Are Messianic's Protestant?

[JM]

I keep hearing people say that if you're not catholic (and your Christian) then you must have had the roots of your church in the cahtolic church, therefore you're protestant...I deny this. What/how do you feel?

SP

 

[Henaynei]

If a denomination keeps the catholic ordnances such as Christmas, Easter and Sunday as the Sabbath and yet is not Catholic, then it is still a daughter of Catholicism, i.e. Protestant. This is neither a good or bad thing, just a true thing.

Messianic Judaism, in it's truest form, is neither Catholic nor Protestant It is Judaism that recognizes Yeshua as HaShem and Messiah

 

[The Thadman]

I think that it depends on your POV.

I personally protest the RCC.

Therefore, that'd make me a CCP.

At least as far as I can see.

Praise be to God!
-Steve-o

PS: This poetic interlude brought to you by Psalm 96:1.

PPS: POV = Point of view. RCC = Roman Catholic Church. CCP = Card Carrying Protestant.

 

[mjterry87]

Well, after I found out how the Catholic church [and non-biblical practices influenced] Christanity, and how every other mainstream Christian church comes from it, I started to follow Messianic Judasim.


Anyways on another note, Messianic Judasim is a form of Judasim, not Christanity.

{moderator edit}

 

[JM]

If a denomination keeps the catholic ordnances such as Christmas, Easter and Sunday as the Sabbath and yet is not Catholic, then it is still a daughter of Catholicism, i.e. Protestant. This is neither a good or bad thing, just a true thing.

Messianic Judaism, in it's truest form, is neither Catholic nor Protestant It is Judaism that recognizes Yeshua as HaShem and Messiah

My church doesn't teach or promote Christmas, Easter or Sunday over the Sabbath as a time to worship. We gather on Sunday but we also gather 3 or 4 other days during the week. Some in my church have Christmas, etc.

 

[Henaynei]

My church doesn't teach or promote Christmas, Easter or Sunday over the Sabbath as a time to worship. We gather on Sunday but we also gather 3 or 4 other days during the week. Some in my church have Christmas, etc.

Well, since this is the Messianic Judaism forum I really wasn't discussing *your* church (which is forbidden by our forum rules ) but rather answering your question about Messianic Judaism. If a congregation adheres to the any of the doctrine and practices of the Catholic church, Catholic or not, then they are daughters, technically, of the Catholic church.

True Messianic Judaism is Judaism that believes and serves Yeshua as HaShem and Messiah, not exactly a form of Christianity. Belief in Yeshua was Jewish for quite some time before it was "Christian"

 

[ShirChadash]

True Messianic Judaism is Judaism that believes and serves Yeshua as HaShem and Messiah, not exactly a form of Christianity. Belief in Yeshua was Jewish for quite some time before it was "Christian"

And existed quite some long time as well, side-by-side with, but utterly unconnected to "orthodoxy" and hellenized Christianity.


BTW -- see my siggy below.
THAT ~~~> "True Messianic Judaism is Judaism that believes" <~~~ THAT is the faith of Yeshua.


Shalom

 

[ShirChadash]

CCP = Card Carrying Protestant.

Heh -- Steve-o I thought maybe CCP meant Catholic Church Protestor from your post LOL.

I was going to say that while I will personally protest orthodoxy and rome till the end of my days (having left my previously-lifelong adherance to the RCC behind at one point in my own faith-life, so I suppose that makes ME a protestant ). I agree with Henny, however, that true Messianic JUDAISM isn't protestant nor catholic-based, whatsoever. I'm not into practicing Messianic Gentilism, but I am seeking to learn Messianic Judaism.

When Judaism becomes an offshoot of Catholicism, I'll believe that true Messianic Judaism is Protestant. The fact is, Jewish believers existed long before, and alongside, but OUTSIDE, orthodoxy/catholicism for centuries. And I highly doubt that Jewish belief in Yeshua was ever completely eradicated in the world -- highly doubt it. I know for a fact that when I reasearched this years ago at the campus library at Va Tech, I had info in hand regarding a number of eastern European pocket-communities in which Messianic (believing Jews) lived among, intermarried with, worshipped alongside and were in complete communion with non-believing Jews, and existed this way until into and through the "reformation" period at least. I've never managed to find this exact information online in my many many exhaustive searches... but I know what I read.

