Can we make it happen?

[firesky112]

Can we create heaven on earth? Can we connect to God without using the bible and be independent, free, and do things we never thought before?

Jesus is out there. We can speak to him, even without learning of him from the Bible. So is God. Can we do this?

Please tell me what you think.

 

[ContentInHim]

I don't know how you can know about Jesus without being taught by either other believers or the Bible. Maybe you don't need both, but you surely need one or the other.

I agree you can know God and the Bible even says so but if you know him well then you know you need a savior and we are back to knowing about Jesus.

I do not believe we can create heaven on earth because we can't agree about small goals let alone big ones. How would you take care of those who desire to destroy heaven on earth? Whose idea of heaven? Etc.

Interesting questions though and welcome to CF!

 

[ebia]

Can we create heaven on earth?

Not by our own efforts (though those efforts are important).

Can we connect to God without using the bible and be independent, free, and do things we never thought before?

The trouble with being completely "free" is that you tend to wander off in the wrong direction. God's revelation in Jesus of Nazareth, and through the texts that we call the bible, are indispensible in ensuring that we stay on the right track.

Jesus is out there. We can speak to him, even without learning of him from the Bible. So is God. Can we do this?

You can, but it's very difficult to make sure you are hearing God and not just hearing what you want to hear. The bible and the church are there for our benefit - if you go wandering in the wilderness with neither map (bible) nor guide (church) don't be suprised if you get lost.

Please tell me what you think.[/quote]

 

[Jerrell]

Can we create heaven on earth? Can we connect to God without using the bible and be independent, free, and do things we never thought before?

Jesus is out there. We can speak to him, even without learning of him from the Bible. So is God. Can we do this?

Please tell me what you think.

1)You cannot create you own literal heaven or earth, but you can have a mindset of living in your own heaven and hell.

2) One can get to know God by walking in nature. But the Bible is there to tell us about him- without knowledge, there can be no wisdom, without wisdom one cannot understand.

 

[WarEagle]

[".

 

[jive4005]

A while back I was talking with God.
He said... " Do you know the secrect of finding heaven on earth?"
I said, "no, what?"

He said "you've got to look for it!"

I found it.

His,
Rev J

 

[MrPolo]

You might want to check out former Protestant Scott Hahn's The Lamb's Supper: The Mass as Heaven on Earth.

It is his and some early Church fathers' exegesis on how the Catholic mass is a small glimpse of the heavenly Liturgy.

 

[dvd_holc]

Can we create heaven on earth? Can we connect to God without using the bible and be independent, free, and do things we never thought before?

Jesus is out there. We can speak to him, even without learning of him from the Bible. So is God. Can we do this?

Please tell me what you think.

Those, who obey God, are living heaven on earth, the way God intends. Now, we can not bring about the final restoration of creation as God has set forth in Jesus Christ to accomplish this. However, we can live as implementing that achievement in our daily lives by following Jesus' commandments.

All of creation is intimately connected to God and He has give knowledge of Himself and His nature through it. In another distant way, God also chooses to indwell in things more distantly than other things. God choose to dwell in the Jewish people, the Temple, the Land, and the Bible. If we want to understand God's plan for all of this, then we have to walk the path He has given us which is ultimately in the Bible.

You may have learned of Christ and Christianity from a person, but they go to one source, the bible. You want to be made complete and whole as a human being, then silent to the Creator for our purpose and plan of redemption.

 

[tapero]

Can we create heaven on earth? Can we connect to God without using the bible and be independent, free, and do things we never thought before?

Jesus is out there. We can speak to him, even without learning of him from the Bible. So is God. Can we do this?

Please tell me what you think.

The answer is no. The reason why is because all are sinners. There always will be wars until the end. This is also in the bible.

Until all sin is removed there will never be peace. If God removed all sin, we would all die.

You are probably a very good and kind person, but we know the world is not full of people like you. There are rapists, murderers, pedophiles, etc. This will not change, for man will continue to sin.

Even if not a criminal such as above, our hearts tend to be self centered, even tho we are to love others, we all fail, and do things that we shouldn't, causing others pain or other ramifications of our actions (sin.)

Many times we hear one loses their job, and shoots people in a mall. There are endless scenarios that occur and no way to stop it.

There will always be the adulterer who destroys families by believing grass is greener on other side, and leaves family, wife or husband and children behind, now forever plagued with the hurt and pain and suffering, and many times poverty which occurs.

The list is endless, but that's a few examples.

There are accidents and illness, which will always occur so sadness will always be around to those who have loved ones hurt or sick or they themselves.

But it won't be like this forever. The end times will kick off when God so determines and the beginnning of the end will start. After it's over, there will be two judgements.

