Confession, need prayer

[Remny]

This will probably be a little different for you guys.  This is my first confession though I was raised christian.  I think I have dealt with past sins, and I don't want to go through my whole life with you, so don't worry.  The past couple of mounths though, I have not been as I should be.

First off let me start by telling you I'm gay.  Before I would talk about my relationships and just gender switch.  A lot of you are probably going to have fits about this and of course you probably think this is a sin, but I assure God and I are ok on this subject, regardless sin or not, I do not wish forgiveness for this fact of my life.  If you are just going to tell me how horrible it is to be gay, don't bother, just move on.  That is not the point of this prayer request.  If you have a better understanding of God's Will and his love read on.

You see, I had been dateing someone for a while, not too long ago.  I did love him, I had gotten to know him over the course of a year before we started dateing and we grew very close together doing fun stuff like camping and hikeing and sports, it had been very nice.  However, you see before we officially started dateing, he had made plans to change his career, he had planned to become a flight attendant.  When we started dateing, we didn't yet know when he would leave to become a flight attendant, just knew it was a while off.  We committed in a monogomouse relationship.  Eventually we got the date he would be leaving.  We planned to break up on that date, but to stay together untill then.  It wouldn't be practical for us to stay together after he left.  He would never be home, he wouldn't even be living in the same state, and if I moved with him, like I said he just wouldn't be around very often.  I thought I was ok with this, but it began to gnaw at me.

We were having sexual relations at this time, and of course I know having sex before marriage is not good, but such a thing is hard when your gay.  Though ideally that's how I'd like it to be, I ask God forgives me for that though, I don't know if such a thing is possible for me.  You know abstaning.  I try but I sometimes I feel so intensly for someone it just seems to me like we're married.  Anyhow, continueing.  Rick, he had a very odd sex drive and quite frankly he RARELY EVER PUT OUT.  So this added with that he was leaving made me feel all sorts of bad.  We'd argue about this from time to time, and he just told me that I should go have sex with someone else.  Now sex isn't very important to me, honestly.  However I would like to feel wanted in a relationship, so when he told me this it was very upsetting.  It's not something I would want to go out and do and I know he didn't mean it.  He is just very passive aggressive that way.  Anyhow to make a long story short, well as short as possible, I ended up cheating on him... on about 3 occasions.  I'll try not to make excuses, I know that's really bad, and that's why I beg the lord for forgiveness.  I'd like this to be whiped clean before I get seriously involved with someone else again. 

I told him half truthes about this, and he got very upset, though he is the one that told me to do it... not that that is an excuse, just a fact.  Anyhow, he moved away yesterday, and I'd like to get on with my life and would like to be forgiven so I can try at being a better person, but it's hard when you have bad stuff like this on your record, because you just aren't a good person untill it's gone, so you don't have much motivation to be good.  Ah sorry that probably doesn't make much sense.

I've always had very strong ideals about relationships and when sex should happen and when it shouldn't and I used to be very strong about these things.  I really think sex should be special and an act of love, but this past year I've messed up a lot in that area.  I want a good relationship and one that is not bassed on sex.  I want to be like I used to be and have good moral convictions.  I'm feeling jaded about the whole thing lately, so I pray for forgiveness and a fresh attitude. 

I am seeing someone right now.  He is absolutely beautiful, a gift from God himself.  If I closed my eyes and thought for hours I couldn't imagine someone more beautiful.  I don't want to mess things up with him.  He's very sweet and we do a lot together, though I think we did have sex waay too early in our relationship, so I need forgivness for that, I pray that that does not ruin anything.

So please send your prayers to God for me.  Please spare me any lectures about homosexualality.  I really have strong faith in God, and despite other flaws I have, being gay is not one of them.  Please just focus on the issue I brought up and not on the fact I'm gay.  We'll see what happens here, but I want to share who I really am with you folks.  You have been so helpful to me in the past.  If you do not accept this though, I will move on quietly, and i still appreciate all your prayers.

Thank you

Benjamin

 

[AnnMercy2]

Hi! Okay, I have to be honest from the begginning. This is just how I am. I believe homosexuality is wrong BUT I love people regardless of who they are, what they do, or anything else. God loves us no matter what why should I, as God's child, be any different? I do my best to understand things ( not that that always happens!) Anyways, Only you can answer to God for yourself. Ain't nobody have the right to think that they can claim to know God's mind and tell somebody what is best for them. I try my best to listen to what God wants me to say. And right now I feel that I should tell you to sit down have a long talk with God. I will likewise have a talk with God. I'll pray that he shows you what you should do in your situation.

Here is my Prayer for you:

Dear God, I pray right now that you show your child Benjamin that there is no other way but through you. I pray that he gives all his troubles over to you and that he draws even closer to you God. You God are the only one who can carry us through the hard times and you let us make mistakes and yet you keep loving us even more. Help Benjamin, come to love you God more than anything else in his life. I know I struggle daily with putting you first God, this happens because we are human. But I know that you God loves everybody regardless of what we've done. God loves me wether or not I've falied him in some way. God, you know I myself how many times you've had to pick me up, dust me off and put me back on the right track. I know you will do the same for Benjamin, you've done it for so many people already and yet you never get tired of picking up us humans when we do something. So I pray that you show your love to Benjamin, give him a sense of peace that only you God can give. Do your work in his life as you God see fit. In Jesus name I pray, AMEN

Love In Christ,
Anna


P.S Sometimes I don't make much sense, but then I think maybe God will help the person understand what I'm saying maybe God has some special meaning in what I say for another person to understand. God don't always reveal or explain why he wants me to do something. But like I said who am I to question the Almighty God. Will continue praying for you and i think I'll send some smiles your way sound like you can use them. , well okay they are not smiles they are some really big chessey grins

 

[psycmajor]

You seem like an intelligent person  . Yeah, I'm not sure if I could handle having anyone I love being away from me for so long! Is his being a flight attendent going to be permanent?

