Epilepsy & Demon Possession

Anthony · Jan 22, 2004

Seek God First, but listen

During a major a flood, and man prayed to God for safety and to save him. The water from the flood came into his house, so he went on top of the roof. A rescue boat came, by and he said no I'm praying to the Lord for my rescue. Later a Helicopter came by to pluck him off his house, he said no, I'm praying to the Lord for my rescue. The water eventually surround his house, and he drown and died.

In heaven he ask God why he had not save him. To which God say, I sent you a boat, I sent you a Helicopter, what else were expected?

SpiritPsalmist · Jan 22, 2004

Anthony said:
Seek God First, but listen

During a major a flood, and man prayed to God for safety and to save him. The water from the flood came into his house, so he went on top of the roof. A rescue boat came, by and he said no I'm praying to the Lord for my rescue. Later a Helicopter came by to pluck him off his house, he said no, I'm praying to the Lord for my rescue. The water eventually surround his house, and he drown and died.

In heaven he ask God why he had not save him. To which God say, I sent you a boat, I sent you a Helicopter, what else were expected?

Anthony, I agree whole heartedly

Mista · Jan 22, 2004

We're doing both here...praying and seeking medical attention!! Just as God uses ordinary people like me, or a teacher, preacher, etc. I also firmly believe God uses Doctors as tools also. However, we must never forget, with the advances of medical technology over the past 50+ years, where these advances come from...not from ourselves, but God!

Anthony, your story was awesome...and so, so right. Thanks!

ablikespaintball · Jan 22, 2004

JillLars said:
It does harm if you only pray instead of seeking medical treatment (see the story about my aunt above). I believe that prayer can work, but we should use all the outlets God has given us, both spiritual (prayer) and physical (medical).

I agree with that....but never did i say that prayer was the only was to get healing

me godly · Jan 22, 2004

Anthony said:
Seek God First, but listen

During a major a flood, and man prayed to God for safety and to save him. The water from the flood came into his house, so he went on top of the roof. A rescue boat came, by and he said no I'm praying to the Lord for my rescue. Later a Helicopter came by to pluck him off his house, he said no, I'm praying to the Lord for my rescue. The water eventually surround his house, and he drown and died.

In heaven he ask God why he had not save him. To which God say, I sent you a boat, I sent you a Helicopter, what else were expected?

I've heard this story before. Hated it then and still do.
It makes a mockery out of faith. I live to see God respond in all aspects of my walk. His provision for us in our life builds our very foundation.
Unless we seek His direction and guidance in all our ways He can't direct our paths.
God said the just will walk by faith. Not presumption.

pentecostal girl · Jan 22, 2004

ablikespaintball said:
Naw man! I totally disagree with it!
You know maybe it's because i believe almost all sickness comes from satan.....lemme ask you a question, why would God give one of his children sickness?? I'm thinking this is maybe generational??
Well anyway, wether you agree with this or not, have your daughter just REBUKE the sickness, and it will flee.

God Bless!
AB

I hope your kidding

TheScottsMen · Jan 22, 2004

well that depends at the way you look at it. Thats like saying you pray in faith to be healed and believe Gods word that you will be healed. The next day your sister a doctor says she can perform surgery on you. Which do you do? Believe in God for the healing or the doctor that came your way? Where does God first work through a doctor in the Bible? I could see a God sending a Doctor if your weak in faith, but if your believing in him, let him do the work of the Doctor. I can see where me godly is coming from.

Heinrich · Jan 22, 2004

In my personal life I sometimes struggle with this battle.. About faith-healing and healing throught doctors ect.
The one thing is God very rarely gets any credit when a doctor performs surgury and if He does it come no were close to what happens when that person is healed "miraculously" without doctors.

I've heard of people that have the amount of faith that when they get a headache can pray and it immediately goes away... I guess this goes to the gift of healing maybe.
But me I still need a pill when my head hurts. I sometimes wonder if this is like "spatting in God face" is this the act of an unbelieving man?
Because sometimes I have refrained from using medicine and then didn't get healed very quickly.. more like on my natural bodies rate... I guess this also breaks down your faith doesn't it?

