Creation what do you think about Old Earth Creationism?

[Lebesgue]

I am a former SDA and an Old Earth Creationist. When I was still an SDA I found it to be an extremely unpopular viewpoint and was nearly disfellowshipped for teaching OECism in a Sabbath school class on Creation.

I DO believe G-d created everything in 6 days, but they were 6 of His days which could be billions of years and the Theory of Relativity supports this.

There is just too much evidience of an old earth.

Are there any SDAs who are OECs or are you all YECs.
It certainly seems like being a YEC is almost a test of fellowship for being an SDA.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[RND]

I am a former SDA and an Old Earth Creationist. When I was still an SDA I found it to be an extremely unpopular viewpoint and was nearly disfellowshipped for teaching OECism in a Sabbath school class on Creation.

I DO believe G-d created everything in 6 days, but they were 6 of His days which could be billions of years and the Theory of Relativity supports this.

There is just too much evidience of an old earth.

Are there any SDAs who are OECs or are you all YECs.
It certainly seems like being a YEC is almost a test of fellowship for being an SDA.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

I believe the "orb" we are on was created by God billions of years ago. I believe everything on the "orb" was created in six literal & actual days, i.e. mornings & evenings.

 

[Lebesgue]

I've heard that before and it actually seems reasonable.

I do disagree though on when G-d created life I believe that creatures lived and died when the fossil record says they did.

But what you stated above looks to me like it is a reasonable argument.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[RND]

I do disagree though on when G-d created life I believe that creatures lived and died when the fossil record says they did.

So you believe that death came before sin?

Romans 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

 

[Lebesgue]

Yes, for animals but not for mankind.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[RND]

Yes, for animals but not for mankind.

"...death by sin..."

After Adam and Eve sinned God clothed them with what?

 

[Lebesgue]

Skins of animals but that doesn't mean animals weren't dying before then.

Look at the fossils. Do you really think a monster like T-Rex EVER ate anything other than meat? I don't think so, NOT with THOSE teeth.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[RC_NewProtestants]

I am also an Old Earth creationist. I believe theistic evolution is the most likely method. The evidence I think is pretty strong. I don't think the Genesis story was meant for all time to indicate that the story is literal. Even most young earth creationists redefine the story on some elements and then complain if you don't accept it as literal. It is funny what tradition does to people.

I do reject the idea that God was the first person to kill in the earthly creation. All the word for skins means is a covering and it is God after all in the story He just created the whole universe yet some people think He had to kill animals to make clothes. Strange.

 

[RND]

Skins of animals but that doesn't mean animals weren't dying before then.

Conversely though, it doesn't mean that they were either.

Look at the fossils. Do you really think a monster like T-Rex EVER ate anything other than meat? I don't think so, NOT with THOSE teeth.

All the evidence of the fossil record shows that these animals died suddenly. A flood of massive proportions could be considered "sudden" don't you think?

 

[Jimlarmore]

Skins of animals but that doesn't mean animals weren't dying before then.

Look at the fossils. Do you really think a monster like T-Rex EVER ate anything other than meat? I don't think so, NOT with THOSE teeth.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

I've spent the majority of my life digging in the earth and looking at what is there fossil wise etc. I've studied both sides of the arguement on the origin of fossils and the age of them. In the last 20 or so years I have come to understand a lot about the process of scientific conclusions and how they are made. From the interpretation of the evidence it seems very strong to conclude that evolution is the right choice. However, there is almost always more than one way to interpret evidence. Fossil's are not made the way most scientist think they are and the really smart ones know it , they just don't want to rock any boats. Fossils only come from extreme conditions and special circumstances you find in a catastrophic event like what we see happening during the flood.

Radiometric dating is suspect for accuracy because of too many assumptions that have to be made for it to work right. Even if you look at the fossil record and assume they are billions of years old in some cases you won't find conclusive evidence that life evolved the way they say it did. The record is sadly lacking in intermediate life forms that show a change from one form of life to another. Then you have a very big problem cellularly with irreducible complexity in that many of the components of a cell had to be there at the start and could not have evolved and work as they do.

As far as the earth being old or not I have mixed opinions on that. I think the earth itself could be billions of years old but the life on it was created in six literal evenings and mornings as the Bible says. THe universe is very very very huge and if you take the apparent distance from us to the furthest galaxies you realize God has been about creating things for a long long time.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[JonMiller]

I don't consider myself a YEC or a OEC. There is no scientific evidence for YEC. Despite that, I do think that it is possible ("With God, all things are possible"), but think it more likely that the story is talking about something that is true but not historically factually correct.

