Compatibility

[seeingeyes]

Hi folks,

I have a topic on my heart today, and that is the matter of being "unequally yoked". Or rather, avoiding that situation.

Now, of course Paul wasn't speaking of marriage in that passage (2 Cor 6:14), but we have plucked that verse out of it's context and applied it to mean that no Christian should ever marry a not-Christian. And there is some wisdom in choosing someone with the same beliefs, of course.

(For the record, my husband and I count as "unequally yoked" in this sense. I was an unqualified Bible-thumping Pharisee and he was utterly indifferent to religion when we got married. After our middle son died years later, I got whacked upside the head by the grace of God, and he became a part-time anti-theist. That's where we stand at the moment.)

What got me thinking of this is that in the last two days, I have heard two gut-wrenching stories from women who did the "right" thing and married a Christian man, and now have marriages that are deader than a chipmunk on a truck tire. (When I asked one woman what she would like to see change, she said, "Honestly, I would just like him to shut up and never speak again. That's all I want." Dead.)

These are both first marriages of 10+ years, with kids. Neither couple lived together or had sex with each other prior to marriage. There's no adultery, no porn, no screaming abusive fights, no guns being pulled, no furniture being thrown around, no drugs or alcohol, no obvious mental illness. Both couples regularly attend church (neither spouse drags the other to church...they are all still Christians). Neither couple is talking about divorce, either, because neither believes in divorce.

I get looks of outright pity in certain Christian circles when they learn that, no, my husband will not be coming to church, yet of all the marriages that I am personally acquainted with, I wouldn't trade with anyone. What can I do but laugh? I like my husband! And raging heathen though he is, I have never doubted his love for me, even in our worst fights (and of course, we've had a few over 16 years).

So my contention here is that "marry a Christian" is simply not a sufficient criteria for a breathing marriage. Far from being the-most-important-thing-ever, it must be extensively qualified in order to even be useful, because none of the things that make someone "officially" a Christian makes them a good spouse. Whether it's church attendance or leadership, baptism or confirmation, even repentance or prayer.

How many people are marrying because they "finally found a Christian" and end up utterly dead to each other in ten years, mummified hands still clutching their book of rules?

Surely we can do better than this when advising those who are single and looking.

Now, most of you on this board are Christians with breathing marriages to other Christians. But what qualities did you consider most important going into your marriage (either separate from, or under the heading of "marry a Christian")?

 

[seeingeyes]

As a side note, if I had a nickel for every time one of these women said "scriptures say we should be doing x, or scriptures say he should be doing y" I'd be out shopping for a yacht for the pond in my backyard...

 

[tall73]

I do agree that the being unequally yoked passage is not directed specifically at marriage.

A better text when looking at the question might be in I Cor 7. Many first marriages were arranged. However, when speaking to widows Paul says:


1Co 7:39 A wife is bound to her husband as long as he lives. But if her husband dies, she is free to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord. ESV


1Co 7:39 A woman is bound to her husband as long as he lives. But if her husband dies, she is free to marry anyone she wishes, but he must belong to the Lord. NIV

The last clause is generally thought to indicate she can marry who she wants, as long as they are a Christian.

The example of a widow would be more in line with our society when we can make the choice ourselves.


Having said that, Paul also addressed situations where the couples were not both Christian. Especially given it was a new church some may convert while their husband did not, or the reverse. Paul advises not to leave the unbelieving spouse if they are willing to stay. Such a major change as one party becoming a Christian would have put a strain on the marriage, and perhaps a strain on outside relations as well.

Peter also referenced this situation, but talked of a different aspect, trying to win over the non believing spouse not by preaching but by conduct.


1Pe 3:1 Likewise, wives, be subject to your own husbands, so that even if some do not obey the word, they may be won without a word by the conduct of their wives,
1Pe 3:2 when they see your respectful and pure conduct.

I have seen a lot of marriages that worked when both were not Christian as well. And I have at times seen the non-Christian spouse come around.

On the other hand, I have met some pretty discouraged Christian spouses towards the end of their life who had prayed for their spouse all their lives, hoping they would come to the Lord. And so far they had not. They loved their spouse deeply, but were worried that they would not come to know the Lord and experience forgiveness through Him, and would not be with them for eternity, and it broke their heart.

I met some families who were not both Christian and there was constant fighting over it. In one instance the non-Christian husband would beat the spouse if they went to church. She kept going anyway, but that was a difficult situation.

And yes, there are those who are married and Christian and do not get along. But there are folks who do not get along in all those other categories too.

I am not sure it is really finding just the compatible person at first, though that is helpful. I think a lot of it is just individual choices on the part of both spouses to forgive instead of letting resentment build. And that can happen with any kind of person, though as Christians we are encouraged to forgive. People who will not even talk to each other are often people who did not take the time to keep tabs on the relationship as it went along and to bend at times, forgive at times, and stay close.

