• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
  • We hope the site problems here are now solved, however, if you still have any issues, please start a ticket in Contact Us

Chemical Birth Control - Automatic Excommunication?

Do most Catholics (Roman or otherwise) realise why Chemical Contraception is wrong?

  • Yes: Because the chemicals prevent the implantation of the embryo in the womb.

  • Yes: Because the Pope said it was wrong.

  • Perhaps: Needs to be explained better by Priests and bishops

  • No: No-one listens because it's not popular

  • No: No-one preaches it because they are afraid of loosing $$$


Results are only viewable after voting.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Hallo all!

I am seeking a bit of clarification. . . In my studies as a RC, and in my current practice as a Primitive Episcopal Priest, it is my understanding that the RC, like the PEC, considers the use of chemical contraception for the purpose of family planning to be an automatic excommunication offence. I received an E-mail from a fellow poster on these boards saying that I was mistaken about the RC position.

Can someone clarify for me the statements of "Humanae Viate" and the Code of Canon Law regarding the use of Chemical birth control and being barred from Communion?

Also, as a question, how many folks here have been taught the reason behind the banning of chemical birth control? Do Catholics know that the ban is because of the abortifacent qualities of chemical birth control? Do they just ignore it? Your views, please!

Fr. Rob
 

patriarch

Senior Member
Mar 6, 2002
533
4
Illinois
Visit site
✟1,052.00
Faith
Catholic
The Catholic teaching that the use of artificial birth control of any kind is a mortal sin is well known. This is the first I have ever heard that using the pill results in automatic excommunication. There is no basis for it that I know of.

Although the pill may actually occasionally cause abortion, the reason for the condemnation of it and all other forms of artificial birth control is that it divides the procreative aspect from the unitive aspect of the marital act.

So far as I know, the abortifacient aspects of the pill were not known when Paul VI issued Humanae Vitae in 1968. The primary argument against the pill has never been that it is murder, but that it totally distorts the meaning of the marriage act.

Lee
 
Upvote 0

patriarch

Senior Member
Mar 6, 2002
533
4
Illinois
Visit site
✟1,052.00
Faith
Catholic
Dear Fr. Rob,

First, please forgive my discourtesy in not welcoming you to our board. A thousand welcomes!

I thought you might appreciate some documentation for the above response. This is from Familiaris Consortio, issued by Pope John Paul on November 22, 1981.

Lee



In an Integral Vision of the Human Person and of His or Her Vocation

32. In the context of a culture which seriously distorts or entirely misinterprets the true meaning of human sexuality, because it separates it from its essential reference to the person, the Church more urgently feels how irreplaceable is her mission of presenting sexuality as a value and task of the whole person, created male and female in the image of God.

In this perspective the Second Vatican Council clearly affirmed that "when there is a question of harmonizing conjugal love with the responsible transmission of life, the moral aspect of any procedure does not depend solely on sincere intentions or on an evaluation of motives. It must be determined by objective standards. These, based on the nature of the human person and his or her acts, preserve the full sense of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love. Such a goal cannot be achieved unless the virtue of conjugal chastity is sincerely practiced."(85)

It is precisely by moving from "an integral vision of man and of his vocation, not only his natural and earthly, but also his supernatural and eternal vocation,"(87) that Paul VI affirmed that the teaching of the Church "is founded upon the inseparable connection, willed by God and unable to be broken by man on his own initiative, between the two meanings of the conjugal act: the unitive meaning and the procreative meaning."(88) And he concluded by re-emphasizing that there must be excluded as intrinsically immoral "every action which, either in anticipation of the conjugal act, or in its accomplishment, or in the development of its natural consequences, proposes, whether as an end or as a means, to render procreation impossible."(89)

When couples, by means of recourse to contraception, separate these two meanings that God the Creator has inscribed in the being of man and woman and in the dynamism of their sexual communion, they act as "arbiters" of the divine plan and they "manipulate" and degrade human sexuality-and with it themselves and their married partner-by altering its value of "total" self-giving. Thus the innate language that expresses the total reciprocal self-giving of husband and wife is overlaid, through contraception, by an objectively contradictory language, namely, that of not giving oneself totally to the other. This leads not only to a positive refusal to be open to life but also to a falsification of the inner truth of conjugal love, which is called upon to give itself in personal totality.

When, instead, by means of recourse to periods of infertility, the couple respect the inseparable connection between the unitive and procreative meanings of human sexuality, they are acting as "ministers" of God's plan and they "benefit from" their sexuality according to the original dynamism of "total" selfgiving, without manipulation or alteration.(90)

In the light of the experience of many couples and of the data provided by the different human sciences, theological reflection is able to perceive and is called to study further the difference, both anthropological and moral, between contraception and recourse to the rhythm of the cycle: it is a difference which is much wider and deeper than is usually thought, one which involves in the final analysis two irreconcilable concepts of the human person and of human sexuality. The choice of the natural rhythms involves accepting the cycle of the person, that is the woman, and thereby accepting dialogue, reciprocal respect, shared responsibility and self- control. To accept the cycle and to enter into dialogue means to recognize both the spiritual and corporal character of conjugal communion and to live personal love with its requirement of fidelity. In this context the couple comes to experience how conjugal communion is enriched with those values of tenderness and affection which constitute the inner soul of human sexuality, in its physical dimension also. In this way sexuality is respected and promoted in its truly and fully human dimension, and is never "used" as an "object" that, by breaking the personal unity of soul and body, strikes at God's creation itself at the level of the deepest interaction of nature and person.
 
