Do Anabaptists ever....

[Willie T]

...... talk about (or even admit association with) Jan van Leiden? If so, is it just dismissed as a "bad time" in the religion?

(Thank you for fixing the title, Mods)

 

[SteveIndy]

...... talk about (or even admit association with) Jan van Leiden? If so, is it just dismissed as a "bad time" in the religion?

(Thank you for fixing the title, Mods)

I don't believe that Leiden was an embarrassment and I don't think it is necessary to pretend that he held to the Anabaptist doctrine. He was a loose cannon who pretended to be a prophet to start his own movement. There are those today in the NAR who also are pretenders who wear the Protestant mantel but they only embarrass themselves. What Conrad Grebel, Felix Manns, and George Blurock started still holds the hope of a pristine faith for those who earnestly desire to follow Christ.

 

[Willie T]

I just wondered because Lonnie Frisbee was a homosexual who was very instrumental in the early founding of our denomination. Although I don't think he was ever totally successful in going straight, he tried pretty hard. But, it still seems difficult for some of us to talk openly about him and the lifestyle he fought a losing battle against.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Doesn't seem to be any need to remember those nor to discuss them.
I never heard of them.
Not seeking any discussion about them either - nothing edifying about that , just from what's posted in this thread so far.

 

[Willie T]

Doesn't seem to be any need to remember those nor to discuss them.
I never heard of them.
Not seeking any discussion about them either - nothing edifying about that , just from what's posted in this thread so far.

Admittedly, this is a bit deeper subject than most people get into. Or, should I say, WANT to get into. But, in some ways it relates to most of us in that we have a tendency to act like the Crusades and Puritan Christians who actually burned innocent women at the stake in the Salem Witch Trials weren't really the ancestral predecessors of the very religions we follow today.

Yet, we seem to have learned so little from those times, considering the way so many denominations still actively and openly shun and persecute others.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

So? There seems no good benefit here.

 

[SteveIndy]

Doesn't seem to be any need to remember those nor to discuss them.
I never heard of them.
Not seeking any discussion about them either - nothing edifying about that , just from what's posted in this thread so far.

History means little to a lot of people, but that doesn't mean it never happened or that we should ignore it. It was the study of Church history that led me to the Anabaptist of which so many just ignore. There is much that is edifying about history. The Bible is full of history both good and bad. Which of it is not important or not edifying? If we study history for histories sake then I will agree with you, but if we study history to discover the golden nuggets which have been for so long covered up and forgotten it can be a true blessing.

 

[SteveIndy]

So? There seems no good benefit here.

The benefit has to do with the heart.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

the golden nuggets

Okay, if any , show the gold nuggets especially if you mean , or contrasting with/ from "a loose cannon" and 'pretender' etc in the op/ topic/ thread.

Anabaptism was a great example just like the ekklesia in ACTS et al New Testament 1st century and so on and through history some time ago (not recently , sadly, or at least not known as uncompromising in some more recent televised Anabaptist or Waldensian groups (that caved in , compromised with the enemy) ) ....

 

[SteveIndy]

Okay, if any , show the gold nuggets especially if you mean , or contrasting with/ from "a loose cannon" and 'pretender' etc in the op/ topic/ thread.

Anabaptism was a great example just like the ekklesia in ACTS et al New Testament 1st century and so on and through history some time ago (not recently , sadly, or at least not known as uncompromising in some more recent televised Anabaptist or Waldensian groups (that caved in , compromised with the enemy) ) ....

I'm not sure that we are not both talking about the same thing. We only know of the great apostasy that has now engulfed the Church, i.e. the ekklesia, because we once had the pureness of the 1st century Church to compare it with. We have seen the wonderful exhibition of how the Church is supposed to work alongside the tragedy of what followed. It is history that displays the true and the false and leaves us to choose between the two. The Apostle's writings say very many times that they "write these things that ye might know." These are history lessons.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

It is history that displays the true and the false and leaves us to choose between the two. The Apostle's writings say very many times that they "write these things that ye might know." These are history lessons.

?
YHVH'S WORD divides between the truth and the false.
History is full of the false, with a bit of truth as YHVH Knows and Planned for.
Yes, Scripture is written so we (ekklesia everywhere, any time) might know.

i.e. the standard, the test of everything, is the TRUTH , the SHARP SWORD of SCRIPTURE, dividing even man's soul from spirit (no one knows these things except by YHVH'S WORD, and "known" as granted by YHVH via inspiration / revelation) .....

because we once had the pureness of the 1st century Church to compare it with. We have seen the wonderful exhibition of how the Church is supposed to work alongside the tragedy of what followed.

This is still truth today, rarely seen, rarely known, by revelation of grace and truth in His Word as He Pleases. "We", Ekklesia, born of Him, "are purifying ourselves as He is pure" exactly as they did in the first century trained and taught by Yahshua - Yahweh's Salvation -----
HIS Accomplishing, HIS Doing, HIS Strength Wisdom and Experiential Knowledge granted us as we are willing (like Jerusalem was not willing).

Giving up the world, giving up life and all things with life, is rare, and is still required by JESUS to be His disciple, same as in the first century.
TRUTH STILL: We are crucified with CHRIST, never-the-less we live, yet not us, but CHRIST WHO DWELLETH !!! IN US, and the LIFE that we NOW TODAY in 2018 LIVE, is the LIFE OF THE SON OF GOD, WHO LOVES US and GAVE HIMSELF FOR US.