If you are looking for traits of compatibility, it is whether the person can say "sorry" when they are at fault, and actually mean it. And of course, you have to be willing to do the same.

 

[mina]

But what qualities did you consider most important going into your marriage (either separate from, or under the heading of "marry a Christian")?

I wasn't going to marry a man who wasn't a committed Christian; but I wasn't going to marry a man just because he was a Christian either. When I was single, I got set up with and met Christian guys, but that didn't mean we were compatible just because we were both Christian and both single. I value humor, intellect, kindness, ability to communicate, an easy going man, a passion for life, fondness for children and animals, love for the arts, creative, a responsible person, etc… I had a lot of things I was looking for. I have a wonderful father and got to witness a great marriage between my mother and father. I was looking for the kind of man that would be a wonderful partner like that. Who was also a Christian. I feel that my parent's relationship really guided me/inspired me on what I wanted in my own life. They weren't super churchy church Christians, but they were good moral, decent people , who tried to please God and gave their children the gift of witnessing a good, healthy loving marriage. My dad didn't go to church regularly, but in terms of acting like Jesus- he's taught me more about that over the years through example than I ever learned from a sermon. That's what I wanted and that's what I wanted my future children to see in their parents.


I was single longer than most people within Christian circles, but it seemed that a lot of men I was meeting or getting set up with were lacking important qualities to me; things that were too important to compromise on. I am glad that I waited, b/c my husband is that wonderful partner that I had been looking for. He reminds me of the good things in my dad.

I remember dating a man once right before I met my husband. It became apparent early on that we were not compatible and I was trying to break it off with him. He wasn't a horrible guy; I admired many things about him which is why we began to date. He began yelling at me that we were both christians so it has to work, blah blah blah. He became mean and angry b/c I wasn't content to just let things continue on. 1. The fact that he was yelling at me and wanted to inflict hurt and guilt with his words was enough to convince me that we would never work and he was not someone I wanted in my life. 2. I think it's a great (unspoken, perhaps) lie in christian circles that single + christian = compatible. People tried to set me up- A LOT and they thought it would all work out hunky dory b/c we were both single and christian and then became mad at me and called me too picky when I could not look past certain things that I would not settle on , and 3. I don't think many people (many of them Christians) understand single hood and don't use that time (no matter how long or short) to develop themselves and question not only what they want in a life partner but also develop and question what they themselves can bring to a relationship to make it good, healthy, and whole.
Just my opinion from my experiences……

I feel blessed. Even though I was single for a "long time" and it was a difficult time for me, even though I had people tell me all sorts of kooky advice and lies about compatibility; I also had a great example in my parents and I had some older women in my life who would tell me truth- that marriage is important, that who you marry is important, that who you are in marriage is important. So I know in my own children's lives , in single friends' lives; I also want to be a teller of truths not someone who puts pressure on them to marry to be married or tells them if they are both christian's it will all work out swimingly. I think good marriage is work even before you meet the person you will choose to marry.

 

[tall73]

I value humor, intellect, kindness, ability to communicate, an easy going man, a passion for life, fondness for children and animals, love for the arts, creative, a responsible person, etc… I had a lot of things I was looking for.

My list was a lot shorter.

1. Christian.
2. Female
3. Willing to put up with me.

That weeded out most.

My approach to dating her was similar to Steve Urkle: "I'm wearing you down baby!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uY5lKWA2L9E


It worked out well so far.

 

[seeingeyes]

My list was a lot shorter.

1. Christian.
2. Female
3. Willing to put up with me.

That weeded out most.

My approach to dating her was similar to Steve Urkle: "I'm wearing you down baby!"

lol!

So what was your definition of "Christian"?

 

[seeingeyes]

I have a wonderful father and got to witness a great marriage between my mother and father. I was looking for the kind of man that would be a wonderful partner like that.

This is huge. I certainly didn't put as much thought into marriage as you did (I had just turned 19 the week before!), but even though I was a stupid kid, I knew what a good man looked like and I knew what a good marriage looked like. That's an enormous head start, being able to weed out the fakers and the smooth talkers and the double-minded right out of the gate. That credit goes straight to my parents, I had little to do with it.

 

[ValleyGal]

For me, it would break my heart to love and be married to someone in this life, and know I will not be meeting him in the next. I love it that I know my hubby will spend his eternity in the Kingdom. Being a believer was my first requirement in choosing a spouse. The quality of that relationship with Jesus was even a bigger key. I would not have married him had I not seen a mature, steady approach to his spirituality. There had to be good fruit. In fact, I had been praying for a good year before meeting him...the things I prayed specifically for were that he had Christian integrity in his relationships with other women, that he was teachable enough to recognize when he was wrong, that he had the humility enough to be quick to initiate reconciliation when his relationships were not in good stead, that he was a man of biblical study and prayer, and a few other items. There were a few fundamental beliefs that I needed to know where he stood - but it was more about values than faith.

