Are non-Christian friends sinful? (PLEASE HELP!)

[Windmill]

[bible]2 Corinthians 6:14-17[/bible]

I have recently rubbished the usage of this verse in the context of marriage. However, if it is indeed saying what it says, it is referring to... a lot. Any sort of relationship. Business relations, friendship relations...

I am scared. I am terrified. I have been crying now for so long. My friends, my dear friends. I don't have Christian friends. They are all Non-Believers. Yet, they stick to the morals of good Christians. No swearing, no stealing, no alcohol, no drugs, no sex before marriage. No lying. No cheating. They have taught me about God, and I have (I hope) taught them too. I am the only Christian amoungst them. I voice my Christian thoughts regularly. At least, I believe so.

But now, the thought, this verse, it very likely means they must go. So much then in my life would change. These friends must go. Likely, school must go. Certain work hopes must go. This saddens me so much. What am to do? I have fought this over with God, and decided, if so, I will submit, if need be.

I have to make sure this is right though. If it is biblical, I will hurt my friends, and make a fool out of Christianity. Yet, if it is not biblical and I am sinning, I am breaking Gods law...

I love my friends so much. They have done so much for me. I will let them go if need be. It will require a lot of faith, a lot of hard work, but I will do it, with a heavy heart.

I need answers. Is it sinful? Can I be friends with them?

EDIT: I HAVE FOUND MY ANSWER!!! Thanks to all replies!!! Feel free to keep discussing!​

 

[NightEternal]

Wow, it's 2:00 a.m. where I am right now. What the heck am I doing on a chat forum at this ungodly hour? :o

Well, I was about to go to bed when I saw this post...

Hey there windmill. I'm new here so I haven't met you yet.

Hey, don't be sad. I don't see any reason why you should have to break all ties with your non-Christian friends at all. Jesus hung out with the worst reprobates of His time and even went to thier parties! You cannot witness to them if you aren't around them, right?

You are definitely an exception windmill. You're doing good! Most Adventists have no non-Adventist friends or even aquaintances! That is a major problem. God didn't mean for us to exist in a Christian bubble with no contact or interaction with non-believers. We are to be in the world but not of it. As long as you aren't allowing them to influence you negatively, you will be fine and NO you are not sinning by associating with them. You seem like a strong, level-headed girl, so no worries.

As for marriage or going into business, I would definitely discourage involvment with non-believers in these areas (there have been exceptions to the rule, but not many!) Too many girls and women think they can change the guy after marriage, but that rarely ever happens. In fact, I can count the times I have seen it happen successfully.

But I don't think friendship with them is a problem at all. Hang out, have fun and stay solid in the faith. Let your light shine!

Try to not be so hard on yourself, alright?

Take care. I'm going to bed before I end up face down on my keyboard.

Soooooooo tired.......

 

[Windmill]

Heh. 2am? Yeah, you must be tired! but thank you for your advise!

I AM an exception! Heh, I am the only Christian in all of my classes. In my school, a total of 2 adventists go in a population of 1,500 kids!

I am in the extension class, so as I'm sure you can guess, a lot are athiest, some are agnostic. Teachers are shocked to meet me. I'm supposed to be smart and smart people don't believe in God! But yet I do. I so do. He is there.

You see... though what you say makes so much sense...! It makes so much sense, so much logical sense. Yet, yet, what about this verse? What does the verse I quoted mean? What does it mean?

 

[DarylFawcett]

Hi Windmill,

As long as they are not influencing you and pulling you away from God, which obviously isn't the case, then you are doing what God wants you to do, being both a friend and a witness for Jesus Christ.

Keep up the good work!!!!!

 

[woobadooba]

Heh. 2am? Yeah, you must be tired! but thank you for your advise!

I AM an exception! Heh, I am the only Christian in all of my classes. In my school, a total of 2 adventists go in a population of 1,500 kids!

