• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Can you explain?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Jesus made three prophecies about his second coming in Matthew:

1. That the Apostles should not have gone over the cities of Israel till the Son of Man returns. (Matthew 10:23)

2. That some standing there should not taste death till they saw the Son of Man coming in His kingdom. (Matthew 16:28)

3. That before that generation passed away all these things would be fulfilled. (Matthew 24:34)

If you think Revelation is describing something in our future, could you please explain these sayings?
 
Upvote 0

JesusServant

do not stray too far left nor right but CENTER
Dec 5, 2002
4,114
29
✟27,268.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Today at 12:01 PM Chris†opher Paul said this in Post #5

Jerusalem was ravaged as the harlot of Babylon in AD 70. This is so plainly obvious when we examine Matthew, Isiah, and Revelation, together.


Explain how everything Jesus referred to in Matthew 24 and how it transpired and is history.  All you have is the temple nothing more.
 
Upvote 0
Today at 01:07 PM JesusServant said this in Post #6 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=665218#post665218)

Explain how everything Jesus referred to in Matthew 24 and how it transpired and is history.  All you have is the temple nothing more.

Before you claim what I "have," perhaps you should learn some history about the siege and eventual destruction of Jerusalem by Emperor Titus in AD 70.

You can read about the details in Josephus.
 
Upvote 0

JesusServant

do not stray too far left nor right but CENTER
Dec 5, 2002
4,114
29
✟27,268.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
(Matthew 24:1) And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to [him] for to shew him the buildings of the temple.

(Matthew 24:2) And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

(Matthew 24:3) And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what [shall be] the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

(Matthew 24:4) And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

(Matthew 24:5) For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

(Matthew 24:6) And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all [these things] must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

(Matthew 24:7) For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

(Matthew 24:8) All these [are] the beginning of sorrows.

(Matthew 24:9) Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

(Matthew 24:10) And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

(Matthew 24:11) And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

(Matthew 24:12) And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

(Matthew 24:13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

(Matthew 24:14) And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Note: Hmmm, we're close, but China (whose population is over 1 billion I believe) is barely getting the Gospel today and this does not include smaller nations who have not yet received the Gospel.

(Matthew 24:15) When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

Surely He didn't want people to stand in the temple when it was being destroyed, so what holy place to you think he was talking about standing in?

Maybe the abomination of desolation here is the temple being destroyed by the Romans.  Let's say that it is without a doubt, I can buy that no problem... but what about the rest?

(Matthew 24:16) Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

(Matthew 24:17) Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:

(Matthew 24:18) Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.

(Matthew 24:19) And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!

(Matthew 24:20) But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

(Matthew 24:21) For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Ouch, I'm thinking the holocaust and Hitler brought about more tribulation then those days, but that's an opinion call, so lets just say the tribulation of the the Apostles time is still the worst in history.

(Matthew 24:22) And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.


I can buy this being that the days were shortened back then of Rome's rule, how would we know if God shortened the time of the Roman empire or not?  Let's continue...


(Matthew 24:23) Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here [is] Christ, or there; believe [it] not.


Why should we not believe just someone telling us he has come and it's over?  Because we will ALL see Him, every tribe and nation in the world will see him.  I doubt this has taken place because we have no history of it.


(Matthew 24:24) For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if [it were] possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

(Matthew 24:25) Behold, I have told you before.

(Matthew 24:26) Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, [he is] in the secret chambers; believe [it] not.

(Matthew 24:27) For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

(Matthew 24:28) For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.

(Matthew 24:29) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

(Matthew 24:30) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Once again we will ALL see Him, every tribe and nation in the world will see him.  I doubt this has taken place because we have no history of it.  And we have plenty of written history from this era.

(Matthew 24:31) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


Okay, if the elect are now gone then who passed down the authority in the RCC in the Apostolic Succession (sorry if I botched that title)?


(Matthew 24:32) Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer [is] nigh:

(Matthew 24:33) So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, [even] at the doors.

(Matthew 24:34) Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

(Matthew 24:35) Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Is an old heaven and earth gone and we're living in a new one?  What was this old heaven and earth like?