It sounds like you feel rejected because he didn't want to have sex as often as you did. What do you think of my idea?

How do you justify cheating on him? You said that he told you to do so, but it was just as a way to dismiss you. Did you realize before you cheated on him that he was dismissing you? To me, it sort of sounds like revenge on your part to have cheated on him since he wouldn't put out.

Perhaps you could tell him the whole truth as soon as you can, at least for the sake of freeing your conscience a bit. Are he and you "over with"? I would also recommend that you tell your future partner your FULL PAST, including things that you're not proud of doing. At least you would be honest with the person. If you know you can keep your promise, tell them that it will not happen in the current relationship you're in. If you don't, you might feel like you're hiding something from your partner, and then you begin to feel vulnerable, possibly poisoning the relationship. It is not settling to have a guilty conscience.

Originally posted by Remny
Now sex isn't very important to me, honestly.  However I would like to feel wanted in a relationship, so when he told me this it was very upsetting.

 

You mean sex isn't very important to you anymore, or you're just stating that it isn't, and never has been? Could you expand on the "feel[ing] wanted in a relationship" part? Do you mean that feeling sexually desireable is an important part of the relationship for you? What are you reasons? Not that that's bad, but just wondering.

I've always had very strong ideals about relationships and when sex should happen and when it shouldn't and I used to be very strong about these things.  I really think sex should be special and an act of love, but this past year I've messed up a lot in that area.  I want a good relationship and one that is not bassed on sex.  I want to be like I used to be and have good moral convictions.  I'm feeling jaded about the whole thing lately, so I pray for forgiveness and a fresh attitude. 

 

How did you get to the point of compromising your beliefs? Was it because you wanted to feel accepted? Or something else?

Please spare me any lectures about homosexualality.  I really have strong faith in God, and despite other flaws I have, being gay is not one of them.  Please just focus on the issue I brought up and not on the fact I'm gay.  We'll see what happens here, but I want to share who I really am with you folks.  You have been so helpful to me in the past.  If you do not accept this though, I will move on quietly, and i still appreciate all your prayers. 

I will pray for you. However, I do have some questions. These questions are NOT intended to be judgmental; rather, I would like to learn more about gays so I can better understand them. From their point of view, not just my own and others. It is not to get ammunition for flaming you. This thread looks like a good opportunity to me, if you don't mind...

Here you go:

Have you always been gay? Do you believe that some people are "born gay"? Or is it completely by choice? If it is a chosen lifestyle, how does it compare to a heterosexual lifestyle? Is it better or worse, or a little of both?

You seem to accept your sexuality. Was that more difficult for you to do as a homosexual than it was for a heterosexual?

Were you a Christian before you became gay (if these feelings surfaced some years after you were born)? How do you think God feels about gays? I know He loves you, and you seem to know that as well, but what do you think He thinks?

Is anyone else in your family gay? How did your family react? How did your friends react? How do or did you deal with those reactions?

Other than your sexual preference, do you feel that you are in any way(s) different, or do you feel that you are the same as other people?

Is it hard to find people who are willing to "come out," so you can create romantic relationships? I'm actually wondering if that has something to do with your current dilemma, but I'm not sure.

Have you had a romantic relationship with a female before? If so, how did things go?

One last thought: please be aware of AIDS and take precautions! AIDS does not discriminate when it comes to sexual orientation, but I have read that it happens to be more prevalent among homosexuals. Again, I'm not being judgmental, that's just what I've read.

Thanks, sorry for being long-winded! 

 

[ZiSunka]

I am seeing someone right now. He is absolutely beautiful, a gift from God himself. If I closed my eyes and thought for hours I couldn't imagine someone more beautiful. I don't want to mess things up with him. He's very sweet and we do a lot together, though I think we did have sex waay too early in our relationship, so I need forgivness for that, I pray that that does not ruin anything.

So please send your prayers to God for me. Please spare me any lectures about homosexualality. I really have strong faith in God, and despite other flaws I have, being gay is not one of them. Please just focus on the issue I brought up and not on the fact I'm gay. We'll see what happens here, but I want to share who I really am with you folks. You have been so helpful to me in the past. If you do not accept this though, I will move on quietly, and i still appreciate all your prayers.

You have no idea how much I want to be sympathetic to you right now. Really. I want to reach out and give you some comfort and support.

But God is not going to honor prayers for homosexual relationships. He just won't do anything that is going to help you find joy and pleasure in sin. If anything, he is going to take our prayers and toss them aside, and maybe even be angry for us trying to thwart his commands by trying to bless a homosexual relationship with prayer.

What would happen to us if we did something to aid and abet your sin? Wouldn't that be as bad as committing the sin itself? God won't change is mind, either, and suddenly bless what he has always described as an abomination. We'd be wasting our time, and giving you false hope.

Although I have a huge desire to see you be happy, praying for success of your gay relationship isn't going to work. God won't bless you and your lover. I'm sorry.

I will pray for you, though, in a way that God would approve of.

Heavenly Father. I am so happy that Remny came to us to pray for him. Even though we can't pray in the way he asked, we can have the honor of praying something good for him. Lord, please bless him with a relationship with you, the most satisfying relationship anyone could ever have. Better and longer-lasting than any romantic relationship, deeper than mere sex, more blessed than marriage. Remny is gay, but you have the ability to help him live with those struggles while maintaining purity. So many gay Christians do. So many men who were once gay have been restored to sexual health by a relationship with you. Please call him to relationship with you, fill the gaps in his pyche that cause him to be attracted to men, give him more than he would have ever settled for in his love life. Through the authority given to us by Jesus Christ, Amen.

Remny, I have prayed the way I think is best for you. If it upests you, I am deeply sorry. But I love you too much to pray for you to find sin more fulfilling and joyful.

 

[forjesus]

Amen Lambslove, I am in total agreement.