I am in the extension class, so as I'm sure you can guess, a lot are atheist, some are agnostic. Teachers are shocked to meet me. I'm supposed to be smart and smart people don't believe in God! But yet I do. I so do. He is there.

You see... though what you say makes so much sense...! It makes so much sense, so much logical sense. Yet, yet, what about this verse? What does the verse I quoted mean? What does it mean?

This is one of the dilemmas that a Christian faces: the idea that we should go out to all the world, but separate ourselves from those who are worldly. On the surface it appears that such an idea is not consistent with itself. However, when one comes to understand what Paul really means here it becomes obvious that there is no inconsistency with such an idea.

So what was Paul referring to?

Paul is referring to intimate relationships here. In other words, relationships where one person bonds with another person.

This, of course, can apply to several types of relationships.

As it applies to marriage, it isn't wise to foster such a relationship because:

a. it fosters a sense of division within the home
b. it has the potential to lead the believer down the wrong path (just look at what happened to Solomon).
c. it creates confusion for the children that may become a part of that relationship (Mom says believe this, but Daddy says believe something other than what Mommy says.). What usually happens in this kind of relationship is that parents agree to allow the child to figure it out for himself, so as to avoid tension between each other. In most cases the child grows to believe in something that is really contrary to what God would have that person to believe.

As it applies to business partnerships, it isn't wise because it could cause the believer to compromise his ethics by allowing unethical business practices to excel the business to a more successful level. In such a case as this a believer may allow the business to take precedence over God. Hence this is another form of idolatry.

However, if a business partner strongly supports higher ethics, but doesn't believe in God, that doesn't necessarily constitute that one is sinning against God by enetering into a business agreement with that person. On the other hand, if at any point that person shows himself to be one who is doing things that are unethical in order to make the business grow, such as selling a product, or providing a service that is contrary to God's will, then it would be wise to avoid/terminate such a relationship.

As it applies to basic relations, such as friendship, Paul is also alluding to the idea that we ought to be careful about who we associate with. If those who we are seeking to befriend are encouraging us to do things that are immoral then we should not be friends with such people.

Just keep in mind that you can still be friends with those who don't believe in God while still believing in God. You just have to be careful that you don't allow them to influence you to side with them on the issue of the origin of life, or allow them to influence you to do things that are sinful. But if these people are known to use drugs, cuss, smoke, etc..., it would be wise for you to stay away from them except to be a witness to them, as was Jesus a witness to those who did such things. He didn't become one with them, but He always reached out to them in love.

What it all comes down to is that you have to take caution in who you bond with. In other words, you can socialize with unbelievers; but you have to be careful that you don't become one with them.

By the way, people that believe in God are highly intelligent, even more so than those that don't. The debate of Theism Vs. Atheism has more to do with common sense than it does with a debatable issue. If those who don't believe in God would look at things properly they would find that they really don't have an argument that withstands the logic behind believing in God. This is where the discipline of Apologetics comes in handy

 

[Loveaboveall]

I would 2nd woobadooba. I do believe very strongly that this applies to a marriage relationship and you SHOULDN'T toss it to the side as garbage. Think about it, if you are ready to leave your friends how than could you ever find one to marry who wasn't of the same beliefs as you if you could not be friends with them?

The Israelites are a great example for us to go back and learn from their mistakes. God tells them in Exodus 19 "And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These [are] the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel." They were to show the world who God was, to be a light on a hill. This does not mean they were not to associate with them but God did warn them not to intermarry and certainly not to adopt their practices, but that is exactly what they did. This was Solomon's big problem. He liked women and those women led him to worship their gods.

How can we learn from them? God tell us in 1 Peter that we are also to be a "Priests" to the world so that they might be converted. Friendship evangelism is one of the best types of evangelism. But, we must not "bond" (as woobadooba says) ourselves with those who do not care to hear about Jesus and influence us to do things that are contrary to God's character.

