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Cults, Reality and Mormonism.

AeonJ

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In regards to Mormonism being false and a cult. It is my personal belief that Jesus started a "Jewish cult" in the sense that the Jewish community did not accept Jesus' church as theirs and declared it false.

This theory holds up to the lipnis test of today's reality in that to be considered a "cult" by many mainstream Christian apologetics all one has to do is test the "cult notion" against popular opinion and you have the notion that any new belief system that people believe is not true or false is a cult.

So technically all religions, belief systems and theories according to Christian apologetics like her could have been considered cults at one point or another. :preach:
 
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Phantasman

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Dictionary.com

cult


   [kuhlt] Show IPA
noun 1. a particular system of religious worship, especially with reference to its rites and ceremonies.

2. an instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, especially as manifested by a body of admirers.

3. the object of such devotion.

4. a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc.

5. Sociology . a group having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols.

I don't see where she's wrong.
 
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Soulgazer

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A cult will attempt to limit what you can and cannot believe, what entertainment you may or may not pursue, and the types of friends that you may or may not have.

Cults can be obvious, or surreptitious, slyly taking over a persons life. Sometimes they come disguised as Christian churches, health organizations or business prospects.
 
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Phantasman

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Here's a definition of cult that is truer than most people are willing to admit. A cult is any church that doesn't believe like your church does.

Yeah, that should have been #6 above.

There are good people in all religions that are seeking Christ. I worry about the ones that feel they found him.
 
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SharonL

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Mormon people are above the norm with morallity, truthfullness and honesty. They believe in God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit - they just go about it in a little different way, that does not make God any less God. I think Romney and Glenn Beck are a credit to their faith, they are leaders with high standards.
 
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TasteForTruth

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In regards to Mormonism being false and a cult. It is my personal belief that Jesus started a "Jewish cult" in the sense that the Jewish community did not accept Jesus' church as theirs and declared it false.

This theory holds up to the lipnis test of today's reality in that to be considered a "cult" by many mainstream Christian apologectics (Phoebe Ann) all one has to do is test the "cult notion" against popular opinion and you have the notion that any new belief system that people believe is not true or false is a cult.

So technically all religions, belief systems and theories according to Phoebe Ann and other Christian apologetics like her could have been considered cults at one point or another. :preach:
Since you have been public about it, I will be public about it... Specifically, I believe that you have overstepped forum rules and the bounds of propriety in making specific mention of Phoebe Ann the way you have in this thread. I believe it is wrong to presume to speak for her, making strawman statements based on your own assumptions of what she would think or say. I believe it is wrong to criticize her for making apologetic statements which defend her own religion and point of view. And while it is no secret in this forum that I personally do not agree with her portrayal of the Mormon religion, I believe it is wrong to go out of your way to make a thread which purports to be about a specific topic, and then target in that thread a poster—by name—as representative of a the group spoken of in the post with which you have disagreement. It would be appropriate, however, to comment—even critically—on specific statements made by that poster in a thread or post on the topic in question. I'll get off my soapbox now, but I believe you owe Phoebe Ann a public apology.
 
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Rescued One

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Dictionary.com

cult


   [kuhlt] Show IPA
noun 1. a particular system of religious worship, especially with reference to its rites and ceremonies.

2. an instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, especially as manifested by a body of admirers.

3. the object of such devotion.

4. a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc.

5. Sociology . a group having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols.

I don't see where she's wrong.

I don't see where she used the word cult.
 
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PureDose

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In regards to Mormonism being false and a cult. It is my personal belief that Jesus started a "Jewish cult" in the sense that the Jewish community did not accept Jesus' church as theirs and declared it false.

This theory holds up to the lipnis test of today's reality in that to be considered a "cult" by many mainstream Christian apologectics (Phoebe Ann) all one has to do is test the "cult notion" against popular opinion and you have the notion that any new belief system that people believe is not true or false is a cult.

So technically all religions, belief systems and theories according to Phoebe Ann and other Christian apologetics like her could have been considered cults at one point or another. :preach:


It could be said there are bad cults and good cults, by the modern definition of the word.