 

[Remny]

EXPLANATIONS

Anyhow I understand how some of you feel about homosexuality. I can only say that it is not within you to know what God's plan is for me. You have no way at all of knowing what prayers God will answer and won't answer. I am aware about what it says about gays in the bible, but forgive me, no SANE PERSON can take the bible literally, or we'd all still be sacrificeing goats and we'd all have to eat kosher foods. The bible was never ment to be the end all rule book. It was meant to be a light to the path of God, but it is not the path itself.

I'm not trying to justify my cheating here. To answer your questions, we have broken up. I just want to move on with a clean slate.

Now to answer more questions:

Are people born gay, do they chose to be gay?:
Well, many people are Born gay. Though not all gay people are. Some of them seem to turn gay during their life process, though I assure you no one CHOOSES to be gay. I have been involved in a gay speakers pannel for years here. I go to colleges, churges, and other places all over the Northwest and talk about this. After talking with cleargy from a few of the catholic churches in the area, they are not preforming gay marriages. Even though they face ex-communication.

How you end up gay is still somewhat of a mystery, but no one chooses it. It may have a lot to do with your social upbringing. That at least is what I suspect. If I could just choose to be attracted to women, I certainly would. That would make awkward moments like this non-existant.

Studies show in animals that when an animal population in a given space grows too big that most of the animals quit breeding and quite a few of them become gay. That means they attempt sex with other animals of the same sex and seek confort from other animals of the same sex. This study has been preformed on a wide variety of animals. Rats, Wolves, Fruit Flies to name a few. As the population becomes more condensed you will see more and more homosexual individuals. There are even gay poeple who you probably see every day, in your church, your neighbors or the person at the grocery store. However they may not be "out" because it is not a good invironment for them to be out in. They can not be honest about who they are because, they would be swiftly judged by people who have no understanding of what they are, and they are shunned by the very pillars of morality and virtue, christianity. And for what reason? This has all sorts of horrible backlash. When you are shunned by those responcible for good morals and virtue, it gives you no reason to be good yourself. So, unfortunately many gay people are morrally bankrupt. I think if the devil has half as much influence as a lot of you people think he has, that this whole gay thing was his greatest achievement. Turning away about 10% of God's people from christianity, because of who they love, hateing them in many casses, and in turn causeing gay people to hate christians. I believe this has been very benificial to the Devil's cause.

About "reformation". This is another sad sad thing. I know quite a few people that went to camps and other facilities to become reformed and not gay. I see these people online, and so big is their guilt. They are all married, because that's what they had to do to be accepted. Married to members of the opposite sex. Sounds like a success? No not at all, because these are empty marriages. The poor people that submitted themselves to these reformation-camps from my experience ALWAYS end up having relationships, or just cheating on the side, unknown to their wife, and often children. They may love their wife, but it's more of a confortable friendship than a marriage to them. So this way instead of just hurting one gay individual this reformation has managed to hurt a whole family. Imagine that your favorite food is chicken. Someone tells you that chicken is evil and you must like beans to be holy. You don't like beans though, never have. Still to fit in you'll eat the beans, and you can pretend you like the beans, pretend they are your favorite, but you will never be happy eating the beans. I know that is a simple anology, but it's the same with gay people who are pressured into marriages with the opposite sex.

About the "gay lifestyle". Certainly being gay can be very hard. However it upsets me that a whole "lifestyle" is attatched to being gay. First off being gay, all that this means is that you like members of the same sex. Imagine for one instant that you yourself are gay. *woosh* nothing changed about you. You don't like to dress in women's clothing if yer a guy, and you don't like to chew tabacco and cut your hair short if yer a girl, you just like folks of the same sex. What you see and what is publisised are the most extreme casses. Men that act like women, and dirty bull dykes. But most gay people are just normal people, you'd never know they were gay unless you were a friend or someone they talked to about their life and relationships. Alot of gay people might act a certain way, that's not because they are gay, that is only because they want to fit in and relate to people of the same type and somewhere along the way all these lame stereotypes became somewhat of the norm. I am trying to fight against "the gay lifestyle", well not the gay part but the life style. I would like it if more gay people had better morals and could communicate with every day people like yourself without being judged and persecuted. This would help them better be themselves if they could be honest about who they are, but if they can't they have to cling to some stereotype for senes of identity.

Yes I was a christian before I figured out I was gay. I tell you God hears my prayers even though I'm gay. He doesn't hold that against me. I can't tell you exactly what God's will is for everyone person on this earth, and no one should try. I know it was God who meant me to be gay though. I can only speculate as to why he made me this way. Just the same as you can speculate as to why he gave you the color eyes you have or the hair you have. I'd like to think it's so I can help other gay people understand God better, that may be presumptuouse. However I think it's all our duty to help people understand God better if we have the ability. I know God loves me, and I know he listens. He answers my prayers all the time. I pray daily and am always talking to God. God is the reason I'm a happy person and a strong person. He has changed so many things in my life for the better, but he does not even want to change me to straight. God love's love in any form. If I love another man God still sees it as a beautiful thing. That's not to say I do perfectly at this. The point of this post was the fact that I had messed up big in my relationship, being gay I didn't want to be an issue, but it is, so I will address it.

I have a gay cousin, but I do not know him very well. My family is fine with the fact that I am gay. The love me and being gay doesn't change who I've always been to them. Now they just know me better than they did before.

You asked if I felt different than other people. I do, but most people are different, I also feel the same as other people too. I am just another person one way or another though. I have things in commen with some people and things not so in commen with others.

About "out" people. Thanks in large to the efforts of my speakers pannel, and foundations like pheonix riseing. In my area it is a pretty safe place to be out. I live in the Portland Metro area. I think most people that are gay here are out, however there are probably 25-40% of gays here that are still afraid to come out. But that number is decreasing. People here are pretty mellow and very nice really. They can't justify hateing someone for something that doesn't hurt anyone. For something someone can't control. About dateing here... I don't have to find people and make them come out to date them. There are plenty of people out here and are confortable with that part of who they are. There are gay bars, and gay groups on line. There is the Adventure Group which is a gay group that goes hikeing and camping. I belong to a gay tennis league. So there are plenty of places to meet other gay men for me. The hard part is find gay men that havn't been so shunned by good people that they have given up being more and good themselves, though that is not too terribly hard it can be a challenge.