Upvote 0
CIC 1398 A person who procures a successful abortion incurs an automatic excommunication.

I do not know of a canon that says the same for birth control pills. But I am NOT a canon lawyer.

But maybe you were not thinking of canonical penalties, but just the fact that anyone in a state of mortal sin should go to confession (and repent, obviously) before they go up to receive Eucharist. The offense of contraception is grave, so if the person did it knowingly and freely, then it would be mortal and so they should not go to communion.

To my understanding, the way that the pill suppresses ovulation is sufficient to make it be contraception without even considering the abortifaecent properties. So even if there was not the abortion issue, the use of the pill for contraception would still be grave matter.

No. I was not taught originally about that it causes abortion. Only in more recent years did anyone tell me that, that I remember, anyway.

I don't think I can choose any of your poll options. I won't say welcome to the boards, cause I am new myself, but nice to meeet you!
 
Upvote 0

JohnR7

Well-Known Member
Feb 9, 2002
25,258
209
Ohio
✟29,532.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
>>Yes, all artificial contraception is forbidden.

I was always told that the only approve birth control in the Catholic Church was rhythm, along with abstance. Thirty years ago, it seemed like all Catholic girls know her natural cycle and when she could and could not get pregnant. But things are different now a days.

If anyone ever looked at the warnings that come with birth control pills they would know that they are not safe and can cause serious health problems if taken for a peolonged period of time. Other forms of chemicals designed to "kill" the sperm are harsh and can case burns. IUD's are just a form of abortion, they prevent the impregnated egg from planting itself in the uterus, because there is a evil and wicked foreign object present.

As far as condoms, there does not seem to be any health risk, in fact they seem to help to prevent the spread of disease, but that can give someone a false sense of security, because they do not stop all disease. Many people do not like them though, because they do not feel that they are not natural, and they cost a lot of money.

If a women has a regular cycle, they sell a little electronic gizzmo, that will help her to chart her monthly cycle. People can use them as a aid to help to have a baby, or not to have a baby as they see fit. There are also other "signs" based on body tempeture and things like that can be a aid to helping a women to understand her body and when she is furtile and able to conceive. Thanks JohnR7
 
Upvote 0
Well I went to Catholic grammar and high school all my life and I do know that the Catholic Church teaches that they shouldn't use birth control but for some reason at my school they acted like this was never a rule. Because more girls were using birth control than one can imagine.

I never understood that whole thing because I just about every girl I went to school with used birth control full well knowing it was against their faith.

One girl told me: What they think we don't do is best.

But I never new anything about excommunication for it..I mean how would anyone even find out ?
 
Upvote 0

Miss Shelby

Legend
Feb 10, 2002
31,286
3,286
59
✟114,736.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Private


Well I went to Catholic grammar and high school all my life and I do know that the Catholic Church teaches that they shouldn't use birth control but for some reason at my school they acted like this was never a rule. Because more girls were using birth control than one can imagine.

I never understood that whole thing because I just about every girl I went to school with used birth control full well knowing it was against their faith.


I went to Catholic grammar and high school, too Missy. And although I didn't use birth control in high school, I did afterwards. I am not proud to admit that, but I was ignorant. Too many people are. I wish I could turn back the clock, but I can't.

And just to be clear.. I knew what the Church taught.. I just didn't care.. because faith was not modeled in my home or in the people around me..so therefore.. I believe I was ignorant.

Michelle
 
Upvote 0
Originally posted by Miss Shelby


Well I went to Catholic grammar and high school all my life and I do know that the Catholic Church teaches that they shouldn't use birth control but for some reason at my school they acted like this was never a rule. Because more girls were using birth control than one can imagine.

I never understood that whole thing because I just about every girl I went to school with used birth control full well knowing it was against their faith.


I went to Catholic grammar and high school, too Missy. And although I didn't use birth control in high school, I did afterwards. I am not proud to admit that, but I was ignorant. Too many people are. I wish I could turn back the clock, but I can't.

And just to be clear.. I knew what the Church taught.. I just didn't care.. because faith was not modeled in my home or in the people around me..so therefore.. I believe I was ignorant.

Michelle

Oh Michelle, I hope you weren't offended. I wasn't making judgement on Catholic girls..I was just saying back then I didn't understand. And for the most part, I guess I didn't get it because I am not Catholic and my church always said it was fine to use birth-control in marriage. It was strictly up to the married parties...

I am sorry about your situation.
 