But, when one means a true cult, a Christian cult, they are really talking about legalistic groups which are of the spirit of the anti-christ. Cults are microcosms, ultimately, of macrocosms of tyrannies, such as one sees in totalitarian nations.

There are ultimately two ways: one way is by legalism, by "do this" and "do not do that". The other way is by faith, by grace working through faith.

True faith is only possible by the Spirit of God.

Of course, in reality, many groups have a mixture of the two, just as even the apostles started to go off to the circumcision group.


I have known Mormons I consider to be good Christians at heart, and so in truth.


The fact of the matter is there are many full blown legalistic cults who have abandoned salvation by grace through faith. Very many of these will preach "grace, grace, grace", but it is a cover, a lie. They preach "faith, faith, faith", but it is a lie.

And on top of those many lies required for such atrocious and hypocritical duplicity are, of course, many other wrong beliefs.


What I am saying is what anyone who has ever read the Gospels knows to be true: there are countless cults of all sizes in Christianity which are considered to not be cultist in beliefs by mainstream understanding -- but they are outrageously cultic.


In any cult, despite their false teachings, there may be saved Christians who live by the Spirit.

They think themselves different from the Mormons because their false teachings are secretly introduced, as the Apostle warned us about, and have been widely accepted. They are subtle, but dangerous deceptions.


Stalin, we might note, was considered globally by people to be a good man. He tricked the world. Hitler, even, was not taken for what he was as he was until he really started to show his true colors to everyone.


What matters is whether a person is obedient to the Holy Testimony of Christ.

People have shown over the millenia - as they abundantly show to this day - they will do just about anything to not obey the Testimony of Christ and yet still pretend to be followers of Christ.
 
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Albion

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In regards to Mormonism being false and a cult. It is my personal belief that Jesus started a "Jewish cult" in the sense that the Jewish community did not accept Jesus' church as theirs and declared it false.

Yes, but that sense of the word "cult" is not the one that causes many Christians to label Mormonism a cult. It's not being different; it's how the religion is different.

So technically all religions, belief systems and theories according to Phoebe Ann and other Christian apologetics like her could have been considered cults at one point or another.

Not only that, but all religions ARE cults by one definition of the word, but again, the word is used with reference to the LDS because its beliefs depart fundamentally from historic and Biblical Christianity, not merely because it disagrees on lesser doctrinal matters.
 
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B

bbbbbbb

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Since you have been public about it, I will be public about it... Specifically, I believe that you have overstepped forum rules and the bounds of propriety in making specific mention of Phoebe Ann the way you have in this thread. I believe it is wrong to presume to speak for her, making strawman statements based on your own assumptions of what she would think or say. I believe it is wrong to criticize her for making apologetic statements which defend her own religion and point of view. And while it is no secret in this forum that I personally do not agree with her portrayal of the Mormon religion, I believe it is wrong to go out of your way to make a thread which purports to be about a specific topic, and then target in that thread a poster—by name—as representative of a the group spoken of in the post with which you have disagreement. It would be appropriate, however, to comment—even critically—on specific statements made by that poster in a thread or post on the topic in question. I'll get off my soapbox now, but I believe you owe Phoebe Ann a public apology.

That is really one of the kindest posts I have read in ages. I held my breath when I opened this thread and was secretly grateful that I was not the target. I hope the OP takes your post to heart and closes this thread before it degenerates.
 
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Phantasman

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Since you have been public about it, I will be public about it... Specifically, I believe that you have overstepped forum rules and the bounds of propriety in making specific mention of Phoebe Ann the way you have in this thread. I believe it is wrong to presume to speak for her, making strawman statements based on your own assumptions of what she would think or say. I believe it is wrong to criticize her for making apologetic statements which defend her own religion and point of view. And while it is no secret in this forum that I personally do not agree with her portrayal of the Mormon religion, I believe it is wrong to go out of your way to make a thread which purports to be about a specific topic, and then target in that thread a poster—by name—as representative of a the group spoken of in the post with which you have disagreement. It would be appropriate, however, to comment—even critically—on specific statements made by that poster in a thread or post on the topic in question. I'll get off my soapbox now, but I believe you owe Phoebe Ann a public apology.

Yeah, I'm gonna back you up here, TFT. The UT section doesn't need to go this far.
 
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