In highschool I dated a girl. I did it just because that's what everyone else seemed to do. I never really wanted to hold her hand or kiss her. I thought that was perfectly normal. I would just hang out with her and call her my girlfriend, and she'd always want to make out and stuff, and I would just go a long with it because that's what you do. In the end I feel bad because it hurt her. I'm sure she must have felt in some way insufficiant, but it was me and not her.

When you are gay you are always VERY EDUCATED about HIV. It is more prevailent in gay settings. That's a fact. The reason this is, is because it comes out in sperm and blood. It's not impossible to get from a women, but VERY VERY unlikely. Don't think of it is gay, think of it as a male desease that only men can give to other men or women. It's nearly impossible for lesbians to get it. Most cases of HIV are caused when a Male cums in another individual be it a girl or a guy. So the logic to this is that if you have it, you probably got it by a guy cumming in you. If yer a man this makes you gay. Gay men don't generally have sex with women so few women get it. If a woman does get it, it's hard for her to give it to other people because she does not secrete the virus out in a sexual fluid... though if there is tearing and exesive bleeding then it is possible.

Oh well that's that, I just wanted prayer and forgivness, but I got all this instead. It's ok God will still hear my prayers even if you refuse to pray for me.

Thanks

Ben

 

[Remny]

TYPOS... heh heh ok the churches are preforming gay marriages, "not" was meant to be "now" and of course churges was supposed to be churches

Oh bleh I'm sure there is a bunch more, I tried to rush through this quickly, please forgive the sloppyness here

 

[Remny]

Alright bleh, I made a lot of mistakes and confusing ones at that on my last post.  I just went through and edited it.  Hopefully it will make more sense, here:

EXPLANATIONS

Anyhow I understand how some of you feel about homosexuality. I can only say that it is not within you to know what God's plan is for me. You have no way at all of knowing what prayers God will answer and won't answer. I am aware about what it says about gays in the bible, but forgive me, no SANE PERSON can take the bible literally, or we'd all still be sacrificeing goats and we'd all have to eat kosher foods. The bible was never ment to be the end all rule book. It was meant to be a light to the path of God, but it is not the path itself.

I'm not trying to justify my cheating here. To answer your questions, we have broken up. I just want to move on with a clean slate.

Now to answer more questions:

Are people born gay, do they chose to be gay?:
Well, many people are Born gay. Though not all gay people are. Some of them seem to turn gay during their life process, though I assure you no one CHOOSES to be gay. I have been involved in a gay speakers pannel for years here. I go to colleges, churches, and other places all over the Northwest and talk about this. After talking with cleargy from a few of the catholic churches in the area, they are now preforming gay marriages. Even though they face ex-communication.

How you end up gay is still somewhat of a mystery, but no one chooses it. It may have a lot to do with your social upbringing. That at least is what I suspect. If I could just choose to be attracted to women, I certainly would. That would make awkward moments like this non-existant.

Studies show in animals that when an animal population in a given space grows too big that most of the animals quit breeding and quite a few of them become gay. That means they attempt sex with other animals of the same sex and seek confort from other animals of the same sex. This study has been preformed on a wide variety of animals. Rats, Wolves, Fruit Flies to name a few. As the population becomes more condensed you will see more and more homosexual individuals. There are even gay poeple who you probably see every day, in your church, your neighbors or the person at the grocery store. However they may not be "out" because it is not a good invironment for them to be out in. They can not be honest about who they are because they would be swiftly judged by people who have no understanding of what they are, and they are shunned by the very pillars of morality and virtue, christianity. And for what reason? This has all sorts of horrible backlash. When you are shunned by those responcible for good morals and virtue, it gives you no reason to be good yourself. So, unfortunately many gay people are morrally bankrupt. I think if the devil has half as much influence as a lot of you people think he has, that this whole gay thing was his greatest achievement. Turning away about 10% of God's people from christianity because of who they love; hateing them in many casses, and in turn causeing gay people to hate christians. I believe this has been very benificial to the Devil's cause.

About "reformation". This is another sad sad thing. I know quite a few people that went to camps and other facilities to become reformed and not gay. I see these people online, and so big is their guilt. They are all married, because that's what they had to do to be accepted. Married to members of the opposite sex. Sounds like a success? No not at all, because these are empty marriages. The poor people that submitted themselves to these reformation-camps from my experience ALWAYS end up having relationships, or just cheating on the side, unknown to their wife, and often children. They may love their wife, but it's more of a confortable friendship than a marriage to them. So this way instead of just hurting one gay individual this reformation has managed to hurt a whole family. Imagine that your favorite food is chicken. Someone tells you that chicken is evil and you must like beans to be holy. You don't like beans though, never have. Still to fit in you'll eat the beans, and you can pretend you like the beans, pretend they are your favorite, but you will never be happy eating the beans. I know that is a simple anology, but it's the same with gay people who are pressured into marriages with the opposite sex.

About the "gay lifestyle". Certainly being gay can be very hard. However it upsets me that a whole "lifestyle" is attatched to being gay. First off being gay, all that this means is that you like members of the same sex. Imagine for one instant that you yourself are gay. *woosh* nothing changed about you. You don't like to dress in women's clothing if yer a guy, and you don't like to chew tabacco and cut your hair short if yer a girl, you just like folks of the same sex. What you see and what is publisised are the most extreme casses. Men that act like women, and dirty bull dykes. But most gay people are just normal people, you'd never know they were gay unless you were a friend or someone they talked to about their life and relationships. Alot of gay people might act a certain way, that's not because they are gay, that is only because they want to fit in and relate to people of the same type and somewhere along the way all these lame stereotypes became somewhat of the norm. I am trying to fight against "the gay lifestyle", well not the gay part but the life style. I would like it if more gay people had better morals and could communicate with every day people like yourself without being judged and persecuted. This would help them better be themselves if they could be honest about who they are, but if they can't they have to cling to some stereotype for senes of identity.

