Demon Posession

Today at 04:54 PM Live4Jesus said this in Post #120

Usually Servant, if it be from God, He will have more than one (good christian friend) speak it to you, persons who are not aware someone else said the same... and He confirms in other ways as well.

You shouldn't take the prophetic word of just 'one' real seriously until it starts actually being hammered at you... which if it be from God, it will be, because when God speaks He doesn't usually speak in secret, He tells many... He always confirms.

Likewise if 7 athiests tell you the same thing in one day i would worry if the devil weren't on your case for some reason... don't listen to those. God speaks to those He knows, not the others.

For instance, lets say He speaks something to you personally, or someone else speks it to you... but you're not sure it was from Him... chances are good if it was from Him you'll hear the exact same words within a day or two from a pastor, even could be a pastor on a radio show you're listening to, or someone like that. You should generally always wait for confirmation on important things you think He might be saying to you, He always always sends it.

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I have experienced exactly what you are talking about.  When I was near my rebirth, I had this guy at the place I work stop me.  I have never talked to him before nor knew him and I certainly didn't know God at the time.  He gave me a prophecy and told me it was a prophecy from God.  At the time I thought he was crazy, but what he said, I had been told by someone not a week earlier.  His telling me this confirmed it was of God because there is no way he knew about the other person.  And exactly what he said happened and is ongoing today!

God is awesome!



 

Yup, thats right Bro.

Today at 08:00 AM JesusServant said this in Post #117

I too believe in all of the spiritual gifts explained from 1st Corinthians 12 to 1st Corinthians 14 and that they still exist today. I have had two prophecies given to me fulfilled and there is another I assume will be some day. I have witnessed spiritual gifts. I do pray that more churches that are using these gifts and have people with these gifts in their midst pay close attention to what Paul has taught us about them. For example if a whole congregation is speaking in tongues it is just as a gong or clanging cymbol and doesn't edify the church.

I do think people should be very careful speaking for God. IOW, it is dangerous to go around saying God told me to tell you this or God told me to have you do that and not have 100% assurance that it isn't just you trying to sway people in a given situation. You better wait and make sure it isn't just something you want to do and that it is without a doubt the Holy Spirit moving you to act.

I haven't found one scripture that says that any of the gifts of the Spirit are dead and I refuse to believe that what I've seen and witnessed didn't really happen. The Holy Spirit still moves and gifts are still given to God's people and when it happens in your life and you see it, wow is it awesome!

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Your so right. When I was young I was always taught that you will always know 1st if God is telling you something. He will always confirm hisword.

[B In each of these three cases the signs continued one generation and then ceased. 

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Where does it say they stopped or ceased? There is no where. The bible says "these signs will accompany, associated, follow those who believe:" It also says Jesus never changes. Things have not changed, there are still people in the world that need to hear the word. We can not pick and choose what we think still happens and what does not. Are such promises for the first 82 preachers only? Certainly not, Jesus said, "he that believeth" and them that believe" would be able to do his works. Christians are to have power over all power of the devil, "and nothing shall by any means hurt" them.

Today at 07:16 AM 4Jesus said this in Post #126

After Joshua which was one generation after Moses no one ever did the miraculous things like Moses did until Elijah came along and the same is true in the case of Elisha which was one generation after Elijah, so if God is the same yesterday, today and forever, why wouldn't he work the same way in the case of Jesus and the apostles?

They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them Mark 16:18b

Tucked in between casting out demons, speaking with new tongues, and laying hands on the sick we have the above passage. What's your opinion on this?

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Good question. Well the word "take up" greek ario, used 102 times to: Take up, rremove Mt 14:12; Jn 1:29; 11:39,41,48. Take away (Mt 13:12; 22:13). To destory Mt 24:39; Jn 15:2; 1Jn 3:5. Put away Ep 4:31. Do away with or kill lk 23:18;jn19:15 Ac 21:36; 22:22. Remove Mt 21:21; Mk 11:23.

Not one time is the word used of makeing a side show out of serpents or anthing else that it is used with. The whole idea is immunity from snake bites as in Acts 28:1-5 and power over them in confilct as in Lk 10:19; Ps 91:13. 'And drink any deakly thing' speaks for it self..

Today at 12:35 PM 4Jesus said this in Post #130

Quaffer, I could tell you how the Lord has worked with me and tell you about spiritual experiences that would literally curl your toes and a couple of the things happened before I was ever born again. Let me tell you a story now.

One day I was standing in the bathroom brushing my hair and a niece that I haven't seen in probably 15 or 20 years came into my mind ( I hadn't even thought of this girl). I instantly started to openly cry and I don't mean just a weak little sob, the pain gushed out of me like a volcanoe and I was sobbing uncontrolablly! I went into the living room and tried to tell my husband what had happened and that we needed to pray for her and I was crying so hard I could hardly get the words out. He looked at me like I had lost my mind. I believe the Lord, for lack of a better term, put a burden on my heart for her.