But the bottom line is that the doctors still can't heal every sickness escpecially death. And so I will seek God's answers and guidance in faith healing till I stand in the place where he tells me "freely you have recieved now freely give!"

Mista I really hope God will come throught for you!
-Heinrich

Mista · Jan 22, 2004

TheScottsMen said:
The next day your sister a doctor says she can perform surgery on you. Which do you do? Believe in God for the healing or the doctor that came your way?

Hmmmm...... guess I would believe the Doctor was sent by God.

Mista · Jan 23, 2004

To the Word..

New Testament..
Paul said, "Stop drinking only water, and use a little wine because of your stomach and your frequent illnesses." 1 Tim 5:23
And Jesus himself said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance." Luke 5:31
Old Testment:
"Isaiah had said, "Prepare a poultice of figs and apply it to the boil, and he will recover." Isa 38:21
Now read this!
"In the thirty-ninth year of his reign Asa was afflicted with a disease in his feet. Though his disease was severe, even in his illness he did not seek help from the LORD , but only from the physicians." 2 Chr 16:12. Here God was angry not because Asa had sought a Doctor, but rather Asa had sought the Doctor first, before God.

Sounds to me like they used Doctors, but, we should seek God first.

TheScottsMen · Jan 23, 2004

Alright, lets look at healing in the NT and how it was done. Doctor or God? This should put to rest anyones question it was Doctors as this is an entire look at healing in the NT.

1. INNUMERABLE CASES OF HEALING BY CHRIST (Matt. 4:23-24; 8:16-17; 9:35-36; 11:5; 12:15; 14:14, 33-36; 15:30-31; 19:2; 21:14; Mark 1:32-34, 39; 3:10-12; 6:5, 55-56; Luke 4:40-41; 6:17-19; 7:21-23; 9:11; John 2:23; 20:30-31; 21:25); cause-the devil and demons (Acts 10:38; 1 John 3:8; Mark 5; 16:17; Luke 13:14); remedy-faith and the anointing with the Holy Spirit (Isa. 11:2; 42:1-7; 61:1-2; Matt. 12:22-32; Acts 10:38); result-healing in every case (Acts 10:35; Matt. 4:23-24; 8:16-17; 9:35; 12:15; 14:14, 35-36; 15:30-31; 19:2; 21:14).

2. INNUMERABLE CASES OF HEALING BY BELIEVERS BEFORE PENTECOST (Matt. 10:1-7; Mark 6:7-13; 9:38; Luke 9:1-6; 10:1-20); Cause- the devil and demons (Matt. 10:1-7; Luke 10:1-20; Acts 10:38); remedy-faith and temporary enduement of power for the one mission representing Christ from city to city (Matt. 10:1-20; Luke 10:1-20); result-healing in every case while on this one mission (Mark 6:7-13; Luke 10:1-20). The failure in Matt. 17:14-21 was after they had come back from this mission and before their permanent enduement of power at Pentecost.

3. INNUMERABLE CASES OF HEALING BY BELIEVERS AFTER PENTECOST (Mark 16:17-20; Acts 2:43; 5:12-16; 6:8; 8:7-13; 11:19-22; 14:3, 27; 15:4, 12; 19:11-12; 28:9; Rom. 15:18-19, 29; 1 Cor. 16:10; Heb. 2:3-4); cause- the devil and demons (Mark 16:17; Acts 5:16, 8:6-7; 10:38; 19:11-12), remedy- faith and the anointing with the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:49; John 14:12-15; Acts 1:8; 3:6; 6:8; 19:12; 1 Cor. 12:7-11, 28-31); result-healing in every case (John 14:12; Acts 5:12-16, 19:11-12; Heb. 2:3-4, Mark 16:20).