For me, an equal yoke only begins with matters of faith. When I think about the process of becoming one, it's a whole lot easier to do when your starting point is already on the same page, rather than a couple of chapters apart. I've read studies (social psychology textbook and peer reviewed articles) that suggest that the more alike you are in fundamental ways (values, family of origin parenting styles, goals, life purpose, etc), the more likely a marriage will survive, if differences are recognized and celebrated and seen as a strength. It's also about teamwork. An equal yoke means both beasts attached to the yoke pull their equal share. When one gets tired or distracted, the other keeps them on track...but they both have an owner driving the team. This is what it means to be to be equally yoked. And I'm happy to say that the biggest difference that makes life awkward for us is that he is a whole foot taller than me! But he slows down a little so I can keep up with him...

 

[favoritetoyisjoy]

Selfishness (pride) is the killer of relationships, Christian or not. The title of "Christian" is no guarantee, and most certainly not synonymous with "unselfish" or "Godly", but if that Christian is truly devoted to God to the extent that they display the fruit of the Spirit as in Galatians 5:22-23, it's the best one could do in a partner where attraction and other forms of compatibility are also present.

People tend to emphasize, look for, and therefore find, a high degree of attraction and compatibility, yet settle for less or even nothing in the spiritual category of “Christian”. We get hooked on the attraction, compatibility, and our partner's devotion to us before we even realize that our hearts have already been won, then it's "pot luck" on each other's true spiritual condition.

Though we were both Christian, from several generations of Christians, God wasn't the biggest item on our agenda for either my wife or I when we met or for most of our relationship. It was all about us; our lives, our happiness, our bliss, and God was along for the ride. Pretty typical, I think. I can see why people might think that marrying a Christian isn't that big a deal because being a Christian and acting like one can be two radically different things, and so often is.

 

[ChristianGolfer]

Now, most of you on this board are Christians with breathing marriages to other Christians. But what qualities did you consider most important going into your marriage (either separate from, or under the heading of "marry a Christian")?

When I was younger and looking for a husband the first thing on my list was that he be not only Christian but the same type of Christian as me with the same beliefs about Scripture, certain doctrines, etc.

The more men I met who shared all of those beliefs, the more I found that those types of Christians tend to be very "traditional" in their beliefs about male and female roles in marriage and ministry.

Because of my education and feminist leanings, I found that men such as that were not interested in me and that, even if they were, it was going to cause conflict and heartache if I "yoked" myself to a man who didn't believe women could be leaders.

Experience taught me that if I wanted a happy relationship with a man, the most important thing I had to look for was not whether he was Christian but whether he was egalitarian.

If I had met my husband 5 years earlier, he wouldn't have met my criteria for marriage. He was what I would have called a "nominal" Christian. He believes in God and believes that Jesus' teachings are worthy of following, he strives to do unto others as he would have them do unto him and to love one another, but he doesn't care so much about doctrine beyond that and he's not so sure about miracles and supernatural things in the Bible.

He's a good person; he knows how to love; he isn't selfish; and he believes in equality. Those things are far more important to me now than whether he believes in miracles or that Scripture is inspired.

 

[Autumnleaf]

Compatibility has to do with love and respect. If he doesn't or she doesn't then they are incompatible. Which I guess makes compatibility about pride or an unwillingness to love.

 

[Avniel]

I think the foundation of the marriage often times isn't solid enough to get married. I met my wife when I was 17 our relationship started out as a genuine. I know my wife like I would know a best friend...I can point out her flaws, strengths and weaknesses.

I believe that a great deal of time men and women in the church marry for the wrong reasons and never really commit to the other. People in the church get married due to pressure of the church, pressure of the family, pressure by society.....

I think when people start spending time with a person, building a friendship and looking at their spouse with logics not emotions marriages in this country will be better.

 

[mkgal1]

I've heard the same attitude that Mina described......"if they're single and Christian....then marriage ought to work" and it disturbs me.

I think that we all evolve in our beliefs (I think I've posted this before).....especially when we get married earlier than 30 years old. Because of that----there needs to be more tying us together than just one aspect (even if it *is* our faith---even that can change). The more "cables" that are tying us together with another person......the stronger that bond is (and less likely to be totally severed).

 

[akmom]

I wouldn't want to marry someone whom I didn't think was going to heaven. That would just be a sad realization to live with, no matter how much fun we had together.