Do I believe in the power of God to perform acts like what happened to me in other peoples lives, you bet your bippy I do! but I don't believe that God reveals the exact reasons. It's like the saying goes, "It's on a need to know basis and we don't need to know!"

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4Jesus,

I agree with you.  Where in any of my posts did I say otherwise?  We do not need to know all the details.  I don't ask God for details.  If He tells me it's because He wants me to know.

When God is trying to get me to repent (cease and turnaround) something and I refuse to listen, He loves me so much that He WILL get my attention somehow.  Even if that means that other people find out about my sin.  There are a number of well known telivangilist that we can see that happened too.

Several years ago, I visited a church I had left due to moving away.  When I approached the pastor afterward to say hello, the Holy Spirit spoke to me and showed me this man was in adultery.  I immediately shoved the thought down.  I did not say anything to him but was very bothered that I had such a thought. 

I did not tell anybody, but I did pray for him.  Several months later, I found out that he indeed was in adultery.  The man lost his church and nearly lost his family as a result of it. 

Why did God show it to me?  I don't know.  At the time I did not know much about the operation of the prophetic.  Perhaps I could have said something to him.  Not in a mean or condemning way.  But something that would have let him know that if he was not going to remedy the problem God was.  Again, I don't know.

Another time, I had a very close friend become involved with an unbeliever.  I had an experience similiar to what you described.  As I prayed for her, the Lord told me to call her and tell her that if she did not break the relationship, it would end in violence. 

That was the very first time that God had ever told me to do that, but I obeyed.  She did not heed the warning.  She married the man.  He became violent.  She left him. 

One day he showed up at her parents house where she was staying.  He broke in and as the police arrived he shot her to death and then himself.  That was at least 25 years ago, and I still get emotional over it.  

God will go to whatever depth we force Him to go to in order to protect us.  God uses whoever He wants, whenever He wants, however He wants.  The prophetic is still very much in operation today.

No, I don't need to know.  But if God chooses to tell me, it's for a reason.  And I am doing my best to make sure that I understand why He's telling me and how He wants me to deal with the information He gave me.

Sometimes it is just to pray.  Other times it is to be the tool He desires to use in whatever way He chooses.

Again, it is good if God is not forced to go to such lengths to help us but if He has to He has to.  It's written in His word that that's the way it works.  I don't quite understand why it is rejected.  It is for our benefit.

Of course the prophetic is not only for warning but for incouraging.  Sorta like the young man I referred to that we met on the street.  He was in a place of hopelessness.  But God used us to reveal to him personal things so that he could know that God saw all of this and was working in his behalf.  Maybe you don't need that type of incouragement, but he did.  And God met his need.

God loves just the way we are.  But He loves us too much to let us stay the way we are.  God is able to make ALL things work together for good to those who love Him.   We should not be so anti the methods He chooses to do it.

Quaffer

Today at 09:16 AM 4Jesus said this in Post #126


They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them Mark 16:18b

Tucked in between casting out demons, speaking with new tongues, and laying hands on the sick we have the above passage. What's your opinion on this?

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Well, this scripture could apply quite easily with what is going on in the world today.  Threats of chemical warfare, terrorist attacks, etc.

Coupled with Ps 91 we see God promising protection to ALL who are found in the Secret Place.  It does not say for all who call themselves Christians, but to ALL those who "dwell" in the secret place.

12th February 2003 at 07:16 PM 4Jesus said this in Post #121

Christ did many miraculous things for the Israelites but we are not informed that the Spirit of Christ ever dwelled within them. God helps un-believers today but that doesn't mean that the Holy Spirit is in them. The import of this passage is that Paul is speaking about the case of the Corinthians who were tempted to feast on the heathen sacrifices and he also cautions against fornication, a sin to which the inhabitants of Corinth were peculiarly addicted to. Paul admonishes them to be mindful of the sins of Israel if they want to escape the plagues that befell them.  



I still get the sense that you are trying to say that since the old is a type it is equal to the new.

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The old is a picture of the new, a for shadowing, a prophecy hiden within the very framework of the old.  It is not equal to but mearly points to the new and brings the new into greater light.  Paul himself oftain times shows the reltionship between the new and the old.  Eve wasnot talking about Isreal when she made reference to the passage in Ezekiel, she was talking specificaly about the temple.  Paul also made reference to Solomon's temple in describing the condition and make up of man.  Eve plainly said that the temple had both the Spirit of God and demons ocupying the temple at the same time.  God in the Most Holy place and demons in the Holy place and the inner court.  If demons could occupy the temple of God with God in Ezekiel's time, then why can't they do the same thing in our time.  As it is you have sin and God occupying the same temple even in your life.  One could easily ask how can Light and darkness occupy the same house?  It is the same question.  Yet we see that occuring in almost every christian on the planet.  In fact that has so much become the norm, that most christians think that nothing else is possible.  Light and darkness occupying the same house?  How can a tree give off both good and evil fruit?  But we see that every day.  And it is the fruit of the seed that is in you.  You say that it is impossible for demons to be in Christians.  Well why don't you say that it is impossible for darkness to be in Christians, that is what John was saying in 1 John.  But yet these same christians will say that no other possability exist as long as we are on earth.  Is not darkness the home of demons and every evil spirit.  So if there is darkness/sin in your heart the there is a home in your heart for a demon, may be even a legion.  How can sin exist where God exist?  Is He not holy?

