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Personally, I don´t care much whether people commit their atrocities in the name of a suppposedly "objective" moral truth or in the name of their subjective morality.It is possible. However, being an atheist without some sort of concept of an objective moral truth in the world set in stone by some sort of force, then truth and morals are in the hands of men who are scarcely the best judges for the job.
It is possible. However, being an atheist without some sort of concept of an objective moral truth in the world set in stone by some sort of force, then truth and morals are in the hands of men who are scarcely the best judges for the job.
But not everyone has the same instinctual "intrinsic" emotional reaction to, uh, stuff.objective morality, based in the intrinsic value or disvalue of various emotional states.
But not everyone has the same instinctual "intrinsic" emotional reaction to, uh, stuff.
And even after you account for the normal variences across the populous, you'll still find schizophrenics, psychopaths, and sociopaths who really don't have these emotion things, or theirs work is completely different ways. If you discount them from defining absolute morals, then what you've got is really just the median morals of the majority. And that changes over time, abolishing the objectiveness.
what are you talking about?jason taylor said:It is possible to be an Atheist and believe in Natural Law. However a lot of the Atheists I know THEORETICALLY don't. Of course, in practice matters are different.
what are you talking about?
People, are to look at objective morality by their subjective feelings......Christianity is true because it works (pragmatism); it isn't true because it feels right (subjectivism);it isn't true because it is "my Truth" (relativism). It is true because it is anchored in the Person of Christ. Giving us common ground as well! God is the author of and on morality coupled to the moral law!I have, as an atheist, believed in objective morality, based in the intrinsic value or disvalue of various emotional states.
allhart is spot on.
SUBJECTIVE MORAL VALUES:
Below is a quote from secular humanist and Professor of Philosophy, Theodore Schick, Jr. in his article, 'Why Professional Ethicists Think That Morality Is Not Purely "Subjective"'.
"Subjectivism, then, fails to meet the criteria of adequacy for ethical theories: it sanctions obviously immoral actions, it implies that people are morally infallible, and it denies that there are any substantive moral disputes. Because it is inconsistent with our considered moral judgments and our experience of the moral life, it is not an acceptable ethical theory."
So what does he believe? That moral standards are self-evident and justify themselves!
"You don't need any additional evidence to support your belief. What makes self-evident truths self-evident is that they do not stand in need of any further justification; they justify themselves."
And that's his answer! That moral values just exist; they're just there! I know what it means to say that some action or person is just, but I don't understand how the value 'justice', just exists as some sort of abstract moral value!?
OBJECTIVE MORAL VALUES:
Below is a quote from the book 'God? A Debate Between a Christian and an Atheist' by atheist Walter Sinnott Armstrong who is a professor of ethics. He is a specialist in ethical and moral theory.
"(William Lane) Craig next asks, 'If God did not forbid rape, what makes rape immoral objectively?' This question is supposed to be hard for atheists to answer, because Craig seems to assume that on “the atheistic view” (which one?) what makes rape wrong is some cost to the rapist or to society (Craig did not assume this). But atheists can give a better answer: What makes rape immoral is that rape harms the victim in terrible ways. The victim feels pain, loses freedom, is subordinated, and so on. These harms are not justified by any benefits to anyone. Craig still might ask, 'What’s immoral about causing serious harms to other people without justification?' But now it seems natural to answer, “It simply is. Objectively. Don’t you agree?”
And that's his answer! You can see that when it comes to justifying his starting point, he can't do it.
But theists can.
Craig still might ask, 'Whats immoral about causing serious harms to other people without justification?' But now it seems natural to answer, It simply is. Objectively. Dont you agree?
And that's his answer! You can see that when it comes to justifying his starting point, he can't do it.
The article basically states that professional ethicists have a set criteria which moral theories need to abide by. Subjectivism fails.
Also... Lets say you are faced with a situation where if you lie and steal, you will save someones life. I would go ahead and lie and steal to save someones life, wouldn't you?
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