You may have some friends now that you should give up. I know I did when I was your age. But, there might also be some who you could be a "light" to and God could work through you to bring them to Him. Isn't that an awesome thought!

I work everyday with people, many types of people, and I ask God everyday to be a "light" to each one of them through me. But, I don't go out drinking with those who ask, I don't go to parties that I am invited to. I do try to be a example of Christ to them and there are some who I be-friend and "bond" with and we can study much deeper about who God is and what He tells us in the bible.

Take some time and pray to God that He will show you who He wants you to "hang" with and who of your friends you should distance yourself from. You can't go wrong by seeking God.

 

[NightEternal]

Hey, great summation woobadooba. You saved me a lot of typing time!

I don't go to parties that I am invited to.

I think this is a personal judgment call every Christian has to make. I would definitely discourage someone who is new, immature or weak in the faith from attending a non-believer's party, as they might be easily influenced or swayed negatively. I think we should also be fair in pointing out that not every non-believer's get together deteriorates into an orgy of drug use, liquor and debauchery.

Personally, I have many contacts who are still involved in that sort of lifestyle, as I was in a rock band for a few years. There are times when I refuse thier invitations to a party, other times I accept. I have had some extremely interesting theological conversations with some of them, even if they did take place in a cloud of thier cigarette smoke and thier colorful language.

Bottom line is I know when it is time to leave, as staying in a negative moral atmosphere for too long is almost oppressive to the sensitive spiritual nature of the Christian.

So, it's totally fine if a Christian wants to avoid all of the social gatherings of the Gentiles. But I also think many good oppourtunities are lost if one does.

And I know my friends. If I declined all of thier invitations wholesale, they would be offended and assume that I think I am too good for them or morally superior, which is the kiss of death when trying to witness to anyone in the world.

 

[Jimlarmore]

At your age friends can be very influencial in your life. I would say that If they are not influencing you to do things that are against your beliefs then it is ok. We are to let our light so shine among others, this is our great commission, to take the gospel to the world where the majority are non-believers.

Don't beat yourself up over this my friend, you did the right thing to come and ask us but the one you need to ask the most is your Savior and creator. He will guide you if you let Him.

God Bless you
Jim Larmore

 

[Windmill]

The marriage issue, while it isn't totally relevant to my situation (I don't really care if I can't get married to non-believers) I do have good reasons for thinking what I do on that issue.

Simple fact is that Paul a-OKed it.

[bible]1 Corinthians 7:12-15[/bible]

While one could argue this was simply referring to those already married by the time of their conversion, it would make no sense. Because, right after this, Paul goes on to compare the marriage to say, being uncircumcised. What this, IMO, shows is that the marriage isn't sinful at all, nor, like being circumcised, is it wrong to not be married.

Regardless, this would mean hence that you would be unequally yoked if that verse was true. For the verse does not say do not become unequally yoked but rather do not be unequally yoked.

This would then mean that if you are in a situation where you are unequally yoked (including marriage) that it says to not be and it does not back up its statement. Thats a clear contradiction.

I don't know what this verse means, and I am searching, but I do not think it can mean marriage.

 

[woobadooba]

The marriage issue, while it isn't totally relevant to my situation (I don't really care if I can't get married to non-believers) I do have good reasons for thinking what I do on that issue.

Simple fact is that Paul a-OKed it.

1 Corinthians 7:12-15

While one could argue this was simply referring to those already married by the time of their conversion, it would make no sense. Because, right after this, Paul goes on to compare the marriage to say, being uncircumcised. What this, IMO, shows is that the marriage isn't sinful at all, nor, like being circumcised, is it wrong to not be married.

Regardless, this would mean hence that you would be unequally yoked if that verse was true. For the verse does not say do not become unequally yoked but rather do not be unequally yoked.

This would then mean that if you are in a situation where you are unequally yoked (including marriage) that it says to not be and it does not back up its statement. Thats a clear contradiction.

I don't know what this verse means, and I am searching, but I do not think it can mean marriage.

