Christian as an adjective

[JulySheMustFly]

Disclaimer: While this question was raised by the forum name change this thread is not a place to discuss the name change or forum politics.

How do you feel about things being assigned "Christian" as an adjective to describe them? How do you feel about "Christian" as an adjective to describe people? Do you feel it is a term that Jesus would assign to us or to things?

Feel free to add any other thoughts you have on the topic.

 

[tulc]

How do you feel about things being assigned "Christian" as an adjective to describe them?

I don't really have a problem with it as long as people see it for what it is: a marketing tool, if however it becomes "I only drink milk from Christian cows!!" Then I have a problem. (thank you Steve Taylor)

How do you feel about "Christian" as an adjective to describe people?

No problem.

Do you feel it is a term that Jesus would assign to us or to things?

To me one of the things I like about being Christian is how we're individuals to Jesus not labels. I don't believe He sees us as "Christians" He see's us as His children. (IMHO) And I suspect He thinks it's funny when people call something Christian. But then a lot of things we do strikes Him as funny. Others He probably weeps over.
tulc(drinking some "Christian" coffee right now)

 

[Adammi]

If you have a copy of Velvet Elvis, then look this up. If you don't have a copy go to your local bookstore and read this section.

Find the chapter titled "Movement Three Truth", find the third section of that chapter titled "Logos", and read it.

To some it up, Rob Bell says that he was once in a band and when people found out that he was a Pastor, they then asked if the band was a "Christian Band". He found the question to be very odd because you wouldn't ask your a plumber if he was a "Christian Plumber". He says "Christian is a great noun and a poor adjective."

I agree with him very much. Only a person can be a Christian, nothing else can be. A band can play music that expresses principles of Christianity, such as love, compassion, social justice, humor, sadness, joy, etc. A band doesn't have to be a "Christian Band" like Third Day, Jeremy Camp, or Michael W. Smith to sing about such things. You don't even have to be a Christian to sing about such things.

I am trying to make a conscious effort to use the word Christian only as a noun. I know that it may sound nitpicky, but I think it is the tip of the iceberg of what fundamentalist Christianity has been doing for a long time: labeling things Christian, when only a person can be a Christian.

 

[plum]

I'm having issues with this word in general lately But now that you mention it, I probably have more issues with the adjective than the noun.

It assumes that we know what the adjective stands for. For instance, when we say "Christian music" many of us assume it mentions jesus, has no cuss words, is sold in Christian book stores, and probably is sung at churches once in a while depending on the genre. this puts limits on the music itself and its audience.

when we say "Christian" as an adjective it basically assumes the object is good, or even better than the "secular" option. and in my experience, that may not be at all true.
like Adammi said, something doesn't need to be "Christian" in order to express principles/values important to Christians. in fact, the purpose might be better served by something that doesn't have the bulky adjective attached to it.

 

[Catherineanne]

How do you feel about things being assigned "Christian" as an adjective to describe them? How do you feel about "Christian" as an adjective to describe people? Do you feel it is a term that Jesus would assign to us or to things?

In one sense it is meaningless. I am a Christian, so therefore anything I read, watch, listen to or which belongs to me could be denoted 'Christian', just as my country can reasonably be described as a 'Christian country'.

However, as has already been said, if we then try to determine what are the necessary and sufficient conditions behind this semantic construct, then we are likely to run into problems, because each person, each denomination will bring their own baggage to the definition, and argue against other people's.

I think it would be a shame to lose the word as an adjective, because it can be useful, to an extent. A Christian church is very different from any other place of worship, of course. But certainly when this word is used to denote morality or piety, then that is not appropriate. I have sometimes joined discussions about what is, and what is not, 'modest clothing'. To which my answer is always that clothing is morally neutral, and the morality is always invested in the wearer, not in the clothes themselves. There is no such thing as 'Christian dress', nor even 'Islamic dress', where the adjective necessarily implies devotion or piety. There is such a thing as a devout follower of any faith, whose faith is expressed in the clothes they choose to wear.

 

[Catherineanne]

For instance, when we say "Christian music" many of us assume it mentions jesus, has no cuss words, is sold in Christian book stores, and probably is sung at churches once in a while depending on the genre. this puts limits on the music itself and its audience.

This is a very good example. The phrase 'Christian music' certainly does not mean any music which glorifies God in Christ, in my internal lexicon. It denotes a particular ghastly type of composition, with rather too much of the guitar and drums, and not a little emotional manipulation going on. And one where needless repetition is mistaken for devotion, so the poor listeners are left wondering when on earth it is going to end.

Handel's Messiah, on the other hand, would not fall under the category, and yet is, to me, a glorious celebration of the gift of music to Christians everywhere. As is Spem in Alium, or the Miserere, or anything similar.

Perhaps the problem is that 'Christian' as an adjective has been rather hijacked by one sector of our faith, who demand an exclusivity for it which in the end brings it somewhat into disrepute. It results in pointing to evangelicalism or fundamentalism, rather than to Christ, which has to be the greatest shame.

 

[JulySheMustFly]

Thanks for the feedback so far. I'm wondering if I should be brave and post this in my actual denominational forum as well. (I'm admittedly nervous to do so.)

If you have a copy of Velvet Elvis, then look this up. If you don't have a copy go to your local bookstore and read this section.

Find the chapter titled "Movement Three Truth", find the third section of that chapter titled "Logos", and read it.

To some it up, Rob Bell says that he was once in a band and when people found out that he was a Pastor, they then asked if the band was a "Christian Band". He found the question to be very odd because you wouldn't ask your a plumber if he was a "Christian Plumber". He says "Christian is a great noun and a poor adjective."

I agree with him very much. Only a person can be a Christian, nothing else can be. A band can play music that expresses principles of Christianity, such as love, compassion, social justice, humor, sadness, joy, etc. A band doesn't have to be a "Christian Band" like Third Day, Jeremy Camp, or Michael W. Smith to sing about such things. You don't even have to be a Christian to sing about such things.

I am trying to make a conscious effort to use the word Christian only as a noun. I know that it may sound nitpicky, but I think it is the tip of the iceberg of what fundamentalist Christianity has been doing for a long time: labeling things Christian, when only a person can be a Christian.

I am in a similar place. It was this questioning of the label christian that I sought out Rob Bell's book. I've read it and a great deal has stuck with me and is furthering my line of questions.

 

[spinningtutu]

I think "Christian" or perhaps "Christ Like" can - and should - only be used in a relative sense. In other words, in specific relevance to a specific occasion.

For example, a person can be reasonably deemed "Christ Like" when they love their neighbor as themselves - but no person is always "Christ Like". Any song, book (etc) can be "Christ Like" depending on how one reacts to something, the context of it specifically, etc. but no song/book/church/etc has a permanent "Christ" label affixed.

Foru.ms may, at times, be "Christian" for individuals and in individuals contexts. If I come here and feel accepted and someone extends me Christ's love - that is a "Christian" experience. Other times, my for.ums experience may not be "Christian" at all (likewise, I may or may not reciprocate a "Christian" experience, tho I may always want to). Thus, "Christian" can never be a permanent adjective to these foru.ms or anything else.

Not foru.ms, not people, not things, not animals, not churches.

Well, maybe Jesus.

 

[Mling]

Probably the only thing I can remember learning from a particular pastor is that the word "Christian" is a noun and should not be used as an adjective. A person is a Christian, and anything else that person might be--male, conservative, Native American,--describes and qualifies what type of Christian they are.

 

[SwirlingEd]

"I only drink milk from Christian cows!!" Then I have a problem. (thank you Steve Taylor)

Steve Taylor reference! Well done.