4. TEN CASES OF DEMON-POSSESSION HEALED BY CHRIST AND PAUL, AND OTHERS:

(1) A maniac of Gergesa (Matt. 8:28-34).

(2) A maniac of Gadera (Mk. 5:1-21; Lk. 8:26-39).

(3) A dumb man (Matt. 9:32-34).

(4) A blind and dumb man (Matt. 12:22-32).

(5) An epileptic girl (Matt. 15:21-28).

(6) An epileptic boy (Mark 9:17-29).

(7) A maniac (Mark 1:23-28; Luke 4:21).

(8) Mary Magdalene (Luke 7:36-50; 8:2).

(9) An infirm woman (Luke 13:16-17).

(10) A fortuneteller (Acts 16:16-24).

5. TWENTY-NINE CASES OF HEALING BY CHRIST, PETER, JOHN, AND PAUL:

(1) A leper (Matt. 8:1-4; Mark 1:20).

(2) A centurion's servant (Matt. 8:5-13).

(3) Peter's mother-in-law (Matt. 8:14).

(4) A woman (Matt. 9:18-26; Mark 5:22).

(5) Two blind men (Matt. 9:27-31).

(6) A withered hand (Matt. 12:9-14).

(7) Two blind men (Matt. 20:29-34).

(8) A deaf -dumb man ( Mark 7:31-37).

(9) A blind man (Mark 8:22-26).

(10) A man with dropsy (Luke 14:1-6).

(11) Ten lepers (Luke 17:11-19).

(12) A nobleman's son (John 4:46-54).

(13) An infirm man (John 5:1-15).

(14) A blind man (John 9:1-38).

(15) A lame man (Acts 3: 1-4:22).

(16) A paralyzed man (Acts 9:32-35).

(17) A lame man (Acts 14:9-10).

(18) Father of Publius (Acts 28:7-9).

6. SIX CASES OF RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD BY JESUS, PETER, PAUL, AND OTHERS:

(1) Jairus' daughter (Matt. 9:18-26).

(2) A widow's son (Luke 7:11-18).

(3) Lazarus ( John 11: 1 -44).

(4) Tabitha (Acts 9:36-42).

(5) Paul (Acts 14:19-20).

(6) Eutychus (Acts 20:7-12).

7. A PARALYZED MAN: cause-sin; remedy-faith in Christ; result- healing (Matt. 9:1-12; Mark 2:3-12; Luke 5:18-26).

8. MALCHUS: cause-ear severed by Peter's sword (John 18:10); remedy- power of Jesus; result-healed (Luke 22:50-51).

9. SICKNESS AND DEATH OF HEROD: cause-pride and self-exaltation; remedy-none, because of judgment; result-eaten by worms (Acts 12:20-25).

10. BLINDNESS OF BAR-JESUS: cause-unbelief and rebellion against the gospel; remedy-none until Paul's curse was over (Acts 13:6-12).

11. PAUL'S SNAKE BITE: cause-accident; remedy-faith in Jesus Christ; result-healing (Acts 28:1-6). Immunity from poisons and snake bites is promised all believers (Mark 16:17-20; Luke 10:19; Ps. 91). This does not mean, however that believers can tempt God and get by with it by deliberately drinking poison and getting snake-bitten, as some foolish and ignorant people do today.

12. THE BLINDNESS OF PAUL: cause-rebellion and unbelief (Acts 9:1-9; 1 Tim. 1:13); remedy-prayer and fasting (Acts 9:9-11); result-healing (Acts 9:17-19).

13. SICKNESS OF A CORINTHIAN: cause-fornication (1 Cor. 5:1-8); remedy-repentance; result-healing (2 Cor 2:6-11).

14. SICKNESS AND DEATH OF MANY CORINTHIANS: cause-failure to appropriate the benefits of healing by faith in the work of Calvary (1 Cor. 11:27-32; 1 Pet. 2:24; Matt. 8:16-17); remedy-none where the gospel remedy is rejected and unbelief robs people of its benefits; result-no healing.

