Change in America

bhsmte · Jul 5, 2015

NightHawkeye said:
I would argue that it's not really about appealing to "moderate" voters. It seems more to be about appearing reasonable and having good intentions.

Appearing reasonable and having good intentions, would likely appeal to moderate voters.

People always talk of "rallying the base", which is important in state and local elections, but is somewhat useless in national elections like the Presidency.

There are maybe 20% of the voters that are hard core conservative voters and another 20% that are hard core liberal voters, but it is the other 60% that determines who is in the white house. Of that 60%, some may lean right or left, but they also are willing to vote for either a republican or democrat, depending on the candidate.

USincognito · Jul 5, 2015

revanneosl said:
Yeah, I'm going to stick with the party that thinks that the female half of the citizenry should have the liberty to make our own medical decisions.

Quiet woman! Don't make me ultrasound you!

ThatRobGuy · Jul 5, 2015

revanneosl said:
Hmmm. There seems to be a theme developing vis a vis Conservatives and liberty "for all".

Not true in my case, I'm what most would call conservative...however I'm okay with SSM & would be considered pro-choice and pro-legalization of drugs.

The reason I was asking if you were referring to abortion was because the one aspect of that, that does irk me a bit, is that I feel that the pro-choice "movement", in general, often takes an approach that is a bit of a dishonest ploy IMO.

They attempt to make their whole argument about rape & health cases for abortion when those 2 things make up the smallest fraction of reasons given for getting an abortion...the two combined only account for ~3% of abortions...meanwhile, not using contraception accounts for nearly half.

I'd much rather have them say "We should have the right to terminate our pregnancy if an unplanned pregnancy occurs and we're not ready for it"...at least that's being genuine.

It's pretty much the same lecture I give to the pro-weed folks (keeping in mind, I have no problem with weed). They attempt to make their whole case based on cancer patients and physically ill people...when instead, they should just be saying "It should be legal, because if I'm an adult, I should be able to smoke a joint in my own home if I'm not bothering anyone"

It seems to be a frequently used strategy for things that have a split in terms public support...people seem feel that if they try to focus on an aspect of it that the majority will find noble...that it will somehow give them more public support.

I guess the thought process is that they think it's easier to rally more troops & support by making their cause about cancer patients and rape victims rather than for people who just want to have recreational weed and women who want to get themselves out of a sticky situation.

But like I said, I don't oppose either of those things...I just don't want the people on the left thinking they need to trick me into supporting their cause by trying to portray those types of things as something other than what they really are.

Most abortions that take place are due to personal irresponsibility...and most of the people who smoke weed are using it for recreational purposes. And that's fine lol.

revanneosl · Jul 5, 2015

miniverchivi said:
Not true in my case, I'm what most would call conservative...however I'm okay with SSM & would be considered pro-choice and pro-legalization of drugs.

The reason I was asking if you were referring to abortion was because the one aspect of that, that does irk me a bit, is that I feel that the pro-choice "movement", in general, often takes an approach that is a bit of a dishonest ploy IMO.

They attempt to make their whole argument about rape & health cases for abortion when those 2 things make up the smallest fraction of reasons given for getting an abortion...the two combined only account for ~3% of abortions...meanwhile, not using contraception accounts for nearly half.

I'd much rather have them say "We should have the right to terminate our pregnancy if an unplanned pregnancy occurs and we're not ready for it"...at least that's being genuine.

It's pretty much the same lecture I give to the pro-weed folks (keeping in mind, I have no problem with weed). They attempt to make their whole case based on cancer patients and physically ill people...when instead, they should just be saying "It should be legal, because if I'm an adult, I should be able to smoke a joint in my own home if I'm not bothering anyone"

It seems to be a frequently used strategy for things that have a split in terms public support...people seem feel that if they try to focus on an aspect of it that the majority will find noble...that it will somehow give them more public support.

I guess the thought process is that they think it's easier to rally more troops & support by making their cause about cancer patients and rape victims rather than for people who just want to have recreational weed and women who want to get themselves out of a sticky situation.

But like I said, I don't oppose either of those things...I just don't want the people on the left thinking they need to trick me into supporting their cause by trying to portray those types of things as something other than what they really are.

Most abortions that take place are due to personal irresponsibility...and most of the people who smoke weed are using it for recreational purposes. And that's fine lol.

I understand what you are saying & I'm totally with you.

There are any number of reasons a woman might need an abortion. I don't need to hear them, and neither do legislators. Adult women are fully capable of making their own decisions about even such morally complex issues as abortion.

