Discipline disagreements

[hisbloodformysins]

I'm a proud parent of a handsome bright 2 year old boy. But my hubby and I are having issues when it comes to discipline. We thought before we had kids that we were on the same page, we both believe in spanking, consistancy, discipline..... But now that I've had my son things have changed. I think my hubby is too hard on him. I feel like this is because I'm the mom and I have an intuition about my son. I see him have a tantrum because he's frustrated with a failure of his, and my hubby tells him to quit in a harsh voice and spanks him for it. And he also expects me to do the same thing. I agree with discipline, but in this situation I don't think that spanking him is necessary, as a matter of fact harsh, and I'm afraid my hubby will cause trauma to him psychologically because of it. I think that it is very natural for a 2 year old to have a tantrum when upset because they don't have impulse control- and my hubby has it in his head that he's going to teach it to him through spanking him every time he has a tantrum. Yes, every once in a while I think that my son should get a spanking for it, but not if his motive isn't wrong. Sometimes my son doesn't even know that what he is doing is wrong, it's innocent, and yet my hubby is quick to tell him no in a harsh scary voice and spank him. I think my son cries more out of fear than pain and I just can't sit there and watch my hubby spank my son without stepping in somehow, whether to be to comfort my son, protect him, or yell at my hubby for it. And of course my hubby thinks I'm going to cause him problems because I'm teaching him that he can manipulate me. But even though this may be true, I'm not just going to sit there idolly while my hubby abuses my son ( he doesn't beat him or bruise him, don't go turning him in now). We both recognize that it's necessary for us to talk about it, research it, and come to an agreement about discipline, but my hubby is so set that he is right, and I'm convinced he's not. Does anyone have any helpful advice to offer. This really breaks my heart. Thank You.

 

[Tangnefedd]

While I am in favour of spanking a child occasionally for a serious breach of discipline, I don't think spanking and yelling at a kid for having a temper tantrum at the age of two is wise or appropriate. A child of that age should be either held tightly until the tantrum sdubsides, or given time out in his room. You say that you can't sit there while he 'abuses' your son. Abuse is a strong word to use, and if you feel that what your husband is doing is abusive then you need to get help, and fast. If your husband's first response is to spank, how is he going to react when the child does something really naughty as he gets older? That would concern me a great deal.

 

[hisbloodformysins]

I think my hubby does that because it how he was raised and taught. And although his dad was tough on him, he balanced it with love. And he and his siblings turned out really good. He tells me that he avoided getting into trouble with friends as a teenager because he was afraid of his dad, and my hubby wants to instill that same fear in my son I think. I don't think my hubby is abusive, let me correct myself, I was abused as a child, my hubby has my sons best interest in mind, I think that he just doesn't understand that spanking isn't always the answer. But he is soooo stubborn, when he is convinced of something there is no changing his mind, though he is open on occassion to change, I guess if I bring it up in a certain way. I found some info on internet about this that I sent him, and I don't think he's going to even read them or be open to them, just because he knows that i'm trying to change his mind, know what I mean?? My son isn't in bad shape or anything, and he does mind my hubby, more so than me- it's just at the time I can't handle it when I have the understanding that my son is 2 and is incapable of controlling his impulses, yet my hubby thinks that he can learn to control them- and he even accuses my son of doing things on purpose, as if he's a 10 year old child, when my son is still just a babe. My hubby is being softened a little to his tactics from time to time, for example my son prefers me over him most the time, because I'm a lot more soothing and coddling of him, naturally, I'm the mom- but it's starting to get my hubby to question why he prefers me over him. I think that bothers him a little. Thanks for your response.

 

[Tangnefedd]

Having your child fear you is not what parenting is all about. I am extremely concerned by what you have described as your husband's attitude towards your son. I would say that it does border on the abusive, you don't have to bruise the child to be abusive, yelling at him can cause emotional damage. I do think you need to get help before things really get out of hand.

 

[faith177]

We have the same issues in our family my children are 12 and 4 . my husband grew up in a military family and is very strict, but I have to remember that I grew up in a single parent home with my mom who really had no authority and I was very rebellious in fact did some very dangerous things when I was a teen that really could have gotten me killed, staying out all night, hitchhiking across the country, drugs ect....