15. SICKNESS OF EPAPHRODITUS: cause-overwork in the gospel; remedy -prayer and rest to regain strength; result-healing (Phil. 2:25-30).

TheScottsMen · Jan 23, 2004

What about OT ? Again, lets see if its Doctors or God that heals.

1. BARRENNESS OF THE PHILISTINE WOMEN: cause-divine intervention for Sarah (Gen. 20:1 -7, 18); remedy - prayer (Gen. 20:7, 17) ; result - healing (Gen. 20:7, 17).

2. BARRENNESS OF SARAH: cause-unknown (Gen. 16:1-21:8); remedy - prayer and faith (Gen. 18:10; 21:1-8; Rom. 4:17-22); result - healing (Gen. 21).

3. BARRENNESS OF REBEKAH: cause-unknown (Gen. 25:19-26); remedy - prayer (Gen. 25:21); result - healing (Gen. 25:21-26).

4. ISAAC'S BLINDNESS AND SICKNESS: cause-old age (Gen. 27:12, 41); remedy-none stated, but evidently he was renewed in body by faith (Heb. 11:20); result - lived over twenty more years (Gen. 31:38; 35:27-29).

5. BARRENNESS OF RACHEL: cause-unknown (Gen. 29:31; 30:1); remedy--prayer (Gen. 30:22); result - healing (Gen. 30:22-24; 35:16-20).

6. JACOB'S DEATH: cause - old age (Gen. 47:27-31; 48:1; 49:33) ; remedy -none, because of the divine appointment for all men to die (Heb. 9:27). The Hebrew word for seek in Gen. 48:1 is calah, to be worn, weak. Jacob died of old age like an apple falling off the tree because of ripeness and not because of being diseased. The Bible teaches that all true believers can live to a ripe old age (Ps. 34:12-14; 91:16; 1 Pet. 3:10-12). Not long ago we knew of a woman 95 years of age who was as healthy as she could be at such an age. One day she told her children that she was going to die on a certain day. When the day came and she had bade all good-bye she simply lay on the bed and folded her hands and gave up the ghost without a struggle. This is the way Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses and many others passed away. One, therefore, does not have to die of a disease any more than an apple must fall by disease and worms. It is possible for one to live in health to a ripe old age and die a natural death. There is no law that says every person must die of a disease. By faith in God one can ward off many ills of life and live long before natural death.

7. BOILS ON THE EGYPTIANS: cause-hardness of heart and rebellion against God (Ex. 4:21; 5:2); remedy-unknown; result-unknown.

8. ALL SICKNESSES OF ISRAEL: cause-misuse of the tongue and rebellion (Ex. 15:24-26); remedy-the Word of God, prayer and obedience (Ex. 15:26; Ps. 107:20); result-the whole nation made perfect in health (Ps. 105:37).

9. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-misuse of the tongue and idolatry (Ex. 32:1-6); remedy-prayer, atonement and discipline (Ex. 32:7-28); result-many rebels died, but the rest were delivered from the plague (Ex. 32:27-35).

10. PLAGUE UPON PRIESTS: cause-drunkenness and disobedience; remedy -none; result-death by judgment from God (Lev. 10:1-9).

11. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-misuse of the tongue; remedy-prayer; result-plague stopped (Num. 11:1-3).

12. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-misuse of the tongue and lust (Num. 11: 4-20); remedy-none because of judgment (Num. 11:19-20); result-death to thousands (Num. 11:33-35).

13. PLAGUE OF LEPROSY UPON MIRIAM: cause-pride and misuse of the tongue (Num. 12:1-10); remedy-prayer and discipline (Num. 12:13-14); result- healing (Num. 12:14-16).

14. PLAGUE UPON THE TEN SPIES: cause-unbelief and misuse of the tongue (Num. 13:26-33); remedy-none because of judgment; result-death (Num. 4:37).

15. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-misuse of the tongue and rebellion (Num.: 14:1-19); remedy-none because of judgment (Num. 1 4:2 2-35); result-death (Num. 14:20-35).

16. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-pride and misuse of the tongue (Num. 16:1-14); remedy-judgment upon the rebels (Num. 16:21-30); result-death (Num. 6:31).

17. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-rebellion and misuse of the tongue (Num.16:1-14); remedy-judgment upon the rebels (Num. 16:29); result-death (Num.16:35).

18. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-rebellion and misuse of the tongue (Num. 16:41-42); remedy-atonement and judgment (Num. 16:46-50); result-14,700 were killed and the plague was stayed (Num. 16:49-50).

19. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-discouragement and misuse of the tongue (Num. 21:5); remedy-prayer, faith, and confession of sin (Num. 21:7-9); result-healing for all who obeyed and looked on the serpent of brass, a type of Christ (Num. 21:9; John 3:14).

20. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-adultery and idolatry; remedy-judgment upon the rebels; result-24,000 were killed and the plague was stayed (Num. 25:1-15).

21. BARRENNESS OF HANNAH: cause-the Lord caused her to be barren to test her and to teach coming generations certain lessons (1 Sam. 1:2-9); remedy- prayer and humility (1 Sam. 1:9-19); result-healing and fruitfulness (1 Sam. 1:17-28).

22. PLAGUE OF EMERODS UPON THE PHILISTINE5: cause-taking the ark of God from Israel; remedy-trespass offering and ark sent back; result- unknown (1 Sam. 5:1-6:21).

23. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-looking into the ark; remedy-judgment upon the transgressors; result-many killed and the plague stayed (1 Sam. 6:19-21).

24. INSANITY OF SAUL: cause-disobedience and jealousy (1 Sam. 15:22-35; 18:8-30); remedy-inspired music (1 Sam. 16:14; 19:9-10); result-temporary relief (1 Sam. 16:14-23).

25. SICKNESS OF AN EGYPTIAN: cause-unknown; remedy care and natural food; result-he was restored to health (1 Sam. 30:11-16).

26. SICKNESS AND DEATH OF DAVID'S CHILD: cause-adultery and murder (2 Sam. 12:9-15); remedy-fasting and prayer (2 Sam. 12:16-23); result -prayer unanswered because of punishment for sin (2 Sam. 12:9-15).

27. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-David's sin in numbering Israel (2 Sam. 24:1-25); remedy-atonement, confession of sin, and prayer; result-70,000 were killed and the plague was stayed (2 Sam. 24:10-25).

28. JEROBOAM'S WITHERED HAND: cause-attempted violence to a man of God (l Kings 13:4); remedy-prayer; result-healing (l Kings 13:6).

29. ABIJAH'S SICKNESS: cause-sins of the parents ( 1 Kings 14:8-9); remedy-none, because of judgment; result-death (1 Kings 14:12-18).

30. ASA'S FOOT DISEASE: cause-unknown; remedy-physicians; result- death for not trusting God (1 Kings 15:23-24; 2 Chron. 16:12-14; Jer. 17:5-13).

31. SICKNESS AND DEATH OF THE WIDOW'S SON: cause- unknown; remedy-prayer of Elijah; result-resurrection and healing (1 Kings 17:8-24).

32. AHAZIAH'S DISEASE: cause-fell from an upper story; remedy- trust in Baalzebub, the god of flies, instead of the true God; result-death (2 Kings 1:1-18).

33. THE SHUNAMMITE WOMAN'S BARRENNESS: cause- unknown; remedy-faith and prophecy; result-healing and fruitfulness (2 Kings 4:1-17).

34. SICKNESS AND DEATH OF THE SHUNAMMITE'S SON: cause- sunstroke; remedy-faith, prayer, and the power of God in Elisha's body; result-resurrection and healing (2 Kings 4:18-37).