Beyond that, I wanted a husband who was educated, hard working, and wanted kids. I find myself getting bored really quick with people who are less educated. Either their choice of topics are boring, or they aren't able to go into the same depth on a topic as I like. I also needed someone hard-working, because I like to be busy, and I need a companion who can keep up with that. I guess "hard working" might not even be the right word. I just need someone who takes an interest in things and appreciates a good project. And then kids are just something that has always been important to me. I'm a family person. I married someone who, before we did marry, agreed that if having children was not a possibility, pursuing adoption or foster care instead would be desirable.

I figured, if we can hold interesting conversations, keep busy, and have a family we valued, we'd probably get along just fine. And we have. (We'll be going on 9 years of marriage this summer. Actually we decided to marry about 13 years ago, but resolved to finish college first.)

 

[CounselorForChrist]

I think the honest truth is there are many verses in the bible we don't want to accept because as humans we for lack of better words don't like not getting our way. I used to download things illegally and ignored what the bible said about it. I used to swear more and made excuses to as to why the verse was wrong or didn't apply to me.

In the case of unequally yolked its something also hard to accept. Sometimes we fall in love with someone who is not christians. Bible never said it wouldn't happen. But some also marry that person with the intent or hope they will become saved. And in most cases that doens't happen. Such as my one friend whos husband will not convert. She regrets her marriage now, although is obviously happy she had a child still.

BTW I say this as someone who did the same years ago hoping each person I was with would change. Still everyone can decide what a verse means to them and do what they want. Its free will for a reason. I know after all the trials I've had with other women, I'm glad I married someone thats equally yolked. I can see why being unequally yoked causes so many issues.

The bible basically is warning us that path won't be easy. As said above me, also couldn't deal with the fact the person I was with may go to hell if they didn't become saved.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

I knew I would need a husband who could (and should) be the spiritual head of our house. So a non-Christian for marriage was never on the table. But I dated plenty of them.

I dated a very devout Catholic boy before I met my now-husband. That seemed to go well at first until he started badgering me about becoming a Catholic.

I think a dead marriage usually is one where the partners aren't truly focused on the other person. It's more of a "what am I getting out of this" attitude.

I know, because I've been there, recently actually. And I noticed that when I stopped thinking about what *I* was getting and started focusing on what I was giving my husband, our marriage grew and blossomed.

 

[akmom]

I think a dead marriage usually is one where the partners aren't truly focused on the other person. It's more of a "what am I getting out of this" attitude.

I know, because I've been there, recently actually. And I noticed that when I stopped thinking about what *I* was getting and started focusing on what I was giving my husband, our marriage grew and blossomed.

This.

 

[Ana the Ist]

But what qualities did you consider most important going into your marriage (either separate from, or under the heading of "marry a Christian")?

My wife was christian when we married (christian in the loosest sense of the word)....I've been atheist since I was 11-12. Just throwing that out in the open.


Communication. I was going to say.trust, which is extremely important, but I'm going with communication. Don't get me wrong, you need trust for it to work...but if you lose the trust, or it gets damaged....you can't get it back without communication. It's the keystone to every relationship.

Most women who read this are probably thinking "mmhhmmm...he needs to communicate more/better" and you're probably right, guys in general aren't big on expressing feelings. It's not manly. Truth is though, plenty of you ladies need to speak up as well. We aren't mind readers. I hate getting treated like I should know what a woman is thinking...even though I don't.
"Where do you wanna go out to eat?"
"I'll eat anything...you pick?"
"How about Mr Macho's Meaty Tacos?"
"Noooo...I don't like them."
"How about 24-7 Beer Heaven?"
"Nooo. I'd rather not."
"....." "You said, anywhere."
"Well I want you to pick someplace I want to go."

That's about when I scream inside and need a moment to rethink my life. Please ladies, if that conversation looks familiar....just say what you want.

 

[Johnnz]

Ideals and reality don;t always coincide. I have witnessed:

Christian marries Christian - good marriage
Christian marries Christian - failed/unhappy marriage
Christian marries non Christian - good marriage
Christian marries non Christian - failed/unhappy marriage

Life is bigger and more complex that we think. That's why Proverbs extols attaining wisdom, a lifetime of learning and pursuit.

John
NZ

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Ideals and reality don;t always coincide. I have witnessed:

Christian marries Christian - good marriage
Christian marries Christian - failed/unhappy marriage
Christian marries non Christian - good marriage
Christian marries non Christian - failed/unhappy marriage

Life is bigger and more complex that we think. That's why Proverbs extols attaining wisdom, a lifetime of learning and pursuit.

John
NZ

Christians aren't better than non-Christians, so it stands to reason that their marriages might not be better.

Where I believe Christians SHOULD be better is working at making the marriage work. I do believe that divorce should be the very last resort and it should only be a biblical divorce. Sure, it's hard. I don't recall ever being taught that marriage would be easy. I know some people who have the best marriages ever but they still have to work at it.

I just know that had I personally married a non-Christian, it would've been doomed to fail because my husband would start off immediately NOT being the man I expected him to be.