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ZiSunka

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Jesus commanded his followers not to take an oath, but to let their yes be yes and their no be no.

How do you understand this, and do you pledge, swear or take an oath.

Of course I'm not talking about saying vulgar words, I'm talking about like in a court room or when asked to say the pledge of allegiance or an oath of office.
 

aReformedPatriot

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I've thought about this and if I ever got called to testify. I figure I would just tell them the bible says let your yes be yes and your no be no. I will tell the truth and be done with it. But im am curious to see the thoughts that will out of this thread.
 
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AJ

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Such as taking an oath that would require me to renounce my faith... Declare fealty to a ruler who demands worship as a god... take an oath that would require me to lie or sin or misrepresent my beliefs/faith, etc.

I have no problem pledging allegiance to my country... or taking an oath to "tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me God."
 
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CFoster

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If a Christian's character is flawless, accomplished only by the Grace and Spirit of the Lord, then we should not have to say more than a yes or no when someone asks something of us for them to believe us. I really don't see this applying to saying the pledge of allegiance or saying yes after "Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?"
 
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AJ

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Yes... I guess so. There are oaths taken in the Bible... both OT and NT.

I don't see an oath as being intrinsically evil. Jehovah bound himself to Abraham when he promised to bless the aptriarch (Heb 6:13-4). With reference to the priesthood of Christ, God "hath sworn,... 'You are a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek'" (Psa 110:4) Since the Lord is perfect, we must conclude that an oath per se is not sinful.

When Christ was on trial, the high priest said, "I adjure you by the living God, that you tell us whether you are the Christ, the son of God" (Matt 26:63). The word "adjure" comes from the greek exorkizo, which means to extract an oath or to force an oath. Christ was put under oath, hoping that he would incriminate himself. He answered honestly, "You have said" (su eipas) which is translated to be a Greek affirmative reply.

Paul also employed an oath when writing to Corinth... "But I call God for a witness upon my soul, that to spare you I forbare to come unto Corinth" (2 Cor 1:23) He also made the statement "Now concerning these things which I write unto you, behold, before God, I lie not." (Gal 1:20)

Also looking at 1 Tim 1:10, the scriptures warn against "false swearers", which would seem needless if all swearing of any sort is actually prohibited.

Since it is apparent that a respectful, sincere, legal oath is not condemned in the Scriptures, the prohibition of James 5:12 must pertain to something else. I take that to be "sinful swearing" or "ungodly swearing", such as the examples mentioned in the prior post.

The fact that all oaths of every kind were not forbidden is also apparent within the context of Jesus' discussion of this theme in the sermon on the mount. When speaking of condemning certain oaths, Christ said, "but you shall perform unto the Lord your oaths" (Matt 5:33)

Lastly, speaking of the Pledge of Alligence... I do not view this as an oath, but rather an affirmation of devotion to the laws of the government under which we live. I believe that it is inline with the instructions of Romans 13:1 which calls for us to enjoin obedience and respect for the government.... Taking into consideration the scripture in Acts 4:19-20 & 5:29 which describes that ones allegiance to the government is always subservient to his loyalty to God.
 
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ZiSunka

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Main Entry: ad·jure

Pronunciation: &-'jur
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): ad·jured; ad·jur·ing
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French & Latin; Middle French ajurer, from Latin adjurare, from ad- + jurare to swear -- more at JURY
1 : to command solemnly under or as if under oath or penalty of a curse
2 : to urge or advise earnestly
synonym see BEG


It doesn't mean that Christ swore and oath, it means that Pilate treated him as if he were under oath and would receive a penalty for lying.

Christ said not to take any oath at all, not just "sinful oaths." In fact, he doesn't mention any qualifiers at all for the prohibition.

When Paul called for God to be his witness, I think he was being literal, that God would be his witness that he wasn't lying and that he had done the best thing. How does that equal taking a pledge of allegiance?
 
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AJ

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From Strong's:

adjure:

1) to swear, adjure
a) (Qal) sworn (participle)
b) (Niphal)
1) to swear, take an oath
2) to swear (of Jehovah by Himself)
3) to curse
c) (Hiphil)
1) to cause to take an oath
2) to adjure


As I said... I don't consider the Pledge of Allegiance an "oath". It is an affirmation of of devotion to the laws of the government under which we live. I believe that it is inline with the instructions of Romans 13:1 which calls for us to enjoin obedience and respect for the government.... Taking into consideration the scripture in Acts 4:19-20 & 5:29 which describes that ones allegiance to the government is always subservient to his loyalty to God.

Why would 1 Tim 1:10 warn against false swearers, if all swearing is actually prohibited?
 
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AJ

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Also Matt 5:33?
33“Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not break your oath, but keep the oaths you have made to the Lord.’
When speaking of condemning certain oaths, Christ said, "‘Do not break your oath, but keep the oaths you have made to the Lord.’ "

I see James 5:12 as Christ's instruction to always be truthful... Not to rely on oaths to speak the truth.
 