35. NAMAAN'S LEPROSY: cause-unknown; remedy-trust in God and obedience; result-healing (2 Kings 5:l-19).

36. GEHAZI'S LEPROSY: cause-greed, lying, and disobedience; remedy- none, because of the curse upon him; result-no healing (2 Kings 5:20-27).

37. BLINDNESS OF THE SYRIAN ARMY: cause-prayer of Elisha; remedy -prayer of Elisha; result-healing (2 Kings 6:13-23).

38. SICKNESS OF BEN-HADAD: cause-unknown; remedy- unknown; result-might have recovered if he had not been murdered according to prophecy (2 Kings 8:10-15).

39. SICKNESS OF JEHORAM: cause-unknown; remedy-unknown; result- recovered but slain by Jehu (2 Kings 9:14-29).

40. SICKNESS OF ELISHA: cause-unknown, but could have been old age, for he was nearly 100 years old; remedy-unknown, but if the cause was old age, there could be no remedy; result-death (2 Kings 13:14-20).

41. DEATH OF AN ISRAELITE: cause-unknown; remedy-touching the bones of Elisha- result-resurrection and healing (2 Kings 13:21).

42. UZZIAH'S LEPROSY: cause-pride and usurping the priesthood; remedy none because of judgment; result-no healing (2 Kings 15:5; 2 Chron. 26:16-21).

43. SICKNESS OF HEZEKIAH: cause.-pride and unthankfulness to God (2 Chron. 32:25-31); remedy-prayer and humiliation (2 Kings 20:3; Isa. 38:2-3); result-healed and fifteen years added to his life (Isa. 39:5).

44. JEHORAM'S BOWEL TROUBLE: cause-many sins (2 Chron. 21:6-7; 10:13; 2 Kings 8:18-19); remedy-none, because of judgment; result- death (2 Chron. 2 1:12-20).

45. PLAGUE IN ISRAEL: cause-many sins; remedy-none, because of judgment-result-many killed ( 2 Chron. 21:11-15).

46. ALL SICKNESSES OF ISRAEL: cause-breaking the law in eating of the Passover unworthily (2 Chron. 30:18); remedy-prayer and confession of sin; result -healing (2 Chron. 30:18-20).

47. JOB'S BOILS: cause-Satan (Job 1:6-22; 2:1-10); remedy-prayer and humiliation (Job 42:6-17); result-healing and prosperity (Job 42:6-17; Jas. 5:11).

48. DAVID'S VENEREAL DISEASE: cause-sin (Ps. 38:3); remedy- prayer and confession of sin (Ps. 38:1-22); result-healed (Ps. 6:2; 30:2; 103:3).

49. FAMINE IN ISRAEL (Jer. 14:18): cause-sin and rebellion (Jer. 14:7, 10-22; Deut. 28:15-68); remedy-none, because of judgment (Jer. 14:12-18); result-death and captivity (Jer. 14:11-18).

50. SICKNESS AND DEATH OF EZEKIEL'S WIFE: cause-made a sign to Israel (Ezek. 24:24); remedy, none; result-death (Ezek. 24:15-27).

51. SICKNESS OF DANIEL: cause-long fasting; remedy-prayer, rest, and nourishment; result-complete recovery (Dan. 8:27; 10:2-3).

52. BLINDNESS OF ELI: cause-old age ( l Sam. 4:15).

53. BLINDNESS OF AHIJAH: cause-old age (1 Ki. 14:4).

54. BLINDNESS OF SODOMITE5: cause-sin; remedy-none (Gen. 19:1-11).

As for 2 Chron16:12 lets look at it again.

2 Chron. 16:12-13 "And Asa in the thirty and ninth year of his reign was diseased in his feet, until his disease was exceeding great: yet in his disease he sought not to the Lord, but to the physicians. [13] And Asa slept with his fathers, and died in the one and fortieth year of his reign."

#Here God was angry not because Asa had sought a Doctor, but rather Asa had sought the Doctor first, before God..#

Where does it say God wasn't angry because he looked for a Doctor? It doesn't. It simply reads that God was mad because he went to a doctor and not to him. No where does it use the word FIRST or anything like that.

