Beliefs That Are Difficult To Convey

[SpiritPsalmist]

As a Charasmatic/Penticostal/Word of Faith Christian, what belief(s) do you hold to that seems to be the most difficult for you to convey to other Christians, either personally and/or on the forums, who do not believe the same way?

 

[AlabamaMan]

ewwwww good question, I will have to think on this and get back to you. My brain is perplexed!!

 

[HomeBound]

Reincarnation, and I believe some people who have had near death experiences did visit Heaven.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Reincarnation, and I believe some people who have had near death experiences did visit Heaven.

HomeBound,

You believe in reincarnation? I don't know of any Charasmatic/Penticostal/Word of Faith groups that teach reincarnation.

What do you think about Heb 9:27 "And it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,"?

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

As a Charasmatic/Penticostal/Word of Faith Christian, what belief(s) do you hold to that seems to be the most difficult for you to convey to other Christians, either personally and/or on the forums, who do not believe the same way?

I think the most difficult subject I have tried to convey on here is healing. No matter how well I think I explain it, someone seems to get the idea that I'm telling them they are not faithful enough to Jesus. It's very frustrating.

 

[HomeBound]

I think the most difficult subject I have tried to convey on here is healing. No matter how well I think I explain it, someone seems to get the idea that I'm telling them they are not faithful enough to Jesus. It's very frustrating.

How is healing difficult to explain?

as for the previous post, a man dies, is judged according to the life he's lead, and based on that judgement, he either stays with God, or goes back, or goes elsewhere.

 

[BigToe]

I've never ever heard a Christian say they believed in reincarnation before. hmmph you learn something new every day.

I think the hardest thing for people to understand is what true trust in God is and why we should expect miracles and wonders from God. That and why God allows pain to exist.

 

[Andrew]

Wow, so many things Quaffer!

• that healing and prosperity are part of the redemptive work of Christ. ie the "health & wealth (derog) gospel" with been accused of preaching. *L
• how very righteous a Christian is.
• that God wants us to live long.
• that we are "little gods".
• OSAS.
• Speaking in tongues....

as for the previous post, a man dies, is judged according to the life he's lead, and based on that judgement, he either stays with God, or goes back, or goes elsewhere.

That isnt reincarnation. Reincarnation means you are born again into the next life either as a higher being (if you've been good your previous life) or a lower being (if you've been naughty). eg from human to a dog if you've been mean to dogs. Or from a good human to a more holy human until you attain nirvana or something like that.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

How is healing difficult to explain?

I guess I really have not had a difficult time of explaining but it's been difficult for some others to understand. People seem to get offended easily. . .not understanding that faith and/or the lack thereof has a lot to do with it. There's spiritual warfare involved a lot of the time and people tend to think you're telling them they are too weak of a christian. It took me a long time to understand it too. . .and I'm glad I kept after it.

as for the previous post, a man dies, is judged according to the life he's lead, and based on that judgement, he either stays with God, or goes back, or goes elsewhere.

Hmmmm! I was under the impression that "once" meant once. I'd like to discuss this with you further but not here. . .PM maybe?. . .would that be OK with you?

 

[victoryword]

Hi, I'm new to this forum but so far this looks like a nice safe place for the discussion of Charismatic and Word-Faith issues.

I really like Qaffer's question. I think I find the most difficult and frustrating doctrine to explain to people is the "Jesus Died Spiritually" doctrine. Outside of the "little gods" teaching, this seems to draw the most flak from WoF critics.

I don't support all aspects of the teaching as taught in WoF circles (i.e. Jesus took on Satan's nature, Jesus was dragged to hell by demons and tortured,etc.) but I do believe Jesus experienced a seperation between Himself and the Father when He became sin for us (Matthew 27:45; 2 Cor. 5:21) and many other aspects of this teaching. I think the biggest difficulty I have is trying to convince opponents of this teaching that it was not something that orginated in Word-Faith circles (and in the writings of Kenyon). However, people often turn a blind eye to any proof that you give them.

Overcoming the false misrepresentations is the biggest obstacle. I have a hard time convincing people that the cross is important in WoF circles but that we do not limit the redemptive work to the cross alone. Scripture strongly emphasizes the importance of the RESSURECTION as well. I also have a difficult time convincing people that Faith Teachers indeed believe in the blood redemption. Anyway, I wrote nearly a whole apologetical online book on this subject which is on my webpage.