So I am caught up in a battle in my own mind of how much do I battle my husband about it, I do think that it is not good to argue about it in front of the children and that is one of my issues that I am trying to work on. I am a blurt out my anger kind of person but it is wrong to do that in front of children, so now if I really disagree I try and stop my mouth and tell the children to go to their rooms and then tell him why I disagree with how he is dealing with it. It really does work much better for one my husband is not angry that I am correcting him or belittling his authority in front of the children so he is more open to listen to my thoughts and we are not showing the children that we are in disagreement over disipline which I think messes with a childs sense of security.

I think as a mother it is hard to see our children disiplined but it is necessary,

 

[Reformationist]

But now that I've had my son things have changed. I think my hubby is too hard on him. I feel like this is because I'm the mom and I have an intuition about my son. I see him have a tantrum because he's frustrated with a failure of his, and my hubby tells him to quit in a harsh voice and spanks him for it.

The important thing about spanking is your motivation for doing it. The first thing parents must recognize is that the only proper "intuition" about children is that they are naturally rebellious. Some children are outwardly rebellious and others are very passive in their rebellion. My daughter is outwardly rebellious. She is more apt to be openly defiant. My oldest son, however, is quite passive in his rebellion. For example, my wife will tell him to come in for dinner and he'll politely say, "Yes ma'am" and then proceed to stay outside.

The first thing that needs to be accomplished is that you, as a parental unit, need to establish and acknowledge a standard. This should be age appropriate but it should not make room for unacceptable behavior. A temper tantrum, AT ANY AGE, is unacceptable behavior and is a spanking offense. Your son's frustration at his failures is perfectly natural. So is his fit. The difference is that while the fit is natural it should never be condoned as an acceptable response to frustration. It should be dealt with accordingly. It would be a bit pointless for you to sit down and have a "discussion" with a 2 year old. Trust me, I have a two year old. They are not able to rationalize their unacceptable behavior. What they can do is acknowledge their wrongdoing and obey so as not to get a spanking.

Remember, as long as you view spanking as a tool used to mold and modify and train your child to respond in godliness because you want to teach them the godly trait of submitting to authority then you'll be just fine.

Now, if your husband is being too physical, i.e., spanking too hard, you should certainly bring it up to him. Men often don't realize that they are spanking too hard and they need to have it pointed out to them.

And he also expects me to do the same thing. I agree with discipline, but in this situation I don't think that spanking him is necessary, as a matter of fact harsh, and I'm afraid my hubby will cause trauma to him psychologically because of it.

Spanking your 2 year old son for throwing a fit is not going to cause him emotional or psychological trauma. It will teach him not to respond that way to frustration. It's a good thing, as long as it's done in love.

I think that it is very natural for a 2 year old to have a tantrum when upset because they don't have impulse control

"Impulse control" isn't a trait inherited at a later age. Most of the adults I know have problems controlling their impulses. Impulse control is a taught behavior. The younger you start teaching them the better.

and my hubby has it in his head that he's going to teach it to him through spanking him every time he has a tantrum. Yes, every once in a while I think that my son should get a spanking for it, but not if his motive isn't wrong.

I sincerely hope that I don't offend you but it sounds like you're looking to provide your son with an excuse for improper behavior. So long as your child isn't hurt then throwing a tantrum should be dealt with by spanking.

Sometimes my son doesn't even know that what he is doing is wrong, it's innocent, and yet my hubby is quick to tell him no in a harsh scary voice and spank him.

Children learn very quickly what type of behavior is acceptable and what isn't. Your husband doesn't always need to start with a spanking for a two year old child. As you said, they are still learning to control their emotions. When my two year old throws a fit I firmly tell him to stop whining or throwing a fit. If he stops, we're good. If not, he's disobeying and I spank him. Tell your son to stop first and if he doesn't then a spanking is in order.

I think my son cries more out of fear than pain and I just can't sit there and watch my hubby spank my son without stepping in somehow, whether to be to comfort my son, protect him, or yell at my hubby for it.

Spankings hurt. They're supposed to hurt. They are not supposed to maim but they are supposed to hurt. I strongly encourage you to discuss this with your husband out of the sight of your son. Children quickly learn how to manipulate their parents and pit one against the other. If they see that you are unified they will be less likely to continue trying to do such things.

Let me assure you, you are not helping your son if you cause you husband to stop spanking him when a spanking is in order, as it is when your son throws a fit. You are setting your son up for more problems because he will not submit to the authority placed over him, be it you, your husband, the law, a boss, etc.

And of course my hubby thinks I'm going to cause him problems because I'm teaching him that he can manipulate me. But even though this may be true, I'm not just going to sit there idolly while my hubby abuses my son ( he doesn't beat him or bruise him, don't go turning him in now).