That should pretty much wrap up the NT and OT for the use of Doctors when faith is there. If a person feels they should goto the Doctor, then my all means go. We are each given a measure of faith when we are Born Again. From that point it is up to us to increase that faith and overcome all things in this life.

TSM

angelbaby2 · Jan 23, 2004

My Pastor has studied a lot of John G. Lakes materials or whatever you would call it.
I myself believe that demons can be the cause of a sickness but not always. Like someone else said it does no harm to bind the spirit of the illness or diesease from that person. Is your daughter a christian? A christian cannot be possessed by a demon.
But they can be tormented by them and sometimes that can be in the form of a desease.

angelbaby2

Salsa_1960 · Jan 26, 2004

I have had epilepsy since the age of 4. I was certainly not then (nor am I now) possessed or influenced by demons. I was brought up in a Christian home and I am a born-again Christian.

My seizures are well controlled by medication. (I know of no demons that are submissive to medicine). Many people are able to have surgery and be seizure-free as a result of their operation. What does this have to do with demons? I have a friend who has what is called a "Vagus Nerve Stimulator Implant." Though he still experiences seizures, the combination of the implant and the introduction of a new medication has made a tremendous improvement in his quality of life.

Just because a boy in the Bible was demon possessed and it caused him to have seizures that does not mean if a person has seizures they are demon possessed.

2nd Corinthians 12:7-10
7 To keep me from becoming conceited because of these surpassingly great revelations, there was given me a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. 8 Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. 9 But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me. 10 That is why, for Christ's sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

Anthony · Jan 27, 2004

me godly said:
I've heard this story before. Hated it then and still do.
It makes a mockery out of faith. I live to see God respond in all aspects of my walk. His provision for us in our life builds our very foundation.
Unless we seek His direction and guidance in all our ways He can't direct our paths.
God said the just will walk by faith. Not presumption.

God heals, he told us so, and He promises healing.

But he does not promise us how he will do it. Some Christians today are too picky in how God does his works. Present day medicine is "revealed creation". God's uses any number of sources for healing including people to carry out the process. But these people are mire ponds in God's process.

Shannonkish · Jan 27, 2004

A few years ago.. someone I know (protecting her name and our relationship) was in her dorm room.. she began having epileptic seizures... however, they got worse and she would scream out obscentites against Jesus. We found that if we would sing hymns, she would become a little peaceful, but scream stop. This continues for weeks. One night, I witnessed this, and knew exactly what it was.... this wasn't a diease, she was definitely possessed.. however, because I attend an SBC school, they didn't want to hear anything of the sort... She went to doctor's and they called it epilepsy... she took LOTS of medicine for it.. none of which worked.. and still to this day takes medicine.. however, the "seizures" haven't really stopped or gotten better.

Salsa_1960 · Jan 27, 2004

Shannonkish said:
A few years ago.. someone I know (protecting her name and our relationship) was in her dorm room.. she began having epileptic seizures... however, they got worse and she would scream out obscentites against Jesus. We found that if we would sing hymns, she would become a little peaceful, but scream stop. This continues for weeks. One night, I witnessed this, and knew exactly what it was.... this wasn't a diease, she was definitely possessed.. however, because I attend an SBC school, they didn't want to hear anything of the sort... She went to doctor's and they called it epilepsy... she took LOTS of medicine for it.. none of which worked.. and still to this day takes medicine.. however, the "seizures" haven't really stopped or gotten better.

Individual anecdotes don't take away from the fact that epilepsy is a medical disorder. If I told you I knew of a blind man who also belonged to a group that worshiped the devil, would you automatically assume all blind people are Satan worshipers? If I knew a man with cancer who was a child molester, would that mean that everyone who has cancer once attacked a child?? Of course not! What you are doing is making generalities based on one or two stories that you may know of.