For believers, judgement of their works, and only for loss or gain of reward in heaven. Christians are not judged for their sin as is forgiven once came to Christ.

For non believers, they are judged for their sin, or likewise for not believing in Christ.

So, it would be wonderful for earth to be a place of peace and joy and such, but will never occur due to the sin in all men.

In one part of the end times, is the 1000 year reign of Jesus, and says he will rule with an iron fist. We don't know what that means, but such will occur, so things would be better in those times, but people will be born who never turn to Christ.

After the 1000 year reign is the final battle, satan and armies and demons lose, and God is victorious, already is, but will again, and then the judgement will occur.

 

[firesky112]

Tapero: That's great information, but have you yourself ever really tried to discover whether you could "live" with this sin or not? There's nothing to be afraid of, because most of the things we deal with like lust are going to fade away once we die anyways. They are just tools for a specific purpose; for instance lust is needed for sex. So why be afraid of them?

dvd_holc: Sorry, but I see a lot of sad Christians and ones who do some pretty outrageous things because they're unhappy.

As I read the rest of these posts, all I see is "No we can't create Heaven on Earth, we should just settle for reading the bible or having a good mindset."

So, besides reading the bible and following what it says, can human beings DO ANYTHING besides spread their religion and feed the poor? You're saying we can't EVER create heaven on earth? So what are we gonna do then? Become sheep and that's it? I'll tell you what, I highly, highly, doubt that's what God wants. Why would anyone want that?

 

[salida]

firesky112--

Jesus is His Word (the Bible). The only way heaven is possible is because God is there in His full glory. God IS Love and without this - heaven doesn't exist. In heaven one is in the presense of God - which is unconditional perfect love.

Man in his fallen nature can't make "a heaven". Its like asking ants to create the universe - its not happening.

 

[dvd_holc]

dvd_holc: Sorry, but I see a lot of sad Christians and ones who do some pretty outrageous things because they're unhappy.

As I read the rest of these posts, all I see is "No we can't create Heaven on Earth, we should just settle for reading the bible or having a good mindset."

So, besides reading the bible and following what it says, can human beings DO ANYTHING besides spread their religion and feed the poor? You're saying we can't EVER create heaven on earth? So what are we gonna do then? Become sheep and that's it? I'll tell you what, I highly, highly, doubt that's what God wants. Why would anyone want that?

Yes, some Christians can become sad. Nowhere does the bible say that Christians will not be sad. Also, did I saw we would not be sad. In fact, I said just the opposite in another thread on Questions for Christians. It is not a question of actually being sad; rather a figuring out of how to use this emotion the way God intended us to it.

But when you say, "ones who do some pretty outrageous things because they're unhappy" it can be shown that they were not being like Jesus Christ. So what is your point? You can't accuse Christ because someone who claims to be like Christ is not actually like Jesus, can you? But you do... Also, Christian don't just turn a switch and know all things and do things perfectly...but there is a process in which we become more like Christ. Sometimes, it is only baby steps and other times we back track. Still, God works in us each day to complete us.

Further, you have misunderstood the meaning and goals of Christians. It is when we read the bible, love our neighbors, take care of the poor, etc...We are living Heaven on Earth and rebuilding lives in the present. This should not be confused with the redemption of the whole world. As it is, the whole created order is in corruption because of sin. We (the redeemed through the redemption in Christ) can't make the whole creation right because we are also still part of the problem, but we do some parts as a picture of that ultimate day. It is when we do those things for others that we know the love of God more completely.

 

[ContentInHim]

Tapero: That's great information, but have you yourself ever really tried to discover whether you could "live" with this sin or not? There's nothing to be afraid of, because most of the things we deal with like lust are going to fade away once we die anyways. They are just tools for a specific purpose; for instance lust is needed for sex. So why be afraid of them?

dvd_holc: Sorry, but I see a lot of sad Christians and ones who do some pretty outrageous things because they're unhappy.

As I read the rest of these posts, all I see is "No we can't create Heaven on Earth, we should just settle for reading the bible or having a good mindset."

So, besides reading the bible and following what it says, can human beings DO ANYTHING besides spread their religion and feed the poor? You're saying we can't EVER create heaven on earth? So what are we gonna do then? Become sheep and that's it? I'll tell you what, I highly, highly, doubt that's what God wants. Why would anyone want that?

Who's afraid of sin? Not me - as sin has lost it's power over me. And why would I actively consider sin since this would separate me from God? I tried sin and it did not make me happy.

 

[indagroove]

firesky112--

Jesus is His Word (the Bible). The only way heaven is possible is because God is there in His full glory. God IS Love and without this - heaven doesn't exist. In heaven one is in the presense of God - which is unconditional perfect love.