"The little gods" and certain statements such as us being "equal to God" (Copeland once taught this) can be very easily misunderstood and cause unnecessary controversy. More on that at another time.

 

[victoryword]

Reincarnation, and I believe some people who have had near death experiences did visit Heaven.

Homebound

I consider myself to be Charismatic and Word-Faith but you would have a difficult time convincing me of reincarnation. I find absolutely nothing in Scripture that supports such a concept. Luke 16, the story of the rich man and Lazarus and also as another poster mentioned, Hebrews 9:27 both seem to be opposed to this concept.

Could you explain your belief from Scripture?

 

[kp_online]

I think Homebound means that there are miracles or events where there are people that happen to die but then are "brought back to life" so to speak through God's grace/mercy/healing. The part I have a hard part of understanding is the part where he says "or goes elsewhere".
Do you mean hell?

 

[victoryword]

I think Homebound means that there are miracles or events where there are people that happen to die but then are "brought back to life" so to speak through God's grace/mercy/healing. The part I have a hard part of understanding is the part where he says "or goes elsewhere".
Do you mean hell?

Hhhhhhmmmm. Perhaps a better word would be RESSURECTION vice REINCARNATION. Reincarnation implies someone's body dying and their spirit inhabits another body (another human, a fish, a goat, etc.). This is a prevalent teaching among New Agers, Hindus, and I think some sects of BUddhism.

Ressurection on the other hand is simply God doing what He did for Lazarus in John 11 and in other places in Scripture. Unfortunately, I still cannot find resurrection in this life to be a Biblical promise like divine healing, forgiveness, and other guaranteed blessings that are appropriated by faith. I do believe that if the church spent more time in prayer we would see more people being raised from the dead but I just have a hard time seeing it as one of those promises we could claim as a right. But again, I believe that a praying church would see more miracles of dead being raised in this era.

On the other hand, I suppose Matthew 10:1-2 and Luke 9 could be construed as Biblical promises that guarantee the raising of the dead. What do you guys think?

 

[A Brethren IN CHRIST]

If you can't have verses in the Bible that make that feeling strong all it is is a feeling not fact

For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body being many, are one body: so also thee Christ

 

[Andrew]

...but I do believe Jesus experienced a seperation between Himself and the Father when He became sin for us

Yes that has been taught many times by my Pastor in church too (we are non-denom charismatic).

There was only one time Jesus referred to his Father as God, and that was at the cross, when his Father turned his back on his Son. Jesus cried out "My God my God, why has though forsaken me?" This is the only time Jesus called his Father God, SO THAT YOU AND I CAN CALL HIM ABBA FATHER today!!! This is one of the divine exchanges that took place at the cross!

Also, what caused Jesus so much suffering was not so much the physical toture and abuse, but becoming sin itself, AND being separated from his Father, losing that Father-Son relationship.

There is so much that Jesus died to give us, and we are only scratching the surface! Praise God!

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

If you can't have verses in the Bible that make that feeling strong all it is is a feeling not fact

For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body being many, are one body: so also thee Christ

What feeling are you referring to Brethren?

 

[afnospam]

Sad to say but it's basic Christian doctrine along these lines:
1) Christ life, death, and resurrection are fact and are the basis for the Christian faith and are necessary of redemption
2) God has conveyed a basis of conduct
3) The Bible is true, accurate, and still timely presentation of God's communication and plan for mankind offering hope, love, and warning/punishment.
We have too many departing from ancient beliefs and creeds, forming their own gospel, and deceiving many. With many who are in mainline churches, it's difficult to see agreement on the above, especially with young people. My personal observation is that 1 Cornithins 2:10 is a missing link in all of it.

 

[Auntie]

"The little gods" and certain statements such as us being "equal to God" (Copeland once taught this) can be very easily misunderstood and cause unnecessary controversy.

I didn't realize that Charasmatic/Penticostal/Word of Faith Christians believed this. Is there a thread somewhere that explains this belief?

 

[afnospam]

Gospel.com has a good overview. See http://www.gospelcom.net/apologeticsindex/w00.html

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[B4Eddie]

How is healing difficult to explain?

as for the previous post, a man dies, is judged according to the life he's lead, and based on that judgement, he either stays with God, or goes back, or goes elsewhere.

I presume you are referring to those who were resurrected by Jesus, OT prophets, and the saints who were resurrected when Jesus died. Please clarify that you don't mean reincarnation in the same sense as Hinduism!