Epilepsy actually occurs in about 1 out of every 200 people. There are many different types of seizures. Though I've had other types, anymore I usually only have what are called "simple-partial seizures." I could be having one and you wouldn't even realize it because I can hide them well. (Because they aren't always so obvious, you many actually know more people with epilepsy than you realize, but because of archaic attitudes they aren't willing to share). Mine most often occur around my menstrual period (AKA catamenial seizures). What in the world does that have to do with demons? BTW, the reason I mostly only have simple-partials anymore is because of the medicine I'm on and because of surgery I had 15 years ago. (showing again that this is health related and has nothing to do with demons).

Anthony said:
God heals, he told us so, and He promises healing.
But he does not promise us how he will do it. Some Christians today are too picky in how God does his works. Present day medicine is "revealed creation". God's uses any number of sources for healing including people to carry out the process. But these people are mire ponds in God's process.

Anthony. Very well said.

SpiritPsalmist · Jan 27, 2004

I believe the fact that medicine works shows it's NOT a demon. When the medicine does not work it most likely is. There is no clear cut answer for each and every case. Some is demonically induced and some is not.

As I said before, the fact that something is demonically induced does not mean the peron is POSSESSED. It mean they are being attacked by a demon who is causing whatever is happeing. As believers we are ALL under attack. . .the Bible says so. We are all hit in a variety of ways. . .some more so than others.

We do have the remedy though and that is found in the Word. I do not believe we are at our enemy's mercy. If it is an attack from the enemy what is the harm at being delivered from it. If the medicine works, that is great, but still there is no harm in praying against the sickness is there? I take prescription medicine and when I take it I pray over it that it does what it's supposed to do and does not create another "side effect" problem as so many of them do. I pray that my body responds and that it be healed in the name of Jesus. I will take the med's as long as I need to but I still pray for healing in the meantime. Because the med's are working I do not believe it's an attack. . .but I do beleive that God want's me healthy so I pray accordingly.

Salsa_1960 · Jan 27, 2004

Quaffer said:
We do have the remedy though and that is found in the Word. I do not believe we are at our enemy's mercy. If it is an attack from the enemy what is the harm at being delivered from it. If the medicine works, that is great, but still there is no harm in praying against the sickness is there? I take prescription medicine and when I take it I pray over it that it does what it's supposed to do and does not create another "side effect" problem as so many of them do. I pray that my body responds and that it be healed in the name of Jesus. I will take the med's as long as I need to but I still pray for healing in the meantime. Because the med's are working I do not believe it's an attack. . .but I do beleive that God want's me healthy so I pray accordingly.

There is no harm in praying for a person's health. Here is where the harm comes in:

When I was about 15, I attended an Assemblies of God church. I was having Complex-partial seizures at that time. (They were very obvious-- this was before my surgery). There were people who wanted to pray for me. I thought this was neat. I had no problem with this. What I did have a problem with was when people started telling me that there was something wrong with my faith or even worse pointing out the story of the boy who was possessed by demons and also having seizures. (Implying, if not coming right out and telling me that Satan had control over me. That it was all his fault and that if I would just get closer to God, my seizures would come to a hault).

I'm not saying that the entire church told me this and I'm not stating that this is the point of view of all the Assemblies of God churches. I will though say that nothing was said by the pastor to discourage these statements being made to me. I'm not one to keep to myself, so I'm sure I shared these confusing statements made to me with the Pastor. He could have reassured me that the people who said these things were "out of line." I recall no such reassurance.

I was a brand new born-again Christian and very vulnerable to what other Christians were telling me. In my opinion, this was handled very badly. I looked for another (more understanding) church-- and found one. What's really sad is that my sister also attended this church. She felt the cold shoulder that I was receiving from many in that congregation as well and left too. Though I found another church to call home. She didn't and her family is unchurched to this day.

SpiritPsalmist · Jan 27, 2004

It is a difficult thing indeed to find the perfect church with the perfect Pastor and perfect people who do everything perfectly.

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