 

[Sephania]

According to Catholic (RCC) doctrine, anyone outside of the RCC and says that they believe in Jesus is a Protest-ant. With that definition I would say that MJ is a Super Protest-ant as we protest the "one true church" as well as those that broke off but kept the Mothers anti-semitismic thoughts as well as some "nations practices". We also protest the Judaism of today ( post Bet Ha-Mikdash) , in that we do not believe that your sacrifice and worship now is now surplanted by prayer, Torah study and 'gemilut hesed'. While all these things are tov, they do not replace teshuvah and atonement.

 

[JM]

Well, since this is the Messianic Judaism forum I really wasn't discussing *your* church (which is forbidden by our forum rules

) but rather answering your question about Messianic Judaism.

I posted the samething (stating that the rules forbid it) and was given a warning for not allowing fellowship posts. It was explained that any believers could post in any of the forums as long as it wasn't a debate. That was warning was given by one mod, then restated by another mod.

Thanks,

SP

 

[Henaynei]

I posted the samething (stating that the rules forbid it) and was given a warning for not allowing fellowship posts. It was explained that any believers could post in any of the forums as long as it wasn't a debate. That was warning was given by one mod, then restated by another mod.

Thanks,

SP

Shalom StreetPreacher,

Actually, several fora have forum specific rules in addition to the general CF rules, our's is one. These rules were made by and/or approved by Erwin.

You, as yet, have violated no rules in this forum

Here is the link to our forum rules so that you can be an informed poster

b'Shalom
Henaynei
Moderator

 

[sojeru]

Quote from Henny

It is Judaism that recognizes Yeshua as HaShem and Messiah

Yet it seems that it adherents do not recognize those that practice like the Orthodox Jews and believe like them- but hold belief in Yeshuah as Messiah.

 

[@@Paul@@]

If a denomination keeps the catholic ordnances such as Christmas, Easter and Sunday as the Sabbath and yet is not Catholic, then it is still a daughter of Catholicism, i.e. Protestant. This is neither a good or bad thing, just a true thing.

Here's an odd question. Are Christmas and Easter really seen as 'Catholicism' vs Pagan by MJ's???

I always thought both "holidays" had roots in ancient Babylon (which is well before the RCC)...

Just wondering.. (hopefully i didn't break any rules)

 

[Iollain]

When I think of the history of CHristmas and Easter, i think of pagans adding Yeshua to their holidays, and changing them a little bit

 

[Henaynei]

Here's an odd question. Are Christmas and Easter really seen as 'Catholicism' vs Pagan by MJ's???

No, not specifically. However, the OP was about what differientated those expressions of "Christianity" as independant of the Catholic church. My reply was in no way intended as judgment, either pro or con, just a statement of some of the practices that might qualify

I always thought both "holidays" had roots in ancient Babylon (which is well before the RCC)...

indeed, I do believe you are quite right

 

[@@Paul@@]

No, not specifically. However, the OP was about what differientated those expressions of "Christianity" as independant of the Catholic church. My reply was in no way intended as judgment, either pro or con, just a statement of some of the practices that might qualify

indeed, I do believe you are quite right

Thanks for the reply... I didn't think your post was judging (for OR against). I was reading a post about easter a few weeks ago (which of course denied the pagan roots) and was just wondering what you thought.

quite right, really?? I gonna print this one out.

 

[Ruhama]

I think those holidays are a somewhat intentional separation from the original Jewish holidays ordained by God BUT - Hanukkah is a holiday celebrated by Jews that wasn't in the Torah, and Jesus celebrated it, so I have no problem with the traditional Christian holidays as long as they are glorifying to God, and I seriously doubt he would frown on them.

 

[JM]

I think those holidays are a somewhat intentional separation from the original Jewish holidays ordained by God BUT - Hanukkah is a holiday celebrated by Jews that wasn't in the Torah, and Jesus celebrated it, so I have no problem with the traditional Christian holidays as long as they are glorifying to God, and I seriously doubt he would frown on them.

I was hoping someone would touch on that...

 

[shmuel]

John uses Chanukkah to date the occurrence of certain events, but there is nothing that says anything about Yeshua celebrating Chanukkah.

S

 

[Sephania]

Well two miracles were performed on that one day.