Error of translation ?

[Blissman]

Matthew 19:24

Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

A neighbor of mine is a scholar of language, including the original languages of the Bibile. Part of the Bible as written in Aramaic. There are three words that sound similar (I don't know how to spell these, but I will approx).

Guma Gumba Gumsa

These sound similar, but they have different meanings. One means eye of needle, one means camel, and one means 'eye crud'.

Eye of needle may also mean door or passageway.

 

[wonder111]

this was posted somewhere before, and many had said that people use this as an excuse to change the meaning of the story. I personally believe the people understood it as the eye of a needle, but either way, the meaning of the story remains the same

 

[Lyle]

Though there are many historians that believe it is actually a small gate that was built into the walls of jerusalem in that day.. The Eye of a Needle, and was such that a camel would have to get down upon it's knees if it were to hobble through...

trupēma rhaphis (that's it's original Hebrew, which this portion of the Bible was written in).

 

[jon1101]

I've heard that as well, Blissman, and, as I understand it, it is likely that an error occurred somewhere between the initial intent of that verse and how we read it in our Bible's today. Personally, I don't have any theological problem with the idea that the Bible we read today is erroneous here and there. It seems straightforwardly true that any time fallible people get involved, the idea of maintaining infallibility becomes unreasonable.

-jon

 

[Crazy Liz]

It is quite possible Jesus said these words in Aramaic, and then his Aramaic words were translated into Greek by the authors of the gospels. The Aramaic words for "camel" and "rope" are very similar, and rope would fit the metaphor better.

 

[The Thadman]

This whole thing about the "door" or "eye of the needle" as a gate in Jerusalem is bunk. There is no archeological evidence to support it, as no gate in Jerusalem is and has ever been known as the "eye of the needle." The entire story was made up in, I believe, the mid 1800s for a sermon.

http://www.AramaicNT.org/index.php?PAGE=Luke/Camel

In Aramaic, the word for "Camel" is "Gamlo" (Gomal-Meem-Lomadh-'Olaf, in Hebrew translitteration, spelled "Gimal-Mim-Lamed-Alef"). According to all fo the major Aramaic Lexical works, "Gamlo" also means "thick shipbinding rope," the kind that is made from many smaller cords bound together.

In this light, the parable is talking about taking something about the thickness of someone's wrist and shoving it though the small eye of a needle. This is also interesting that the word mean "shipbinding rope" because Jesus' earliest followers were fishermen.

This is not the only translational blunder in the New Testament either. Poor Simon, the father of Judas Iscariot, was labeled as a "Leper" because the Aramaic words for "Leper" ("Garvo") and "Potter" ("Garovo") are seperated by a single, unwritten vowel (as Aramaic, like Hebrew, was not written with vowels until after the 4th-5th century). Why else would the field be known as the "Potter's Field"?

Many more are equally striking, and the amount of poetry and wordplay that has been lost with Greek translation is very saddening.

Lexical References for "Gamlo":

Thesaurus Syriacus. (p. 736) (Citing Bar Ali and Bar Bahlul)
"gamlo" - funis navalis (Latin: "ship rope")

Manna, J. E.. Vocabulaire Chaldeen-Arabe. Mosul 1900 (p. 111)
"gamlo" - hablu l-safina (Arabic: "ship cable")

Audo, Thomas. Dictionnaire De La Langue Chaldeenne. Mosul 1897 (p. 46)
"gamlo" - Khavlo `avyo' d-sfeentho. (Syriac Aramaic: "thick ship cable")

Lane p.461
Citing amongst others Tabari and the Qamus, gives:

gummalun
-cable
-rope of a ship
-the thick rope thereof consisting of a number of ropes put together

gumlatun -
-a strand of thick rope or many strands of rope put together (to compose a cable) any aggregate unseparated

Poosh ba-Shlomo,
(Stay in peace)

 

[revolutio]

This whole thing about the "door" or "eye of the needle" as a gate in Jerusalem is bunk. There is no archeological evidence to support it, as no gate in Jerusalem is and has ever been known as the "eye of the needle." The entire story was made up in, I believe, the mid 1800s for a sermon.

Do you have any info on this? I am always interested to learn.