-news-...o-humans-primates-and-other-animals/81251033/
Because they occur mainly in the reproductive genes - and so trace genes passed on after being "co-opted"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endogenous_retrovirus
I'm saying you can't say anything because we know those retroviruses are not native to the host. Those retroviruses are where the shared genomes exist. And those retroviruses have been empirically shown to transfer genes amongst mammal, despite you wanting it to be only amongst bacteria, so you can still keep your faith.
You can't answer the question?
What data have you shown supporting the claim that host genes are transported between complex eukaryote species by retroviruses? As far as I am aware, only retroviral genes are inserted by retroviruses in the species we are talking about. The example you give is for a bacteria which is hardly a problem for comparing chimp and human genomes.
Apparently, you don't read your own sources:
"HGT occurs at low, but appreciable, levels across all the animal species we examined; it has occurred over time and is still occurring; it mainly originates from bacteria and protists"
Retrovirsuse are not bacteria, nor are they protists. Nowhere does your reference give examples of retroviruses excising host DNA from one species and then shuttling it over to another species for the species groups we are discussing.
Moreover, you claim that they can't determine which DNA is vertically inherited because of HGT. Your own references refute this claim.
None of your references show retroviruses shuttling mammalian genes between mammals.
Apparently you don't read your own sources. Again - the odds against any life forming is what? And successful passing on a benefiting mutation is what?
Now suddenly infrequent is something you can't accept? While you can readily accept the odds of mutation over and over and over again for every species that exists? I have never yet seen an evolutionist that can keep a consistent argument for their beliefs.
So we both agree mutation can be dismissed as a cause of new genetic material because of 1) it's rarity - even rarer than HGT.
"Herein, we described several new complete ERV-K elements in the genomes of the common chimpanzee (Pan troglodytes) and rhesus monkey (Macaca mulatta) and compared them to those found in humans. We show, for the first time, that the demographic history of the host may be a major factor determining the dynamics of an endogenous retrovirus. Despite the draft quality of the rhesus genome assembly, we found many complete proviruses that have a marked similarity in their fluctuating demographic history to that of humans, with both these species distinct from that observed in the chimpanzee...
More like I don't want to contribute to your industrious attempts at keeping yourself from understanding the difference between apparent age and embedded age.
Then help me understand it. Why do igneous rocks date old by radiometric dating?
I'll pass.
That's because you know that embedded age requires God to plant fossils in the ground.
I would suggest that the multiverse is more scientific than god, in that I can (at least potentially) define a test for whether the multiverse is verifiable. God, at least for any definition that I have been exposed to, is not scientifically verifiable at all. But that having been said, I'm not aware of a test of a multiverse hypothesis that has been defined, much less carried out.A multiverse only pushes the problem back one step and a multiverse is not anymore scientific than God and less convincing IMHO. There are those that do entertain a multiverse but others have shown how it is not the answer to the fine tuning.
I thought you said Omphalos/Last Thursday did that?
Can you define embeded age creation?I am saying that embedded age is Omphalos in the same way that Last Thursdayism is Omphalos, even though you try to pretend otherwise.
Can you define embeded age creation?
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