Upvote 0

Miss Shelby

Legend
Feb 10, 2002
31,286
3,286
59
✟114,736.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Private
Originally posted by MissytheButterfly


Oh Michelle, I hope you weren't offended. I wasn't making judgement on Catholic girls..I was just saying back then I didn't understand. And for the most part, I guess I didn't get it because I am not Catholic and my church always said it was fine to use birth-control in marriage. It was strictly up to the married parties...

I am sorry about your situation.

No, I wasn't offended, Missy. I can understand that you may have known girls in high school who used birth control and maybe even did alot of other questionable things.

But those are the people who need grace and mercy, just like I did. People are ignorant and it isn't always the fault of the Church. That's all I wanted to make clear.
:)

Michelle
 
Upvote 0

Avila

Boohoo moomoo, cebu
Feb 6, 2002
1,231
5
48
Indiana
Visit site
✟2,479.00
Faith
Catholic
Patriarch - I believe AnglicanFather is talking about the fact that one is in a state of mortal sin when they willingly prevent the possibility of creating life from the marriage act and thus should not recieve the Eucharist until they have confessed (and of course are repentant of) the sin - correct me if I'm wrong, Rob...

JohnR7 - the Rhythm method is responsible for a lot of "oops" babies, but now, the Creighton method or sympto-thermal method (also knows as FAM - fertility awareness method) is used for NFP. They rely on the body's signals to tell the woman when she is fertile. I can attest to the fact that it works quite well when you use it faithfully and prayerfully, and fails miserably if you aren't disciplined when using it (see my pic for the wonderful result). It has strengthened my marriage in ways I would never have dreamed back in the first days of marriage - as well as giving me a feeling of control over my body that far outweighs any supposed "freedoms" the pill, condoms, abortion, or any other means of preventing/terminating a pregnancy "give" modern women.
 
Upvote 0
Originally posted by Avila
Patriarch - I believe AnglicanFather is talking about the fact that one is in a state of mortal sin when they willingly prevent the possibility of creating life from the marriage act and thus should not recieve the Eucharist until they have confessed (and of course are repentant of) the sin - correct me if I'm wrong, Rob...

That is partially it. I guess my bigger issue is that, while some people try to defend birth control on a larger level, there can be no possible defence for the Pill, given it's abortifacient qualities.

I am quite interested in beginning some NFP stuff in my parish in the future, when we get some younger couples. . . are these electronic gizmos at the pharmacy accurate? What about when the woman has very unpredictable cycles? Is manual temp/mucous observaation better in that case, or do the machines do a better job?

Let's keep promoting NFP!!!!

Fr. Rob
 
Upvote 0

KC Catholic

Everybody's gone surfin'...Surfin' U.S.A
Feb 5, 2002
4,010
76
58
Overland Park, KS
✟29,387.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Fr Rob-

You might want to check with your local "Couple to Couple League". They are an ecumenical organization that trains couples on the Creighton method or sympto-thermal method.

It runs $60 a year for membership, which includes all the materials, monthly news letters, etc.

We are a part of a great group here in KC.
 
Upvote 0

Avila

Boohoo moomoo, cebu
Feb 6, 2002
1,231
5
48
Indiana
Visit site
✟2,479.00
Faith
Catholic
That is partially it. I guess my bigger issue is that, while some people try to defend birth control on a larger level, there can be no possible defence for the Pill, given it's abortifacient qualities.

I understand your point. I'm not sure if there is anything in canon law to that effect. If you know of anyone who is well-versed in canon law, you might ask them, but I wouldn't recommend anyone in Lafayette (their new guy that is in charge of "Family Life" stuff is a major joke).

I am quite interested in beginning some NFP stuff in my parish in the future, when we get some younger couples. . . are these electronic gizmos at the pharmacy accurate? What about when the woman has very unpredictable cycles? Is manual temp/mucous observaation better in that case, or do the machines do a better job?

I believe the fertility monitors, etc. are quite excellent for trying to achieve a pregnancy, but not sure about preventing a pregnancy. If the lady's cycles are irregular, it could be cost-prohibitive to be constantly buying the test strips for testing. Perhaps if used in a combo of manual temping and checking signs, it might work well.

We simply use an online charting service and interpret our own signs (www.fertilityfriend.com - but don't trust their analysis, learn to analyze your own - or www.tcoyf.com - it is a $30 one-time fee). The book "Taking Charge of Your Fertility" is an excellent resource for learning how to chart and interpret your body's signs. I recommend it to every couple who is engaged - or about to be ( ;) ) - or seriously considering an alternative to artificial birth control.
 
Upvote 0

VOW

Moderator
Feb 7, 2002
6,912
15
73
*displaced* CA, soon to be AZ!
Visit site
✟43,000.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Originally posted by KC Catholic
It runs $60 a year for membership, which includes all the materials, monthly news letters, etc.


Hey, KC!

Do they pro-rate a refund on yer membership fees if you get PG???

<running like crazy>


Peace and laughter,
~VOW
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.