(Matthew 24:36) But of that day and hour knoweth no [man], no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

(Matthew 24:37) But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

(Matthew 24:38) For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

(Matthew 24:39) And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

When was everyone taken away?

(Matthew 24:40) Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.


Sure this line could be talking about Roman soldiers taking away the believers to be executed for their beliefs, but the line right before this, 24:39, says "took all of them away".  So is this two events? 


(Matthew 24:41) Two [women shall be] grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

(Matthew 24:42) Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

Oh wait, no it couldn't be talking about Roman soldiers, this is obviously the Lord coming to take them away.

(Matthew 24:43) But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

(Matthew 24:44) Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

(Matthew 24:45) Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

(Matthew 24:46) Blessed [is] that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

(Matthew 24:47) Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

(Matthew 24:48) But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

(Matthew 24:49) And shall begin to smite [his] fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

(Matthew 24:50) The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for [him], and in an hour that he is not aware of,

(Matthew 24:51) And shall cut him asunder, and appoint [him] his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
 
Upvote 0

JesusServant

do not stray too far left nor right but CENTER
Dec 5, 2002
4,114
29
✟27,268.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Today at 12:11 PM Chris†opher Paul said this in Post #7

Before you claim what I "have," perhaps you should learn some history about the siege and eventual destruction of Jerusalem by Emperor Titus in AD 70.

You can read about the details in Josephus.

You're the one here making a claim, therefor you're the one who has to back it up.  I haven't settled on a viewpoint of Revelation/Daniel/Prophecy yet, but you obviously have.  Show us the error of our ways.
 
Upvote 0
Why should we not believe just someone telling us he has come and it's over? Because we will ALL see Him, every tribe and nation in the world will see him. I doubt this has taken place because we have no history of it.

I see Him everytime I go to Mass, don't know about you though.

Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

New Heaven and new Earth, huh? This is figurative for the New Covenant.

Okay, if the elect are now gone then who passed down the authority in the RCC in the Apostolic Succession (sorry if I botched that title)?

What? This is irrelevant. Gathering his elect is not necessarily removing them, is it?

Oh wait, no it couldn't be talking about Roman soldiers, this is obviously the Lord coming to take them away.

As if the Lord doesn't work through natural means? Heh, read Old Testament much?

Ouch, I'm thinking the holocaust and Hitler brought about more tribulation then those days, but that's an opinion call, so lets just say the tribulation of the the Apostles time is still the worst in history.

That because you have never read Josephus' account of the siege.
 
Upvote 0

JesusServant

do not stray too far left nor right but CENTER
Dec 5, 2002
4,114
29
✟27,268.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Today at 12:26 PM Chris†opher Paul said this in Post #10

I see Him everytime I go to Mass, don't know about you though.

I see you're still the same.  Attack when you cannot back up what you say.  :(
Would you mind telling me what he looks like, since you see Him?  I've always wondered what He looks like.

New Heaven and new Earth, huh? This is figurative for the New Covenant.

Interesting, I wonder why he didn't say there shall be a new Covenant and the Old Covenant shall pass away. 
 
Upvote 0
I see you're still the same. Attack when you cannot back up what you say.
Would you mind telling me what he looks like, since you see Him? I've always wondered what He looks like.

How is my mentioning the Eucharist an attack?

PS

Go back a post, I added more responses.
 
Upvote 0

seebs

God Made Me A Skeptic
Apr 9, 2002
31,917
1,530
20
Saint Paul, MN
Visit site
✟70,235.00
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Today at 12:23 PM JesusServant said this in Post #8 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=665254#post665254)
(Matthew 24:15) When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

Surely He didn't want people to stand in the temple when it was being destroyed, so what holy place to you think he was talking about standing in?

I think you're misreading that. It doesn't mean
"Stand in the holy place when you see the abomination"
It means
"When the abomination is standing in the holy place, and you see it"

And it seems to me that the Roman Empire sacking the temple at Jerusalem fits that pretty well.
 
Upvote 0
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.