Likewise marijuana legalization. No doubt many therapeutic uses will be found for it now that scientists are allowed to do research with it, but frankly I see no difference between an adult enjoyinging a beer after work and an adult enjoying some marijuana after work.

Jan Volkes · Jul 5, 2015

ScottA said:
Oh, I forgot to mention the atheists...they fall out of the democrat tree when you shake it too. Nice.

From what I hear the number of atheists are growing by about 3 million a year so there will be even more of them come election day, they are already up to nearly 20% now, I can see a time when In God we trust is back off the money.

I'm still waiting to see if the republicans will still be angling for the religious vote, they put off quite a few last time,
I expect they will.

tulc · Jul 5, 2015

USincognito said:
Quiet woman! Don't make me ultrasound you!

Ok, that was pretty funny!
tulc(is just sayn')

outsidethecamp · Jul 5, 2015

ScottA said:
It is a shame, but the political genius of the Democratic party, is changing America. Somewhere in their history, someone discovered that the more people their policies appealed to, the more votes they would get. Brilliant. Unfortunately, it is changing the way Americans think.

America was founded on, and has been known for, its freedom and liberty, for an individuals right to choose their own way. We were the rebels that broke free from tyranny, the brave.

But things are different now. One "special interest" group after another have been lured into giving up their individual freedom in exchange for the promotion of their "cause." Women, Jews, blacks, hispanics, the handicapped, the poor, the elderly, homosexuals, even non-citizens...have all been the pet project and selling point to generate more votes. And it has been working wonderfully!

There is just one BIG problem: It's a sell-out, a trade, a loss, of individual freedom for their cause, for each cause. Instead of the freedom to pursue their own happiness, now people are no longer individuals, but members. Instead of the opportunity to build their own future, their future is outlined and regulated. Instead of opportunities to prosper, they have the obligation to contribute. Instead of a new job, or the chance to be their own boss...they got a new boss...and it's good old Uncle Sam. Only he's making $150k while, if you buy into their next big promotion, you're making $15 an hour. Brilliant.

So, instead of making it easier for us to be our own bosses, fulfill our own dreams...all their buddies are now bosses (your boss), living large. Yep, thanks to a sucker born every minute, government is now one big, good old boys club, with all the benefits...not the same benefits you get of course.

Democrat game plan. Brilliant!

Yes, it is brilliant and its working. And it is going to be in this oppressive environment that many souls will be saved as the Church has yet to see its best days. There is a winnowing taking place in the spiritual realm and the "gray areas" are fading into either white or black. It is going to cost something to truly stand for Christ and maybe now people will see Christ instead of fancy religious buildings, private jets, ornate garb and fake miracles. In the days ahead, you will want to be on the Lord's side and He is neither Dem or Rep.

Archaeopteryx · Jul 6, 2015

ScottA said:
Just because they noticed a growing special interest group who they could (brilliantly) con into voting for them, doesn't mean they really give a hoot about them. Besides, they didn't do them any favors. God set the terms of marriage, and where they may have gained some favor with the democrats, they lost it with God.

Yes, the Democratic plan is a stroke of genius. Respect people and work toward protecting their rights and they'll vote for you. Now if only Republicans could figure this out.

ScottA · Jul 6, 2015

bhsmte said:
Do you have any examples, of how you have lost freedoms to live your own life in the way you desire?

"Instead of the freedom to pursue their own happiness, now people are no longer individuals, but members. Instead of the opportunity to build their own future, their future is outlined and regulated. Instead of opportunities to prosper, they have the obligation to contribute. Instead of a new job, or the chance to be their own boss...they got a new boss...and it's good old Uncle Sam. Only he's making $150k while, if you buy into their next big promotion, you're making $15 an hour. Brilliant.

So, instead of making it easier for us to be our own bosses, fulfill our own dreams...all their buddies are now bosses (your boss), living large."

ScottA · Jul 6, 2015

Archaeopteryx said:
Yes, the Democratic plan is a stroke of genius. Respect people and work toward protecting their rights and they'll vote for you. Now if only Republicans could figure this out.

I would rather see the Republican party list the special interest groups and offer an alternative to the false hopes and failed attempts that have been promised them; to dedicate themselves to honesty in leading; to lead the cause of political reform; to reel back in from the madness and corruption. Competing with the Democrats in the current political style, has indeed failed of late. A campaign dedicated to doing things different instead of the same, could be great(er).