Let's suppose that you and a friend are going to meet up with another friend that you are angry with. We'll call the friend that you are angry with Betsy. If the friend that you are currently with says to you, "Now be sure to be nice to Betsy", does that mean you're already being mean to Betsy? Not necessarily. For, you may have just gotten news about something that you weren't aware of when you were last with Betsy, which has caused you to become angry with her. In this sense it isn't possible for you to not be nice to Betsy without having met up with her yet. After all, your friend was speaking within the context of telling you that you ought not to be mean to Betsy when you meet up with her.

Likewise, one could say don't be unequally yoked together with unbelievers and still be referring to a believer that
is not currently married to, or in a relationship with an unbeliever. Thus 'be' can be used within the context of a command, without indefinitely referring to a current state of being, or in this case, an already established relationship. Hence 'be' and 'become' can be interchangeable terms which denote the same meaning when used within the same context.

On the other hand, it wouldn't be difficult to conclude that since Paul was speaking of relations in general, as I had pointed out in my previous post, he very easily could have used 'be' within the context of informing those who might have been involved in a relationship of some sort with an unbeliever, but not necessarily a marriage per se. In other words, it could have been a social acquaintance, or a business partner.

With that said, both contexts (marriage and relationships in general) could fit the thought, "do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers", without posing a contradictory conclusion.

And as for your belief that Paul had said that it is OK to marry unbelievers, this simply isn't true. He never said that. What he had said was, "If any brother has a wife who does not believe, and she is pleased to dwell with him, do not let him put her away." This passage is obviously referring to people that are already married, because:

a. "has a wife" describes a current state of being.
b. there would be no sense in talking about putting her away if Paul was speaking of those who were not yet married. The expression "put away", as used within this context, was the same thing as saying 'divorce'. Hence 'put away' was an idiomatic expression that denoted the idea of 'divorcing'.

I hope this clears things up for you.

 

[TrustAndObey]

Windmill, I think it's so wonderful that you worry about pleasing God at such a young age.

At 16.....wow, that's when my friends went WILD (including myself). Peer pressure is a big deal when you're in the middle of it, that's for sure.

In my older years, I can tell you that my best friend is one of those people that goes to church for special occasions and believes in God, but she doesn't really want to have to "do" anything that declares her love for Him.

I just try to be a good example and love her like He does. She's an extremely wonderful person, but she doesn't really have faith...lives with her boyfriend...etc etc.

My best ONLINE friend is the opposite.

I love them both the same.

I pray for them both the same.

We can't turn our backs on the sinners, because that's not what Christ did. He wouldn't have let them influence Him either though.

Ask your friends to spend the night, go to church with you, etc. Be a good example to them and love them!

 

[inmercysgrasp]

I was thinking of this today. Jesus was called what? "A friend of sinners". Yet never did Jesus compromise the truth did He? He stayed firm to what was true, yet He treated others with acceptance, love,kindness,mercy, and forgiveness.
Maybe it's about staying true to our God, hence loving Him most, yet showing that love that is in our hearts to others by how we act, what we say, and even what we do.
You might politly decline going to a rock concert, because you don't believe it is something God would want. But maybe other opportunities will present themseves wherein you can show love in ways that don't compromise what you believe. I hope that makes sense.

 

[Dathen]

I know you've figured out your answer, but here's my answer!!!!

You need friends. All of my friends (except my best friend) not only arn't christians. alot of them hate chrisitnas. Now my point is, is not that the mission field???? You're out building friendships and can weave salvation in there.

If you be friend, and kind to people, they may ask, why are you so nice???? I see having non chrisitan friends as doing the work the rest of the Bible tells you to.

I've always seen that text relating to marriage only.....

You could also think, though, not only non-christian friends, non Adventist friends......If you truly believe this is God's church even other denomination Chrisitians are the missionfield... Just my opinion

Sorry for typos I'm in a rush