Bring it on Atheists!!!

Lisa0315 · Jan 25, 2007

And Ed, you would be surprised at the number of Christians and Jews who believe in evolution to some degree. We just happen to believe that the whole thing was put into motion by God, and that final change in man was when God made him a living soul.

Now, please note, that I am a True Christian, and I will not say that I believe in evolution. I lean more towards a YEC, but...I do see how it is possible for God and evolution to both be true. It is just not that important until you get to the whole fall of man part.

Lisa

Lisa0315 · Jan 25, 2007

Pikachu said:
No True Scotsman, indeed.

<gasp> I am on the atheist side of the argument! <gasp> <sputter> <choke> Oh, wait, they have a new smilie for all of that!

Lisa

rmwilliamsll · Jan 25, 2007

how could they agree?
because it is a true proposition?

because the truth is not dependent on who holds it, but what the content of the knowledge is. for after all Romans 1 does say that the knowledge of God is clearly seen in the universe. It is not that the universe deceives and misleads people, but rather the universe reflects the character of God.

Lisa0315 · Jan 25, 2007

Hey, Where did Ed go? It is the first, one and only, probably the last argument I will EVER win with an atheist. Hello!!! I liked this guy! Come back Ed! Pretty please?

Lisa

Dannager · Jan 25, 2007

Lisa0315 said:
Hey, Where did Ed go? It is the first, one and only, probably the last argument I will EVER win with an atheist. Hello!!! I liked this guy! Come back Ed! Pretty please?

Lisa

I hate to burst your bubble, but Ed Vidence isn't an atheist. He's a Christian, and a gap theory believer.

Tiberius · Jan 25, 2007

boboChristian333 said:
I don't understand how people could believe in all this "evolution" and "big bang" stuff. When scientists say that we are related to monkeys, IM NOT A MONKEY!!! I dont know how or where they got that rubish from. I mean, just because they have fingers like us doesnt mean that we evolved from them. Dogs have eyes, we do to, fish have lips, so do we. Im just sayin, how on earth did evolution occur if there are still monkeys around? Dont you think that the monkeys woulf be evolved like us too? So why arent they? Tell me that. Also this big bang crud. I mean, your telling me that I was created from some rock that smashed into another rock? Go outside and find two rocks, smash them together as hard as you can, then tell me if humans pop out.

Anyone is free to make their own opinions on my above statements.

-God Bless!

I've found that an analogy with cars can sometimes help people understand the idea of evolution of Humans from apes.

It's like saying, "if a Porsche evolved from a Landcruiser, why are there still Landcruisers?"

Porsches didn't "evolve" from Landcruisers. it's more accurate to say that Porsches and landcruisers both evolved from an earlier type of car, let's say the Model T Ford.

As time went on, some cars took the parts of the Model T that were adapted to travelling over rough terrain and enhaced them and improved them, while others ignored the rough terrain aspects of the Model T and instead developed so as to be able to travel faster.

So we now have two types of car. One type is more suited to travel over rough terrain, and the other kind is more suited to travel fast. Both of these types of car "evolved" from an earlier car, a common automobile "ancestor".

In the same way, there was a type of ape that lived a long time ago, and over time, it evolved in the same way as the cars. Some of these apes evolved to be gorillas, others evolved to be chimps, and others evolved to be Humans.

boboChristian333 · Jan 25, 2007

Yeah, but cars arent living things.

Dannager · Jan 25, 2007

boboChristian333 said:
Yeah, but cars arent living things.

The analogy does not require that they are. It does not deal with the processes, but with the hierarchies.

JosephKerr · Jan 25, 2007

Well you only have to accept micro evolution for the car analogy to be apt.

Tiberius · Jan 25, 2007

There is no difference between micro-evolution and macro evolution. The differnece is merely that of time. Micro evolution is a change over a small length of time, macro evolution is a change over a long length of time. It all depends on how willing you are to wait.

Likewise, one can claim that micro aging is when we see a person get a day older, and macro aging is when they get a decade older. There's no difference in the process, it is how long you want to wait.

pyro214 · Jan 26, 2007

Tiberius said:
There is no difference between micro-evolution and macro evolution. The differnece is merely that of time. Micro evolution is a change over a small length of time, macro evolution is a change over a long length of time. It all depends on how willing you are to wait.