Yes I was a christian before I figured out I was gay. I tell you God hears my prayers even though I'm gay. He doesn't hold that against me. I can't tell you exactly what God's will is for every person on this earth, and no one should try. I know it was God who meant me to be gay though. I can only speculate as to why he made me this way. Just the same as you can speculate as to why he gave you the color eyes you have or the hair you have. I'd like to think it's so I can help other gay people understand God better, that may be presumptuouse. However I think it's all our duty to help people understand God better if we have the ability. I know God loves me, and I know he listens. He answers my prayers all the time. I pray daily and am always talking to God. God is the reason I'm a happy person and a strong person. He has changed so many things in my life for the better, but he does not even want to change me to straight. God love's love in any form. If I love another man God still sees it as a beautiful thing. That's not to say I do perfectly at this. The point of this post was the fact that I had messed up big in my relationship, being gay I didn't want to be an issue, but it is, so I will address it.

I have a gay cousin, but I do not know him very well. My family is fine with the fact that I am gay. The love me and being gay doesn't change who I've always been to them. Now they just know me better than they did before.

You asked if I felt different than other people. I do, but most people are different, I also feel the same as other people too. I am just another person one way or another though. I have things in commen with some people and things not so in commen with others.

About "out" people. Thanks in large to the efforts of my speakers pannel, and foundations like pheonix riseing. In my area it is a pretty safe place to be out. I live in the Portland Metro area. I think most people that are gay here are out, however there are probably 25-40% of gays here that are still afraid to come out. But that number is decreasing. People here are pretty mellow and very nice really. They can't justify hateing someone for something that doesn't hurt anyone. For something someone can't control.

About dateing here... I don't have to find people and make them come out to date them. There are plenty of people out here and are confortable with that part of who they are. There are gay bars, and gay groups on line. There is the Adventure Group which is a gay group that goes hikeing and camping. I belong to a gay tennis league. So there are plenty of places to meet other gay men for me. The hard part is finding gay men that havn't been so shunned by good people that they have given up being moral and good themselves, though that is not too terribly hard it can be a challenge.

In highschool I dated a girl. I did it just because that's what everyone else seemed to do. I never really wanted to hold her hand or kiss her. I thought that was perfectly normal. I would just hang out with her and call her my girlfriend, and she'd always want to make out and stuff, and I would just go a long with it because that's what you do. In the end I feel bad because it hurt her. I'm sure she must have felt in some way insufficiant, but it was me and not her.

When you are gay you are always VERY EDUCATED about HIV. It is more prevailent in gay settings. That's a fact. The reason this is, is because it comes out in sperm and blood. It's not impossible to get from a women, but VERY VERY unlikely. Don't think of it is gay, think of it as a male desease that only men can give to other men or women. It's nearly impossible for lesbians to get it. Most cases of HIV are caused when a Male cums in another individual be it a girl or a guy. So the logic to this is that if you have it, you probably got it by a guy cumming in you. If yer a man this makes you gay. Gay men don't generally have sex with women so few women get it. If a woman does get it, it's hard for her to give it to other people because she does not secrete the virus out in a sexual fluid... though if there is tearing and exesive bleeding then it is possible.

Oh well that's that, I just wanted prayer and forgivness, but I got all this instead. It's ok God will still hear my prayers even if you refuse to pray for me.

Thanks

Ben

 

[ZiSunka]

Anyhow I understand how some of you feel about homosexuality. I can only say that it is not within you to know what God's plan is for me. You have no way at all of knowing what prayers God will answer and won't answer. I am aware about what it says about gays in the bible, but forgive me, no SANE PERSON can take the bible literally, or we'd all still be sacrificeing goats and we'd all have to eat kosher foods. The bible was never ment to be the end all rule book. It was meant to be a light to the path of God, but it is not the path itself.

Oh Remny, you just don't realize. But I hope one day you do.

And yes, God does hear your prayers even though you are gay, but He's definitely not going to give you an answer that will lead to your destruction. He's not going to harm you that way.

Oh well that's that, I just wanted prayer and forgivness, but I got all this instead. It's ok God will still hear my prayers even if you refuse to pray for me.

We didn't refuse to pray for you. We prayed for you very sincerely. We love you enough to pray for good things, not the bad things you asked for. Jesus said, "If your child asks for an egg, will you give him a rock?" You asked for a rock, and we offered you an egg. God will give you what you desire, if you seek him authentically. He may have to change your desires, but he will answer your prayers.

About "reformation". This is another sad sad thing. I know quite a few people that went to camps and other facilities to become reformed and not gay. I see these people online, and so big is their guilt. They are all married, because that's what they had to do to be accepted.

Nobody has to be married to be accepted. And I know several gays who are now straight. Not pretending to be straight, but actually straight and happy. Happier than you seem to be.

I hope that you really came here to ask for prayer, and not to give us a sermon. This area is for Christians only, and it seems like you were trying to circumvent that by posing as a person honestly seeking prayer.

The Bible is the foundation of our belief system, and coming to this area to make an attack at it is not appropriate.

We'll be glad to honor all your prayer requests, but please don't come here to hammer at our faith. That's what the Debate forums are about.

 

[forjesus]

Amen, once again

 

[Auntie]

Ben,

You may not care to read my post, because I agree with lambslove. You have been deceived, brother, big time. That doesn't mean that Jesus doesn't love you, of course Jesus loves you. But don't ever think that Jesus loves your sin, much less approves of it. We accept and love YOU, Ben. But we absolutely reject your homosexual behavior.