It sounds to me that your son is not the only one with a problem submitting to the authority placed over them.

If your husband doesn't beat or bruise your son why would you phrase it as "my hubby abuses my son?" It sounds like you think he is beating your son.

We both recognize that it's necessary for us to talk about it, research it, and come to an agreement about discipline, but my hubby is so set that he is right, and I'm convinced he's not. Does anyone have any helpful advice to offer. This really breaks my heart. Thank You.

My advice is that you should submit to your husband, so long as he is not doing lasting physical damage to your son. It is imperative that your children learn to submit to the authority that God has placed over them.

Listen, children do NOT just grow out of ungodly behavior. They are trained out of it. Inconsideration and improper emotional control is not a phase. Or rather, it is. It's called life. This is something you need to deal with as soon as possible and as consistantly as possible.

If it helps, I've "spanked" my children when they were disobedient since they were about a year to a year and a half old. You know how often I have to even correct the behavior of my old son (he's 8) now? About once a week. Guess how often I have to spank him? About once every three months.

Take my advice, deal with their discipline problems now and later you're life will be much easier and your children will be much more considerate and respectful.

One last piece of advice, for you and your husband. For every spanking or harsh word, give at least five hugs. Don't do this one right after the other. That will confuse them. However, don't ever put your children to bed without assuring them of your forgiveness and love. Of course, this presupposes that you are also teaching them to apologize for their wrongdoings. By the way, two is not too young for that either.

God bless

 

[Reformationist]

My son isn't in bad shape or anything, and he does mind my hubby, more so than me

This isn't a coincidence. And a little fear, not of life and limb but of punishment, is a HEALTHY thing.

it's just at the time I can't handle it when I have the understanding that my son is 2 and is incapable of controlling his impulses, yet my hubby thinks that he can learn to control them

Your son CAN learn to control those impulses. He is not incapable. However, to learn that behavior you must start teaching it. If you wait until the child is 10 you will have a reeeeeally hard time teaching them to submit to you.

and he even accuses my son of doing things on purpose, as if he's a 10 year old child, when my son is still just a babe.

Well, a two year old does do these things on purpose, as in, they're not an accident. However, your husband needn't look at your son's behavior maliciously. It's very natural for children to push the envelope. However, you must still establish the bounderies and then stick to them.

My hubby is being softened a little to his tactics from time to time, for example my son prefers me over him most the time, because I'm a lot more soothing and coddling of him, naturally, I'm the mom- but it's starting to get my hubby to question why he prefers me over him. I think that bothers him a little. Thanks for your response.

You are not helping your son. Your coddling is only teaching him to manipulate you and pit you against your husband by showing you more affection than he does your husband. You both need to present a united front.

One thing though, tell you husband to make sure he is NEVER spanking because he is mad. A spanking motivated by anger is NOT a godly motivation. If need be, go into another room, calm down, and then come and administer the spanking.

Remember, the spanking is a tool you should use to train your child to behave in a proper and godly way. It is not a reflex action. It is a thought out, controlled, LOVING response to your child's disobedience.

God bless

 

[Reformationist]

I think as a mother it is hard to see our children disiplined but it is necessary,

Very good point faith.

My wife had the same problems in the beginning as well. Women are, by nature, more emotional and more apt to respond to a child's disobedience by coddling and nurturing. Men should understand this and seek to help their wives by always making sure they are discipling for the right reasons.

God bless

 

[HeatherJay]

I agree with what Reformationist said. Just one thing I'd like to add. I think the yelling your husband does towards your son sounds more out of line than the spankings do. It's one thing to speak firmly and get the point across that you mean business...it's another to lose your temper and yell and spank because you (the parent) has just lost control of yourself. Really, that's nothing more than an adult sized temper tantrum. If spanking is to be effective, it should never be done out of anger. Otherwise the child sees his parents 'throwing a fit" and he models his behavior accordingly.

After reading some of your other posts, I have to wonder if your child's tantrums and clinginess are not a direct result of the tension he feels from you and your husband. I certainly don't mean to sound judgmental at all...but children are VERY sensitive creatures and they're stressed just as easily as we are, if not more so. Poor little boy, I wish I could just give him a big hug.

Love, Heather

 

[Reformationist]

As always in this forum Heather, your post is right on the money. I agree completely. The yelling is definitely the thing to be concerned about, if he is, in fact, yelling.