The answer is that sin does not exist where God exist.  Neither does light. The problem with all who sin and are demon possess, and all who experience desease, and darkness is that they have confinded God to only live in their spirit.  They do not give God access to the area of their lives where darkness, and demons, and sin, and desease lives, because they love their darkness.  They want the blessing instead of the blesser.  They want a visitation and not a habitation.  Release God to fully concure every area of your life and no area of darkness will stand before the judgement and habitation of the Lord.

You may say that you have already been saved, that is true.  But tell me why that salvation is not manifest in your mind, your will, you emotions, and your flesh.  If God is Lord, then why does sin dominate?  If the Light reigns and has all of the control, then why is there still darkness?  If Jesus is your master then why are you still a slave to sin, to your flesh.

Because you lock God away and say, "Just get me to heaven."

The signs and wonders used with god's blessing were three times in history: the giving of the law, Moses; the beginning of the prophets, Elijah; the gospel of grace, Jesus Christ. In each of these three cases the signs continued one generation and then ceased. The signs, wonders and miracles movement of this Laodician age is the dawn of the strong delusion which will bring the world to the feet of antichrist. 1Thessalonians 2:5-12[/COLOR]

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The would not the second coming be another time to mark with signs and wonders. 

Gee, a victorious chuch, what a concept.  Isn't a strong woman of virtue, better then a beaten down and abused shell of a woman?

One day I was standing in the bathroom brushing my hair and a niece that I haven't seen in probably 15 or 20 years came into my mind ( I hadn't even thought of this girl). I instantly started to openly cry and I don't mean just a weak little sob, the pain gushed out of me like a volcanoe and I was sobbing uncontrolablly! I went into the living room and tried to tell my husband what had happened and that we needed to pray for herÊand I was crying so hard I could hardly get the words out. He looked at me like I had lost my mind. I believe the Lord, for lack of a better term, put a burden on my heart for her.

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its pretty odd you believe in a supernatural experience like this but then say that the gifts have ceased. I will tell you what you experienced.

The Holy Spirit gave you a Word of Knowledge (one of the 9 supernatural gifts of the Holy Spirit) through the form/administration of a mental vision. IOW he's telling you something abt your niece. You wld still be clueless had he not told you.

And like you said, he placed a burden on your heart to pray for your niece. Perhaps she was in some kind of trouble. Other people have experienced this, and those who are able to pray in tongues (the Holy Spirit prays thru you and knows what to pray for who cos He knows what's happening) will drop to their knees immediately and pray until that burden lifts. then they know they have prayed through the situation into victory. Many a times, its a matter of life and death. The Pentecostals are familiar with this.

If cessationism is true, then technically and theologically, what happened to you shld not have happened at all. IOW your experiece wld be called a hoax by other cessationists.

so you don't want to debate demon possession, just the validity of the present day gifts?

And of everything that I said that is the only thing you want to comment on?

Are the signs and miracles of Moses, Elijah and Jesus REALLY all the signs and miracles ever? Not quite.  Moses, Elijah and Jesus(and their generations) were empowered to do miracles, yes.  Moses and Elijah were of the old covenent, Jesus brought the New OUT of the Old.  (He fulfilled it: remained sinless, and was the one pure sacrifice that once and for all made atonement). Before Moses there was no covenant, and without it, we can return again to mans original state, through Jesus.       

There were other miracles done in the OT, such as Daniel escaping the lions and Shadrach and his companions in the firey furnace, or David sending away spirits with his Psalms.  God Himself perfomed them on their behalf and David was annointed.  In the context of the old covenent, Gods Spirit was separate from man and did miracles.  Jesus' death rent the veil of the temple. He united us again with God, as the first Adam was. When we are born again, we literally experience life as Adam before the fall, and Jesus after the cross. 

If we say the old testament signs ceased after Jesus, then the old covenant would not be fulfilled.  Moses and Elijahs generation ceased their signs because they died under the old covenent. Jesus conquered death and came back, alive. He then gave all authority to those that believe on Him and then sent the Holy Spirit after He had left. The signs do not cease with Jesus generation, but instead they remain, because He is alive.

EveOfGrace    

      

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