All of us, everyone of us needs forgiveness, but along with the forgiveness must come repentance from the heart. God loves our brokenheartedness, which leads to our repentance. But first you must realize that your behavior is breaking God's heart, and your desire must be to please Him in all things.

This has all sorts of horrible backlash. When you are shunned by those responcible for good morals and virtue, it gives you no reason to be good yourself

How can you say that people base their morals on other people? If I am involved in sin, and people reject me because of my sins, do I then go out and sin some more? God forbid. And if I am trying to live according to God's will, and people reject me for that, does that make me give up my morals and plunge myself into a life of sin? God forbid.

You come to us for prayer for forgiveness. And then we learn you have other things going on in your life that needs MUCH greater prayer for. Shall we ignore the greater need? That's like putting a bandaid on a gaping wound and denying that the wound is there.

Ben, I hope you will consider seeking Christian counseling. You have a lot of things going on that a counselor could help you with. Most homosexuals had something really bad happen to them in their childhood years. When you were a child, did your father reject you, abandon you, or abuse you? How is your relationship with your father now?

 

[fieldmouse3]

I'm praying for you!

 

[wvmtnkid]

Wow Ben! That was quite a post. There are so many issues within that one post I am not even sure where to begin.

This may be another post you will feel you don't want to read because I agree totally with what others have posted. But I am not here to condemn you of your sexuality. I don't agree with your stance, but that doesn't mean I am your judge and jury either. I have a gay friend that I care for very much, but I don't go along with how he choses to live his life. We could argue all day about how or why you are gay, but neither will probably change the others opinion.

What I am concerned about is I am one of the ones that prayed for you when you started posting about your relationship. Having had trouble in relationships in the past, I wanted to offer you encouragment and comfort. Now I come here and read that you deceived me and others and feel that you don't need forgiveness for that, from God or from us. And then you ask us to pray for something that you knew most of us felt is a sin. When we offer to pray for you, not in the way you expected, we get a lecture on basically how close minded we are. At this point, Ben, I am not sure what you are asking for. If you are asking us to condone your actions (homosexuality, pre-martial sex), we can't. Neither can we pray for God to give you something we feel is morally wrong. I think lambslove did a very good job in explaining why that would be wrong for us to do.

This doesn't mean however that we don't care for you and will turn our backs on you. You may feel that deceiving us is ok. I don't. If you want prayer and counsel, you must be open and honest with us in the beginning. And when we tell you what you don't want to hear, we can agree to disagree on a subject. But lying will get you nowhere. You may not feel that you need my forgiveness, but I feel I need to forgive you, otherwise I have no right to ask God to forgive my shortcomings because I cannot or will not forgive my brother.

Ben, I am praying for you. God loves you and as a brother, I love you too. I also do not want to see you go down a path that will lead you to more heartache. I am sorry if you don't agree with me. But that doesn't mean I won't pray for you.

 

[AnnMercy2]

Ben, I agree with everybody here. I prayed for you because that is what I felt God wanted me to do. I'm sorry you feel that we prayed the wrong way but that is what we felt lead to do. We are not going to pray for something to happen that we believe is wrong, you your self would not do that. You would not pray for something you in your heart knew was wrong, it is the same for us. I still will be seeking God for you, but not for what you want, but for what I believe God wants for you. Nobody here is shunning you, we are loving you and praying for you.

Love in Christ,
Anna

 

[psycmajor]

Ben:
Actually, if you look to the upper right hand of your post, you will see the word "Edit." That way you can change stuff without creating a new post. It saves space and the page loads faster, since the first draft of the post is not repeated.

I'd like to address this first:

Originally posted by Remny
Oh well that's that, I just wanted prayer and forgivness, but I got all this instead. It's ok God will still hear my prayers even if you refuse to pray for me.

Are you including me in saying that? If so, I'm sorry, but that was not my intention. You are not obligated to explain everything. I responded to your post as honestly as I could without judgment, I really did. The things I say aren't always going to be what you want to hear, but I did the best I could. I told you exactly what I thought because it seemed that you were looking for answers. I believe that insight is essential to introspection. And you have to be willing to look within yourself, and even more so to God. That's being honest with yourself. After giving you feedback (and though it wasn't a typed agreement), I suppose I felt justified in asking you some questions. Did you think that I was going to hate you for the answers you gave? Did you think that I was going to treat you like you were smaller than I? No. That is not Christlike. And I'm not trying to be holier-than-thou when I say these things. This is not about "us"-versus-you. But if I disagree, I'll say so! To clarify, I will give you my interpretation of what you said back to you, and you can say, "yay" or "nay."

I really would like to learn more about gays, because it confuses me that the Bible says (and I believe this interpretation) that homosexuality is wrong, yet I often hear that people are "born" gay? That's not something you or anyone has to answer, it's just a mystery to me. I don't know if it will ever be resolved in my time on earth. I don't really understand homosexuality because I'm not homosexual, I'd just like to see the perspective of one person who is. The questions I ask are not intended to lead you to the conclusion that you are wrong. My questions are not meant to be an interrogation, I just would like to better understand something that I am not familiar with. I appreciate your efforts.

I'll be up front with you: I think the Bible says that homosexuality is wrong. But I'm not going to see you or treat you as any less of a person because you are gay. We can disagree, right? I'll be an online friend, if you'd like. PM me sometime.

I am aware about what it says about gays in the bible, but forgive me, no SANE PERSON can take the bible literally, or we'd all still be sacrificeing goats and we'd all have to eat kosher foods. The bible was never ment to be the end all rule book. It was meant to be a light to the path of God, but it is not the path itself.

About sacrifices and eating Kosher: Jesus blew all that away. He didn't destroy the law, He fulfilled it. Sacrifices and rituals were not necessary anymore after He was sacrificed.

If the Bible is not THE path, are there many paths instead? What parts of the Bible are not valid? Why be a Christian, then? Do you believe it is God's word?

