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He's somehow trying to twist "I don't believe you" into a claim that needs to be justified with the same level of evidence which would be used to back up "My man-God visited earth 2000 years ago, died and came back to life to save us from himself".Haven't bothered to read all nine pages, what are these "simple questions" Zippy is going on about?
Haven't bothered to read all nine pages, what are these "simple questions" Zippy is going on about?
To put it more accurately, I did answer them when they were posed, just not in the way that someone was wishing I would. Apparently not playing along with apologetics playbook makes me afraid of something. All it tells me it that there's not much there if the argument can't stand up to someone saying something unexpected in response to leading questions.KC is afraid of answering them.
To put it more accurately, I did answer them when they were posed, just not in the way that someone was wishing I would. Apparently not playing along with apologetics playbook makes me afraid of something. All it tells me it that there's not much there if the argument can't stand up to someone saying something unexpected in response to leading questions.
Stay safe, KC!
Did I mention non-responses like this don't do much to make me think there's much substance here?
To put it more accurately, I did answer them when they were posed...
...I haven't answered either of your questions.
Great, so you believe there are claims which atheists make, that atheists have the burden of proof for these claims, and that they are capable of meeting that burden of proof.
Thank you for the clear answer.
If an atheist makes a positive claim, then yes, they would have the burden of proof.
Not believing your claim is not a positive claim though. So in that instance, atheists have no burden of proof.
In this post you implicitly made two positive claims:
If these are not positive claims, then define what you mean by a positive claim.
- We cannot rationally justify believing in God.
- God is not worthy of belief.
Point 1)
You have not provided sufficient evidence to warrant belief, therefore we can not rationally justify believing in god
Point 2)
Since we have no rational justification to believe a god exists, then it would make no sense to believe in it.
Any more questions?
So you are accepting the burden of proof for the positive claims you've made?
I haven't made a positive claim...
I was explaining why my rebuttals are valid points which you have not addressed.
Then I would suggest reading the post, particularly the part that runs, "If these are not positive claims, then define what you mean by a positive claim."
Providing an additional reason for a positive claim does not make it a non-positive claim. Indeed, as already noted, providing a reason for a positive claim seems to accept the idea that you have the burden of proof. The claims apparently elicited additional arguments from you because you instinctively knew that you had the burden of proof, and thus sought to satisfy that burden.
1. Yes.
2. Yes.
Absence of a belief in god/s, is not a claim.To give you the backstory: I agreed with a Wikipedia definition of the burden of proof; various atheists disagreed on the basis that the burden of proof is on a claim and atheists don't make claims; I pointed out that atheists do make claims. Obviously there is a bit more squeezed into the thread, but that's how the two questions came about.
Absence of a belief in god/s, is not a claim.
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