JM

 

[djconklin]

I am a former SDA and an Old Earth Creationist. When I was still an SDA I found it to be an extremely unpopular viewpoint and was nearly disfellowshipped for teaching OECism in a Sabbath school class on Creation.

I DO believe G-d created everything in 6 days, but they were 6 of His days which could be billions of years and the Theory of Relativity supports this.

1) The Theory of Relativity has nothing whatsoever to do with creation, evolution, or the age of the earth or universe. It has to do with time and light and the effects of gravity: see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_relativity

2) If you were going to be disfellowshipped over OEC then you beloneged to as cultic church masquerading as a mainstream SDA church.

 

[RND]

1) The Theory of Relativity has nothing whatsoever to do with creation, evolution, or the age of the earth or universe. It has to do with time and light and the effects of gravity: see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_relativity

2) If you were going to be disfellowshipped over OEC then you beloneged to as cultic church masquerading as a mainstream SDA church.

I've been thinking that ever since this guy showed up on the thread DJ that he might be a troll. He seems to believe and claims to have been taught loads of stuff that don't seem to have any Adventist theology behind them.

 

[RC_NewProtestants]

I've been thinking that ever since this guy showed up on the thread DJ that he might be a troll. He seems to believe and claims to have been taught loads of stuff that don't seem to have any Adventist theology behind them.

Why would you say that, we have seen the same thing here. Jim and some others frequently dismisses my ideas about theistic evolution or old age of the earth as if I was stomping on the Bible.

Of course I know why you say it. You want to dismiss his views and label him as an opponent of Christianity and the SDA church. It does speak volumes about you though, not so much about him however.

 

[JonMiller]

I know specific churchs that I would attend a sunday baptist church over them. I could beleive that such a church would try to disfellowship me.

JM

 

[RND]

Why would you say that, we have seen the same thing here. Jim and some others frequently dismisses my ideas about theistic evolution or old age of the earth as if I was stomping on the Bible.

Of course I know why you say it. You want to dismiss his views and label him as an opponent of Christianity and the SDA church. It does speak volumes about you though, not so much about him however.

The reason I said what I did is quite clear.

 

[OntheDL]

I am a former SDA and an Old Earth Creationist. When I was still an SDA I found it to be an extremely unpopular viewpoint and was nearly disfellowshipped for teaching OECism in a Sabbath school class on Creation.

I DO believe G-d created everything in 6 days, but they were 6 of His days which could be billions of years and the Theory of Relativity supports this.

There is just too much evidience of an old earth.

Are there any SDAs who are OECs or are you all YECs.
It certainly seems like being a YEC is almost a test of fellowship for being an SDA.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

Well what about the 7th day? Why wouldn't that be billions of years also? If so why do you still keep the sabbath?

Notice in Genesis, the length of day was defined by evening and morning (boqer wayhiy ereb). The same phrase (boqer wayhiy ereb) used throughout the old testament for the definitions of day (Yom).

 

[Lebesgue]

Well what about the 7th day? Why wouldn't that be billions of years also? If so why do you still keep the sabbath?

Notice in Genesis, the length of day was defined by evening and morning (boqer wayhiy ereb). The same phrase (boqer wayhiy ereb) used throughout the old testament for the definitions of day (Yom).

I keep Shabbat because G-d COMMANDED it. I don't need any other reason.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[Lebesgue]

Why would you say that, we have seen the same thing here. Jim and some others frequently dismisses my ideas about theistic evolution or old age of the earth as if I was stomping on the Bible.

Of course I know why you say it. You want to dismiss his views and label him as an opponent of Christianity and the SDA church. It does speak volumes about you though, not so much about him however.

Thank you for your support, RC. I appreciate it. G-d Bless you.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[Lebesgue]

I've been thinking that ever since this guy showed up on the thread DJ that he might be a troll. He seems to believe and claims to have been taught loads of stuff that don't seem to have any Adventist theology behind them.

RND, I am NOT a "troll" whatever that is.

I went to very conservative historic SDA churches my entire time as an Adventist, maybe you didn't.

Despite what you may think of me, I've got nothing against you and in fact, G-d Bless you!

Shalom,

Lebesgue