I'm not trying to justify my cheating here. To answer your questions, we have broken up. I just want to move on with a clean slate.

The past is a part of your future. I still think your partners (and this applies to all people who are sexually active) should know your full sexual history, and you to know theirs. This is your health and the health of others that is being talked about.

How you end up gay is still somewhat of a mystery, but no one chooses it. It may have a lot to do with your social upbringing. That at least is what I suspect. If I could just choose to be attracted to women, I certainly would. That would make awkward moments like this non-existant.

So you're saying that there are people who have always had these feelings, from birth, even? What do you think of people who in time "become" gay? Is it completely involuntary? Did you ever struggle with your feelings before you accepted them?

Studies show in animals that when an animal population in a given space grows too big that most of the animals quit breeding and quite a few of them become gay. That means they attempt sex with other animals of the same sex and seek confort from other animals of the same sex. This study has been preformed on a wide variety of animals. Rats, Wolves, Fruit Flies to name a few. As the population becomes more condensed you will see more and more homosexual individuals.

I don't agree with comparing people to animals. The difference between people and animals is that humans are more complex and are capable of following rules and norms. I don't think that animals are intelligent enough to do that, they just completely follow instinct.

There are even gay poeple who you probably see every day, in your church, your neighbors or the person at the grocery store. However they may not be "out" because it is not a good invironment for them to be out in. They can not be honest about who they are because they would be swiftly judged by people who have no understanding of what they are, and they are shunned by the very pillars of morality and virtue, christianity. And for what reason? This has all sorts of horrible backlash. When you are shunned by those responcible for good morals and virtue, it gives you no reason to be good yourself. So, unfortunately many gay people are morrally bankrupt. I think if the devil has half as much influence as a lot of you people think he has, that this whole gay thing was his greatest achievement. Turning away about 10% of God's people from christianity because of who they love; hateing them in many casses, and in turn causeing gay people to hate christians. I believe this has been very benificial to the Devil's cause.

That is sad and too often true. It's called "Labeling theory" in sociology. You get labelled and become stigmatized by that label, even if parts of that label are not true. So it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy, and you become what you've been labelled as. I can't speak for everyone else, and I won't say that anyone here is guilty of this, but I don't hate you. Not at all. And I'm not trying to get you to "turn away from Christianity" and God. That's the last thing I want to do. BUT. Even with people stereotyping and spreading lies about you, you and anyone else is still responsible for their own actions.

I am undecided about reformation camps. I hear that the person being "reformed" often goes back to their old lifestyles, no matter how hard they fight it.

About the "gay lifestyle". Certainly being gay can be very hard. However it upsets me that a whole "lifestyle" is attatched to being gay. First off being gay, all that this means is that you like members of the same sex. Imagine for one instant that you yourself are gay. *woosh* nothing changed about you. You don't like to dress in women's clothing if yer a guy, and you don't like to chew tabacco and cut your hair short if yer a girl, you just like folks of the same sex. What you see and what is publisised are the most extreme casses. Men that act like women, and dirty bull dykes. But most gay people are just normal people, you'd never know they were gay unless you were a friend or someone they talked to about their life and relationships. Alot of gay people might act a certain way, that's not because they are gay, that is only because they want to fit in and relate to people of the same type and somewhere along the way all these lame stereotypes became somewhat of the norm. I am trying to fight against "the gay lifestyle", well not the gay part but the life style.

So you're fighting against the gay stereotype, but take part in "gay" behavior?

I would like it if more gay people had better morals and could communicate with every day people like yourself without being judged and persecuted. This would help them better be themselves if they could be honest about who they are, but if they can't they have to cling to some stereotype for senes of identity.

Yeah, that is true. A few bad apples can ruin the whole barrel. I think that first the gay person is stigmatized, then they become what they've been labelled (including acting immorally), and that makes people unfairly generalize the immoral gay person's actions to the rest of the gay population.

I am not doubtful that you have a strong relationship with God. In my opinion, that seems to be the case in most ways with you and Him.

I have a gay cousin, but I do not know him very well. My family is fine with the fact that I am gay. The love me and being gay doesn't change who I've always been to them. Now they just know me better than they did before.

Okay. I was just curious because I've wondered if sexual orientation could be inherited through genes. I'm glad that your family still loves you; they should! Are they Christians?

Yup, everyone is an individual.

They can't justify hateing someone for something that doesn't hurt anyone. For something someone can't control.

Hate is not necessary. I can disagree with you, but hating you is fruitless. Again, I am conflicted on whether it is beyond a gay person's control...

It must be difficult to be gay. You said yourself that it would be easier if you were "straight." I am sorry that you have the troubles that you do. Well, I guess they're just "different" troubles and problems.

Thank you for talking, Ben.

 

[Remny]

Well thanks a lot AnnMercy. I appreciate all your imput and I do not feel so attacked with your posts. As for everyone else and their posts, I appreciate their good intentions but I have heard it a million times. I am thankful, there are plenty of gay accepting churches these days, so I can have my fellowship needs met elsewhere besides here if need be.

About the bible. What I said about the bible may have seemed like sacrilige. It's not, God has different plans for everybody, that's why he made us different. Even in the bible God told people in the bible to do things contrary to the bible. EI Kill, burn towns, and the like. If you become close to God the bible is no longer needed because you have God at your side and at your ear. That is how God wanted people to be. He wanted us all to have specific abilities and duties and to serve him in our very own unique way.

If we want to talk about what Jesus wants, that is fine. He was full of love and wisdome, and never did he once say anything bad about gay people. Most of the new testament gay passages were from paul, who I believe suffered with his own gay issues.

For all you other folks out there, I would like for you to think of something. God is emensly smart and his will always has reason and perpous. Consider for a moment the 10 commandments... all there for a good reason, breaking those commandments inevitably causes suffering and degredation to the human condition. Also note that "though shalt not be gay" is not listed there. What perpous would God have to shun gay people? What harm is there in loving people of the same sex? What damage does that cause? How does it hurt you or anyone else? It is about the same is singling out people with blue eyes, or dark skin and saying they are evil and reprobate.

