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<blockquote data-quote="Freodin" data-source="post: 56101516" data-attributes="member: 1363"><p>So let´s see....</p><p></p><p>So what does the definition say?</p><p>"a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings."</p><p>That´s what I said, isn´t it? I proclaimed my disbelief in the existence of the supreme being called "God". I could have used "deities" instead... the meaning would be the same.</p><p></p><p>What about agnostics. The quote I gave as reference regarding my position on agnosticism says:</p><p></p><p>The definition from "your" website - meaning, the website that you quoted as your souce: "An agnostic is one who believes it impossible to know anything about God..." A narrower definition, but close and not contradicting.</p><p></p><p>These are the definitions <em>I</em> use, have always used in this thread and in all other threads where I commented on that question, and that I have never denied using.</p><p></p><p>So what are other definitions that we find posted here?</p><p>For example the one posted by Jacks: </p><p></p><p>Atheists know that God doesn´t exist? Where does dictionary.com mention that?</p><p></p><p>Or the one that made me start that thread.</p><p></p><p>Atheists must be certain that God does not exist in order to be called Atheists, else they would be Agnostics?</p><p>Hm, I deny the existence of God. That is what dictionary.com says Atheists do. I doubt the possibility of knowledge, positive or negative, about God. This is what dictionary.com says Agnostics do. I do both without having to decide for one or the other, and I still stay within the given definitions.</p><p></p><p>So I´d say it isn´t me who uses the "wrong" or "liquid" or "dishonest" definitions. It is Christians making statements about my position. </p><p></p><p>And I don´t call them dishonest or assert that they are playing games or arguing for arguings sake... I ask them why they do that. I deliberately invited Jig, who made the post quoted in the OP to this thread... and I must say that I am quite disappointed with his "explanation".</p><p></p><p>So here I am, following your script... and still I get accused of "playing games" and "being dishonest". Can you for once get rid of your preconceived ideas about Atheists and just talk with me?</p><p></p><p></p><p>Loaded question? </p><p>I asked why Christians - add the relativating "some" if you like - change the definition - and I have just shown that they do. </p><p></p><p></p><p>As I have shown above, it is not me who uses different definitions. </p><p></p><p></p><p>Oh my! Different connotations. "Your" as in "your post - that post you made." "Your dictionary - the dictionary you linked to".</p><p></p><p>As for the "standard ones"... even those can differ. For example the Oxford Dictionary I personally use has only "a person who does not believe in the existence of God or gods" as definition, without the need or mention of denial, as does Merriam-Webster: "one who believes that there is no deity ".</p><p></p><p></p><p>I see that the forum policy on that point seems to have changed, now considering the "unorthodox" Christians as Christians for posting requirements. That wasn´t always the case. Sorry that I am not up to date on a point that doesn´t touch me.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Freodin, post: 56101516, member: 1363"] So let´s see.... So what does the definition say? "a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings." That´s what I said, isn´t it? I proclaimed my disbelief in the existence of the supreme being called "God". I could have used "deities" instead... the meaning would be the same. What about agnostics. The quote I gave as reference regarding my position on agnosticism says: The definition from "your" website - meaning, the website that you quoted as your souce: "An agnostic is one who believes it impossible to know anything about God..." A narrower definition, but close and not contradicting. These are the definitions [i]I[/i] use, have always used in this thread and in all other threads where I commented on that question, and that I have never denied using. So what are other definitions that we find posted here? For example the one posted by Jacks: Atheists know that God doesn´t exist? Where does dictionary.com mention that? Or the one that made me start that thread. Atheists must be certain that God does not exist in order to be called Atheists, else they would be Agnostics? Hm, I deny the existence of God. That is what dictionary.com says Atheists do. I doubt the possibility of knowledge, positive or negative, about God. This is what dictionary.com says Agnostics do. I do both without having to decide for one or the other, and I still stay within the given definitions. So I´d say it isn´t me who uses the "wrong" or "liquid" or "dishonest" definitions. It is Christians making statements about my position. And I don´t call them dishonest or assert that they are playing games or arguing for arguings sake... I ask them why they do that. I deliberately invited Jig, who made the post quoted in the OP to this thread... and I must say that I am quite disappointed with his "explanation". So here I am, following your script... and still I get accused of "playing games" and "being dishonest". Can you for once get rid of your preconceived ideas about Atheists and just talk with me? Loaded question? I asked why Christians - add the relativating "some" if you like - change the definition - and I have just shown that they do. As I have shown above, it is not me who uses different definitions. Oh my! Different connotations. "Your" as in "your post - that post you made." "Your dictionary - the dictionary you linked to". As for the "standard ones"... even those can differ. For example the Oxford Dictionary I personally use has only "a person who does not believe in the existence of God or gods" as definition, without the need or mention of denial, as does Merriam-Webster: "one who believes that there is no deity ". I see that the forum policy on that point seems to have changed, now considering the "unorthodox" Christians as Christians for posting requirements. That wasn´t always the case. Sorry that I am not up to date on a point that doesn´t touch me. [/QUOTE]
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