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Could Vienna’s approach to affordable housing work in California?
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<blockquote data-quote="ThatRobGuy" data-source="post: 77661371" data-attributes="member: 123415"><p>"Could" vs. "Would"</p><p></p><p>There's a lot of European nations that have models that "could" work if implemented here...the real question is "would" people here be willing to tolerate the adjustments required in order to make it happen?</p><p></p><p>I'd say the answer to that is "no".</p><p></p><p>And that's not just digging on one side here... The various provisions and guardrails that make a lot of these systems work in other places would involve various things that neither side would like in the US.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Case in point, tuition-free education that resembles what the Nordic countries do.</p><p></p><p>That idea wouldn't get off the ground here for multiple reasons.</p><p>A) Conservatives would never agree to pay the additional taxes required to fund it</p><p>...but also</p><p>B) Progressives wouldn't like the stipulations in place that keep it sustainable (like the 50% rejection rate, and hard caps on arts and humanities studies with regards to how many people get to study those things)</p><p></p><p>So it would quickly devolve into "Whaddya mean I have to pay more taxes?!?!" vs. "Whaddya mean I can't opt to study music theory because there's only 800 seats allotted for that I'm don't meet the cut?!?!"</p><p></p><p></p><p>The same is true for this situation with Vienna's subsidized housing...if they tried a carbon copy of that here, neither side would like it.</p><p>Conservatives would bristle at the additional taxes</p><p>Progressives would bristle at the stipulations</p><p></p><p>[URL unfurl="true"]https://reason.com/2023/09/21/the-hidden-failures-of-social-housing-in-red-vienna/[/URL]</p><p></p><p></p><p>When looking at the European models for "free stuff", people here tend to focus exclusively on "the stuff that people are getting", and almost never consider the "social buy-in" that the Euro nations require to participate in those systems.</p><p></p><p>Healthcare would be another example... live in a country that offers it, sure, your doctor visits are free. The other side of that coin, they're going to heavily restrict and tax things considered to be unhealthy. Pick your poison.</p><p></p><p></p><p>To put in the plainest terms: There's no sustainable system in which you have all of your basic needs met and get a nice place to live, that doesn't involve some sort of meaningful contribution to society and social buy-in/sacrifice.</p><p></p><p>IE: No sustainable system in existence is going to put you up in a nice apartment and make sure you're well-fed for your "art, philosophy, and activism services".</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ThatRobGuy, post: 77661371, member: 123415"] "Could" vs. "Would" There's a lot of European nations that have models that "could" work if implemented here...the real question is "would" people here be willing to tolerate the adjustments required in order to make it happen? I'd say the answer to that is "no". And that's not just digging on one side here... The various provisions and guardrails that make a lot of these systems work in other places would involve various things that neither side would like in the US. Case in point, tuition-free education that resembles what the Nordic countries do. That idea wouldn't get off the ground here for multiple reasons. A) Conservatives would never agree to pay the additional taxes required to fund it ...but also B) Progressives wouldn't like the stipulations in place that keep it sustainable (like the 50% rejection rate, and hard caps on arts and humanities studies with regards to how many people get to study those things) So it would quickly devolve into "Whaddya mean I have to pay more taxes?!?!" vs. "Whaddya mean I can't opt to study music theory because there's only 800 seats allotted for that I'm don't meet the cut?!?!" The same is true for this situation with Vienna's subsidized housing...if they tried a carbon copy of that here, neither side would like it. Conservatives would bristle at the additional taxes Progressives would bristle at the stipulations [URL unfurl="true"]https://reason.com/2023/09/21/the-hidden-failures-of-social-housing-in-red-vienna/[/URL] When looking at the European models for "free stuff", people here tend to focus exclusively on "the stuff that people are getting", and almost never consider the "social buy-in" that the Euro nations require to participate in those systems. Healthcare would be another example... live in a country that offers it, sure, your doctor visits are free. The other side of that coin, they're going to heavily restrict and tax things considered to be unhealthy. Pick your poison. To put in the plainest terms: There's no sustainable system in which you have all of your basic needs met and get a nice place to live, that doesn't involve some sort of meaningful contribution to society and social buy-in/sacrifice. IE: No sustainable system in existence is going to put you up in a nice apartment and make sure you're well-fed for your "art, philosophy, and activism services". [/QUOTE]
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