Man in his fallen nature can't make "a heaven". Its like asking ants to create the universe - its not happening.

Good points all, BUT, do we not experience God's Glory here on Earth. If we can submit to Him, and live in his Word, Be not anxious, but be Joyful in everything we have, and know that it all comes from God. To know we are forgiven for our treaspasses, this is the peace the Christ gives us. While it is true that Evil is still around us, we can put on our armor, and live in this Heaven on Earth. It is not all about the destination. God wants us to rejoice in our journey on earth.

 

[Dorothea]

The bible and the church are there for our benefit - if you go wandering in the wilderness with neither map (bible) nor guide (church) don't be suprised if you get lost.

I believe the same.

 

[Dorothea]

So, besides reading the bible and following what it says, can human beings DO ANYTHING besides spread their religion and feed the poor? You're saying we can't EVER create heaven on earth? So what are we gonna do then? Become sheep and that's it? I'll tell you what, I highly, highly, doubt that's what God wants. Why would anyone want that?

Yes, you do a lot, every day when you're a Christian. IMO and belief, your job is to walk your life-long journey towards Christ, and that entails working on becoming more Christ-like. This takes years, decades of your life, and you won't completely attain it before you die, but it's a Christian's duty as a servant of Christ to walk this path. We stumble, fall, and we get back up and continue the walk, praying to do better the next day than the day before. We take the tools offered by our guide, our Church, to help us through our long and difficult walks. The Church is there to help guide us, keep out heresies, preserve the Word of God, and teach the Word and what is sin and not sin. We read our Bibles, writings from Church Fathers, and follow our Traditions, as it all comes together as a whole and full faith on our walks and journey towards Christ, and it's through His grace that we are able to do this and can one day have the chance to spend eternity with him.

eta: And being a Christian isn't about "me, me, me." It's about serving God. The Church is there in its form with hierarchy to help humble us and help us to learn humility. Pride is one of the worst sins. When one is a servant of God, follows Christ, is guided by their Church which is guided by the Holy Spirit, and you have accountability, and it's not all about you, you learn humbleness and humility, which will help you when one day you're standing in front of Christ on Judgment Day.

 

[tapero]

Tapero: That's great information, but have you yourself ever really tried to discover whether you could "live" with this sin or not? There's nothing to be afraid of, because most of the things we deal with like lust are going to fade away once we die anyways. They are just tools for a specific purpose; for instance lust is needed for sex. So why be afraid of them?

dvd_holc: Sorry, but I see a lot of sad Christians and ones who do some pretty outrageous things because they're unhappy.

As I read the rest of these posts, all I see is "No we can't create Heaven on Earth, we should just settle for reading the bible or having a good mindset."

So, besides reading the bible and following what it says, can human beings DO ANYTHING besides spread their religion and feed the poor? You're saying we can't EVER create heaven on earth? So what are we gonna do then? Become sheep and that's it? I'll tell you what, I highly, highly, doubt that's what God wants. Why would anyone want that?

Hi, the part you addressed to me at top, I didn't understand.

How can anyone live without sin when all are sinners and what is your reply to those who rape, murder, incest, kill people in schools and malls, pedophiles etc.

How will the world get better when such as above and more will always be on the earth as well?

Thanks,
tapero

 

[tapero]

hi again, in my last reply to you, the topic was making heaven on earth you stated or make earth a lot better etc.

So then I replied, and you replied with what's shown in my last post which I answered.

Later though, I thought to ask you this.

Since you asked the question about making the world better and how to go about it, and I replied about rapists, murderers etc, in 2nd to last of my posts, and then you went off topic and said something about livign with sin or not.

My question to you is, what is your plan to eliminate sin, or if you don't think such exists how is what you want a better world etc, gonna occur when criminals as well as people sinning.

You bypassed this with your last reply, so what is your suggestion?

What do you do with those who are criminals, either caught or uncaught, illness, and accidents, which will always occur.

You don't have an answer as there is none, but what God gives, which is why you went off topic.

So, what is your plan? if you wish to disregard the word sin? What are you going to do with the criminals etc.

Thanks
tapero

 

[mpok1519]

why would heaven be on earth? Earth is a dump compared to Heaven.

I dont think God would wanna make earth His new home.

 

[MessianicJewishGuy]

Can we create heaven on earth? Can we connect to God without using the bible and be independent, free, and do things we never thought before?

Jesus is out there. We can speak to him, even without learning of him from the Bible. So is God. Can we do this?

Please tell me what you think.

Humans are are corrupt. So there will be no heaven on Earth as we think of it.