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ZiSunka

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Matthew 5:33-37 33 "Again, you have heard that it was said to our ancestors, You must not break your oath, but you must keep your oaths to the Lord. 34 But I tell you, don't take an oath at all: either by heaven, because it is God's throne; 35 or by the earth, because it is His footstool; or by Jerusalem, because it is the city of the great King. 36 Neither should you swear by your head, because you cannot make a single hair white or black. 37 But let your word 'yes' be 'yes,' and your 'no' be 'no.' Anything more than this is from the evil one.

James 5:12 Now above all, my brothers, do not swear, either by heaven or by earth or with any other oath. Your "yes" must be "yes," and your "no" must be "no," so that you won't fall under judgment.

How do you figure that neither of these means that you shouldn't swear and oath at all? I don't see in here anywhere that it says it's okay to swear some oaths and not others.
 
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seebs

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The first time someone did the "tell the truth the whole truth..." thing, I said "I do" without really thinking about it, and felt awful. Now I refuse. I feel the prohibition is unambiguous and justified.

This is one of the beliefs that led me to eventually consider myself some kind of Quaker. (Or at least, to start attending Quaker meetings, with intent to become a member once I've been at it for a while.)
 
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ZiSunka

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TxAdam said:
Why would 1 Tim 1:10 warn against false swearers, if all swearing is actually prohibited?

But clearly from the context of Jesus and Pilate, in which the word adjure is used, the meaning is that Pilate considered Christ's testimony of himself as being sworn testimony, not that Christ took an oath.

As for Timothy, Paul was speaking about people who are not Christians:
8 We know these laws are good when they are used as God intended. 9 But they were not made for people who do what is right. They are for people who are disobedient and rebellious, who are ungodly and sinful, who consider nothing sacred and defile what is holy, who murder their father or mother or other people. 10 These laws are for people who are sexually immoral, for homosexuals and slave traders, for liars and oath breakers, and for those who do anything else that contradicts the right teaching 11 that comes from the glorious Good News entrusted to me by our blessed God.

People of God should not take an oath at all. That way they can never be oath breakers. If you do a search on oath, you will see that all the oath-taking is done by the unsaved, not the saved, except when God takes an oath upon himself, and we all know that God cannot sin and he keeps all this promises, unlike humans. No human can be certain that he will keep all his pledges, and when we swear an oath, we are pledging to surrender something bigger than ourselves for payment if we break it. When we say, "I will do this or that so help me God," we are saying that if we break the oath, we expect God to punish us, but that is presumptive on God. How can we tell God what to do? "If I break this oath, I demand that God punish me!" is what we are saying. Do you tell God what to do? Do you make demands on God? Can you presume God's mind and will and say for certain that he will exact punishment on you, especially a Christian who knows that our punishment was all taken on the cross by Christ himself?

That's why Jesus said not to say an oath. We can't presume on God to punish us, we know our punishment is done away with by the cross, and we don't own anything to offer up as a payment for a broken pledge, which is bound to happen sooner or later because no one can flawlessly keep every oath.

33 "Again you have heard that it was said to those of old, 'You shall not swear falsely, but shall perform your oaths to the Lord.' 34 But I say to you, do not swear at all: neither by heaven, for it is God's throne; 35 nor by the earth, for it is His footstool; nor by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King. 36 Nor shall you swear by your head, because you cannot make one hair white or black. 37 But let your 'Yes' be 'Yes,' and your 'No,' 'No.' For whatever is more than these is from the evil one.

You can't swear by the heavens because you don't own them to hand over if you fail to keep your vow. You can't swear by anything else that we typically swear by because it is impossible to pay the forfeiture, because we don't own any of those things. "I swear on my mother's grave." My mom's grave doesn't belong to me, it belongs to her. I can't forfeit it because my name isn't on the deed.

So there you have it in a nutshell.
 
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AJ

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To each their own... We should always tell the truth with or without an oath. We agree on that. I am just telling you how I feel about it. There is no reason that an oath is inheriently bad or evil... If you don't want to verbalize that you will tell the truth in such a way, but do say that you always tell the truth because you are Christian... Great. You are still saying the same thing. Not telling the truth in any context is a sin... Oath or no oath.

What I gather from these verses is that we should not rely on oaths to be truthful. We should always be truthful in everything that we do. Don't swear an oath to God in an attempt to manipulate him... Here is a commentary on James 5:12 that helped me come to my personal conclusion.

God Bless,
AJ
 
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seebs

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I guess, if Jesus says "don't swear", I figure He meant "don't swear".

I see the point of stressing other things, like "don't have truth depend on swearing"... But by swearing, we contribute to the culture that teaches that truth is the exception, not the rule.
 
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Gold Dragon

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seebs said:
I guess, if Jesus says "don't swear", I figure He meant "don't swear".

And Christians of other traditions would say, if Jesus said "this is my body", they figured He meant "this is my body".

And then there is always the, if God says "six days", He means "six days".
 
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Gold Dragon

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As with many parts of the SOM that have been interpreted as law, we need to analyze again the structure of Jesus' words. Here he uses the oft repeated phrase : "You have heard it said ... but I say to you".

According to some Jewish scholars, this was a common rabbinical structure of that time. Not for creating or contradicting law, but for teaching a deeper meaning and interpretation of the law. Maybe they are wrong, but it is a cultural contextual and linguistic factor to consider.

 
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