Also, very good point about the example we give to our children.

Very insightful.

God bless,
Don

 

[Tangnefedd]

I think folk who believe in spanking a child of two for having a tantrum are bordering on abusive. In the UK it is legal to spank a child using very light force, using an implement is illegal, and the parents could find themselves in court. I am in favour of the right to spank, but having read some of the remarks here I am beginning to wonder if spanking should be banned completely!

 

[Reformationist]

I think folk who believe in spanking a child of two for having a tantrum are bordering on abusive. In the UK it is legal to spank a child using very light force, using an implement is illegal, and the parents could find themselves in court. I am in favour of the right to spank, but having read some of the remarks here I am beginning to wonder if spanking should be banned completely!

Fortunately, my wife feels differently. As I said before, spanking should always be motivated by a LOVING desire to train our child up in godliness.

I am not personally inclined to use an "implement." However, there are reasons for that as well.

Either way, I will never submit to a law that forbids me to PROPERLY discipline my child.

You know, the ironic thing is that everyone who comes in contact with my children always express how well behaved, polite and considerate they are. My children are not afraid of me. They are very happy to see me when I come home from work. AND, lately they have come to me when they did something wrong, knowing that they may get a spanking. They do this because they have learned that willful disobedience SHOULD be punished and their behavior shows an actual repentant attitude.

I do not look forward to the day that the liberals side with Dr. Spock and his loony cohorts and try to outlaw spanking. They'll be the first people to complain when our nations youth get even more out of control.

One of the moms of a girl on my daughter's soccer team once told me about a "wonderful book." It was called "How to negotiate with your child." She praised it like "negotiating" with your child is a good thing. I almost laughed in her face. You see, my child is not my equal in authority. For me to treat them as my equal is to discredit the position the Lord has put me in. I would be forsaking my station as the head of my household if I did not take the proper steps to properly train my child to be godly.

God bless

 

[HeatherJay]

I think folk who believe in spanking a child of two for having a tantrum are bordering on abusive. In the UK it is legal to spank a child using very light force, using an implement is illegal, and the parents could find themselves in court. I am in favour of the right to spank, but having read some of the remarks here I am beginning to wonder if spanking should be banned completely!

I haven't read a single post in this thread describing anything that I would consider abusive. Look at some of the other spanking threads...after reading a few of those posts, I would agree with you, but not in this thread.

Love, Heather

 

[Tangnefedd]

I am sorry I totally disagree, the way you discribed your husband's attitude to your son is abusive, in most right thinking people's view. I fear that if things get worse in your family the child care agencies may well be called in to look at the situation

 

[Evening Mist]

hisbloodformysins.... Will your both read some books? I have found the best way to convince my DH of anything is to give him books and articles to read. He always reads what I ask him to. And I read what he asks me to. Esp. regarding parenting.

There is a great book called "Kids are Worth It" by Barbara Coloroso that might be a good starting place. The author is a mother of 4, and also has extensive theological training.

I agree that it is wrong to respond to a tantrum with a spanking. But I am opposed to spanking period. Tantrums in a 2 year old are an indication that he needs help verbalize his feelings more constructively. Hitting him doesn't teach him to do that.

 

[Reformationist]

Books are a fantastic idea.

Here's a very biblically sound book:

What the Bible Says About Child Training, J. Richard Fugate.

I strongly encourage you to read it.

God bless

 

[Reformationist]

There is a great book called "Kids are Worth It" by Barbara Coloroso that might be a good starting place. The author is a mother of 4, and also has extensive theological training.

Evening Mist, does Ms. Coloroso teach against spanking in her book?

Thanks,
God bless

 

[Tangnefedd]

The Bible is hardly a good example of good child training, look at what Abraham put Isaac through, he would have been up in court on a child abuse charge today, and rightly so!

 

[Reformationist]

The Bible is hardly a good example of good child training

:o :o

hisbloodformysins, if this doesn't make alarm bells go off in your head as to who you shouldn't listen to then nothing will.

As parents we view our children as precious gifts from God that we have been entrusted with to raise in the fear and admonition of the Lord. I encourage you to be very careful taking advice from someone who would make the above statement.

God bless

 

[Tangnefedd]

As parents we view our children as precious gifts from God that we have been entrusted with to raise in the fear and admonition of the Lord.

My grandfather was spouting similar sort of garbage as he beat seven bells out of his kids with the buckle end of the belt. God cannot be used as an excuse for child abuse!