Likewise, one can claim that micro aging is when we see a person get a day older, and macro aging is when they get a decade older. There's no difference in the process, it is how long you want to wait.

if macroevolution and microevolution are the same thing, just a diffence in time. Then how were organs made from small singular unspecialized cells?

pantsman52 · Jan 26, 2007

pyro214 said:
if macroevolution and microevolution are the same thing, just a diffence in time. Then how were organs made from small singular unspecialized cells?

Through minute changes in genetic code adding up over millions of years?

Morcova · Jan 26, 2007

tergail said:
I will have to regretfully decline your invitation for a debate. I have been involved in one too many and choose not to do it anymore. There is too much anger that comes with it from others. (not that I am saying you are angry but it never fails that there will be one or more who cannot have a friendly debate.) My only reason for posting here was to advise bobochristian to be ready to stand behind his statements. I don't want to see him attacked the way he has been already with no defense to stand up to it.

Asking you to back up your comments isn't debate.

Why do you choose to not back up your comments?

Morcova · Jan 26, 2007

tergail said:
My goodness did I hit a nerve or what?
NO I don't like to debate because of exactly what you people are doing here right now. You are checking out all my other posts and for what reason? I'm not going around seeing what other kind of posts all of you have made. It's NONE OF MY BUSINESS!!!! Just like what I do is none of yours.
We have different opinions on many different topics. I come on CHRISTIAN FORUMS to fellowship with other CHRISTIANS. I only, by a very big mistake happened to come across this thread and saw a young man making a statement that I'm sure with his youthful knowledge is in no position to match any of you in a debate. So I simply tried to give him a little bit of advice about debating this topic.
I have done my research and read many articles and listened to many scientists discuss this topic. I believe one way and you another - so be it. Let's leave it at that.
But please, answer one question - why do you come to a CHRISTIAN FORUM????

Translation:

I refuse to back up my opinions despite claiming I had proof.

And how DARE you atheist ask me to do so, this is a christian forum!

Morcova · Jan 26, 2007

boboChristian333 said:
You guys are right, I should have done my reserch before I came on here. So, I am sorry that I created such an arguement here when I originally came here just to find out about peoples ideas on evolution. And yes I am also sorry that I was taught wrong...my fault? Anyway I didnt mean to sound angry or mad when I posted this (actually I looked back and read what I posted yesterday and it sounds extremely imature), I was very tired, and I should have waited until the next day to post something, and not make it sound so childish. So, once again, I am very sorry.

What've you've done right here shows much character. Coming to a thread that you could have easily avoided just to apologize and say you were wrong.

You sir, are more of a man that most men twice your age.

You aren't responsible for the education you have recieved. The important thing to do now that you know your wrong is to find out why.

Good luck.

Tiberius · Jan 26, 2007

pyro214 said:
if macroevolution and microevolution are the same thing, just a diffence in time. Then how were organs made from small singular unspecialized cells?

Different basic organisms can work together to form a cooperative group, such as the four different polyps that for the Portuguese Man o' War.

You may also be interested in reading this article about the Evolution of multicellularity.

Lisa0315 · Jan 26, 2007

Dannager said:
I hate to burst your bubble, but Ed Vidence isn't an atheist. He's a Christian, and a gap theory believer.

Are you sure? His profile doesn't say one way or the other, and I gathered that he was an atheist by his post. What is gap theory anyway?

Lisa

JosephKerr · Jan 26, 2007

Tiberius said:
There is no difference between micro-evolution and macro evolution. The differnece is merely that of time. Micro evolution is a change over a small length of time, macro evolution is a change over a long length of time. It all depends on how willing you are to wait.

Likewise, one can claim that micro aging is when we see a person get a day older, and macro aging is when they get a decade older. There's no difference in the process, it is how long you want to wait.

All I meant was that some Christians accept micro but not macro. With the car analogy it becomes evident that they are the same.

Tiberius · Jan 26, 2007

Sorry, it sounded like you were treating micro evolution and macro evolution as the same.

Technically, there's no such thing as micro evolution and macro volution. There's just evolution.

MrGoodBytes · Jan 26, 2007

boboChristian333 said:
You guys are right, I should have done my reserch before I came on here. So, I am sorry that I created such an arguement here when I originally came here just to find out about peoples ideas on evolution. And yes I am also sorry that I was taught wrong...my fault? Anyway I didnt mean to sound angry or mad when I posted this (actually I looked back and read what I posted yesterday and it sounds extremely imature), I was very tired, and I should have waited until the next day to post something, and not make it sound so childish. So, once again, I am very sorry.

What's with all the honest, mature creationists lately?

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