Anyhow, I'd continue here, but I am ending up bussy, hope you guys all have a good one.

Ben

 

[ZiSunka]

Remny, your impression of God is not the reality of God. Your personal biases are affecting your vision the same way you accuse our faith of clouding ours. You don not have a better view than we have, just a more hostile and self-serving one.

Dear Lord, please show your reality to Ben in a way that he cannot deny. He may have to turn away from you in order to continue to practice his sin, but he will not be confused about who you are. Please Lord, I beg you, for his sake, don't let Ben reside in his misconceptions of You, your word, or what being gay is really about. Give him one glimpse of reality devoid of politics and his own biases. Amen.

 

[Blessed-one]

God created a man and a woman in the beginning, but not two women or two men....
you probably don't like the way we're praying for you, either way.. *praying* May the Holy Spirit guide us in prayers.

 

[psycmajor]

*shrug*
I tried.

[edit]: I get the impression that everything that I have said has been automatically invalidated and discounted with the following words: "I think the Bible says that homosexuality is wrong." Unless I am just not aware of anything to the contrary.

[edit2]: Hmm. I'm not sure if it's a realistic expectation to come to a place where Bible-believing Christians are supposed to be, and not expect a discussion on such a thing as being gay. And instead expect other posters to automatically forfeit their own beliefs in acceptance of something that they don't think is right in the first place. If you wished for us to tickle your ears, I don't think it's going to happen here. Also, you can't follow God without the Bible, and you can't pick and choose what you wish to believe, unless it has been nullified by the perfect sacrifice of Christ. It is not just another book.

Is Jesus not God? You've heard of Sodom and Gomorrah [also in the NT-2 Peter 2:6, 8; Jude 7] in the OT. Those are Jesus' words, as well. The Bible is the Word of God.

It seems that Jesus never directly addressed homosexuality while on Earth, but when referring to marriage, he always specified a male and a female, nothing different.

John 14:15
"If you love Me, keep My commandments.

John 14:21
He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him."

John 15:10
If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.


 

 

[Remny]

Alright, I just ranted for a while, and I was very upset, I just deleted all that, but here is something I beg you to have the patiance to read.

Forgive me, I am upset now. I would think the same things as you about homosexuallity if I were you, but because of my life I have been granted better incite. Let me tell you a story:

Now I have always been gay, I just didn't always know that was what it was. I have always found guys attractive, and I can understand how women might be pretty, but it's the same as thinking a puppy is cute. Which is totally different to the attraction you feel in a relationship. So all the while, I'm growing up and i never think of women as most men do and I see things in men that I am far more attracted to than women. It never occured to me that I was gay. I had always figured that I was going to be straight one day and date some blond farm girl or something nice. 'cause women were nice, I could get married to one, that's what everyone does isn't it? So here I am gay, but I don't understand it. So I don't like gays at all, man they are evil and it says so in the bible, they are really bad and DISGUSTING!!! how could they do that, oh that's grow, stupid [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth]s, bleh bleh bleh, so on and so forth. That's how I thought for a long time.

Imagine now how i must have felt when I discovered that I would never feel something for women, and that I in fact was in love with a man? Imagine when I found out I was gay, and I never chose to be this way. That somehow that was just how I was. Oh I prayed and I prayed that I would not be this way, I prayed that God would fix me, and my prayers are powerful, my faith is strong. I would have done you all proud here, those that can so easily say what is wrong for me.  I was praying for the same things you probably are. I prayed with all my heart that I would no longer be gay. I got a girlfriend, I did tons of macho guy things, I dissed on stupid [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth]s every chance I got. I tried, but God did not see fit to change me. It became obviouse to me that he did not want to change me. At first I thought it must be that I am being punished for something. I sank into dispare. God hated me and I could do nothing about it. I was reprobate and I could do nothing to change this.

It was new years eve, I still had christmas wrapper in my room, and new birthday and christmas presents lieing here and there. Tonight I decided that instead of being hated by God because I was not strong enough to change that I would die.  Then I would not be allowed to be how I was any more. I downed 8 onces of asprin, more than enough to put me in a coma and kill me. Enough to destroy my stumich and kill me from internal bleeding. I prayed and I prayed, and I cried myself to sleep, the soft blue glow of my lava lamp filling my room but not my heart.

Not too much later I woke suddenly. My room was filled with light. I felt at ease, and I knew at that moment that God loved me. That if he wanted me to be straight he would have made me that way. I was so happy, but so sad, because I knew it was not possible for me to wake the next morning, I begged God for forgivness for throwing my life away because of something I didn't understand, because i had simply believed what I had heard all my life. I begged and begged and... God did forgive me.

I woke the next morning. Maybe you are thinking I suffered a hallucination, that there was no great white light, and the feelings of love where in my head. I could have suffered any number of schitzo disorders from all the asprin that was in my system. Before marveling at the fact that I was alive I thought I must have imagined all that. Then I turned over to my night stand in the pale morning light. My blue lava lamp, with blue fluid and blue wax... It was now pure and white. The fluid had no blue, it was clear and the wax had turned perfectly white. Maybe you think that a silly thing for God to do, but I think he wanted me to know and BE SURE of what happened the night before.

That was a good and horrible day. It made me have such faith and God, and I learned more about him then than I ever had in my life. Also I puked nearly every 10 minutes for 2 days, and the pain in my stumich was very very bad. I never went to the hospitol though, I managed to hide from my mother and family and suffer in private. A small price to pay for my life.

So for me, I know a lot about what God wants for me, and I will try to refrain from telling you what God wants for you. But I KNOW GOD. So I beg that when I come to you with prayer, I beg that you try to pray for the issue I am suffering from and not try to pray that God changes something about me, that he very deliberatly made me.

Thank you all,

Ben