Jan Volkes · Jul 6, 2015

ScottA said:
I would rather see the Republican party list the special interest groups and offer an alternative to the false hopes and failed attempts that have been promised them; to dedicate themselves to honesty in leading; to lead the cause of political reform; to reel back in from the madness and corruption. Competing with the Democrats in the current political style, has indeed failed of late. A campaign dedicated to doing things different instead of the same, could be great(er).

Republicans have been trained to keep things as they have always been in order to maintain the status quo, the rich stay rich and the poor keep struggling in the hope that one day they too will be rich. [the old American dream]
Democrats have decided to try and do it a different way, they are trying to find a way of cutting the cake so that everyone gets a piece instead of one or two people getting it all, they have decided that life should be better for all Americans and not just for the fortunate few.

ScottA · Jul 6, 2015

Jan Volkes said:
Republicans have been trained to keep things as they have always been in order to maintain the status quo, the rich stay rich and the poor keep struggling in the hope that one day they too will be rich. [the old American dream]
Democrats have decided to try and do it a different way, they are trying to find a way of cutting the cake so that everyone gets a piece instead of one or two people getting it all, they have decided that life should be better for all Americans and not just for the fortunate few.

That is certainly what they would like you to believe. But I ain't buying it. And the reason is...they are rich, and they don't want less. Just the opposite. They are not offering to cut the masses in on their prosperity, they are offering a bunch of little appeasements, to keep the natives from being restless.

I prefer the more honest approach where one is not regulated out of the upper circle, but has a real shot at achieving whatever they put their mind to. No big government stranglehold for me, thank you very much.

Jan Volkes · Jul 6, 2015

ScottA said:
I prefer the more honest approach where one is not regulated out of the upper circle, but has a real shot at achieving whatever they put their mind to. No big government stranglehold for me, thank you very much.

Then I wish you all the best in your endeavours.

What do you think about all the people who have signed up to Obamacare? do you think they have let America down?

outsidethecamp · Jul 6, 2015

“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
― Margaret Thatcher

Somewhere around 40% of Americans are working and they are paying for welfare for the rest who are not and of course the 40 million or sow illegals. This is not the way to make things even and fair. This will only end in servitude for everyone. Welfare takes away a man's will to work and this is the "genius" of the Dems.

JustOneWay · Jul 6, 2015

outsidethecamp said:
and of course the 40 million or sow illegals.

What about them? Are you insinuating that 40 million illegals are on welfare? If so, please source your comment.

Archaeopteryx · Jul 6, 2015

outsidethecamp said:
Somewhere around 40% of Americans are working and they are paying for welfare for the rest who are not and of course the 40 million or sow illegals. This is not the way to make things even and fair. This will only end in servitude for everyone. Welfare takes away a man's will to work and this is the "genius" of the Dems.

Welfare takes away a person's will to work? Says who?

outsidethecamp · Jul 6, 2015

JustOneWay said:
What about them? Are you insinuating that 40 million illegals are on welfare? If so, please source your comment.

Not totally, but we pay for food stamps and other ancillary services (medical, emergency room is a big cost).

Armoured · Jul 6, 2015

outsidethecamp said:
Somewhere around 40% of Americans are working and they are paying for welfare for the rest who are not

60% unemployment rate, huh?

Do go on...

outsidethecamp · Jul 6, 2015

Archaeopteryx said:
Welfare takes away a person's will to work? Says who?

You can use your powers of observation to see that many black families are not 3rd generation welfare recipients. Granddaddy taught his son and Daddy taught his son. That's pretty bad don't you think? Three generations of welfare recipients and the poor black community leads in single parent homes and abortions. Welfare is destroying the black family structure. There is much anecdotal evidence of this and you can search for it as easily as I can. What has destroyed so many black families is also destroying white families and will get the hispanics, too. Until we are all slaves.

Why has the national debt been frozen at 18 trillion the last 2 months? Maybe, something psychological about hitting 20 trillion dollars in debt. Think about that 20 trillion in debt. The government took in 2 trillion in taxes the first 5 months of hte year and still was 360 billion in debt. Two trillion in taxes in 5 months was still not enough to pay the bills. By the way they are taking more money from Americans in taxes than ever before. We are setting records on a regular basis. It is all part of the great wealth shift.

Archaeopteryx · Jul 6, 2015

outsidethecamp said:
You can use your powers of observation to see that many black families are not 3rd generation welfare recipients. Granddaddy taught his son and Daddy taught his son. That's pretty bad don't you think? Three generations of welfare recipients and the poor black community leads in single parent homes and abortions. Welfare is destroying the black family structure. There is much anecdotal evidence of this and you can search for it as easily as I can.

Translation: there are so many right-wing blogs that claim this; ergo, it is true.

Change in America

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