Are converts generally more devout than people raised in the same religion?

MichaelArchangelos said:

I was wondering, do any of you here have any direct experience of whether converts are more zealous and devout than people raised in the religion?

What have you experienced? Are most converts at your church/mosque/temple etc more devout than those who were raised in the religion? And also, how many of you have priests/pastors/ministers/imams/monks etc who are converts?

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Great and interesting questions.

Personally I think converts are more devout than the ones born in the specific Religion. IMO that is because it was their own choice to choose the particulat religion, they have maybe spent a lot of time reading about it and have come to the conviction that this religion is what they were missing in their life. It made them feel better, it made them feel happy, it made them change to the better.

I have met many people who have converted to Christianity. Somehow I don't know if you can call it like that. You know, most of them were born in Orthodox families, so officially they were Christians, but they never believed in God, and therefore lived their life according to their own desires and wishes, without any fear that someone will judge them for what they are doing. But after having read the Bible, they truly became Christians, they lives changed dramatically.

One of the greatest examples for that is a pastor from Romania, which I personally know and who is a good family friend, who had a high position in the country's government, who was taught all his life that God does not exist. But one day, around the age of 30 years he was asked to write a book refuting the Bible. So he took a Bible and read it. And he said one night, as he was in the library reading the Bible, he kneeled down and prayed to God. He said he could not deny God's existence anymore.

Well, this man lost his job, almost lost his life. He was sent into exile for two years somewhere in South America. He thought he'll never come back again. He said it was a miracle that he came back after two years and could see his wife and two kids again.

Since then he is one of the greatest pastors and evangelists in Romania. He is so knowledgeable, he is a genius in Bible history (he knows everything regarding this issue), speaks several languages, has two university degrees and is such a wise person. But besides that I also know him personally, he has been in my house many times, and he is such a simple and humble person. This man truly lives what he preaches!

I have two such acquaintances, converts to Catholicism and Islam, respectively. Both are vastly more zealous than the average "born" believer in either of these faiths, to the point where it becomes downright scary and/or ridiculous.

Personally, I think it's because they feel they have to prove something - to themselves, to the world, to the God they believe in, maybe to all of these at once.

For the born-and-raised believers, religion is already an integral part of their cultural identity, and not something that anybody would doubt or contest without reason. Converts, on the other hand, do not have this history. They must establish their new identity, and often do so with fanatic zeal, just to prove something.

I agree with the other posters. Converts are generally more "devout" than believers raised in a religion. However, therein lies your problem-your definition of "devout".

It can mean many things. To me, it means fanaticism and hardline fundamentalism, both of which I despise. I had a Christian friend at uni that converted to Christianity as an adult. Both his parents were non believers. And he was the final nail in the coffin of fundamentalism for me. He believed that anyone that lived without ever hearing of Jesus (eg, tribal people) would automatically go to Hell. No ifs or buts to him. And he became indignant when I questioned the fairness of this to him, angrily telling me:

"If God wants to raise up people on this earth who have no chance of going to Heaven, he is just to do so".

So disgusted I was with him and with fundamentalist Christianity, I finished off my friendship with him and any allegiance to fundamentalism. I also read, much to my absolute disgust, a poster in the Baptist section of CF, state that babies who die born to Christian parents would go to Heaven. Whilst babies who die born to unbelieving parents, would go to Hell. I seriously doubt that anyone with sick and twisted hardline fundamentalist beliefs like that got it from being raised in their religion. That smacks to me of a convert.

So when I see the word "devout", I have nothing but bad connotations associated with it.

Hmm.. you know, sometimes I feel that converts are often more devout, but the more I think about it, the more I don't feel that it is always true. I've definitely known fresh converts who were very zealous - sometimes taking that to a level that may not be so great (you know, insulting other religions and generally being obnoxious). I've always thought it was a mix of the excitement of something new, as well as perhaps for some feeling the need to prove something to themselves or others, as was mentioned.

On the other hand, many pagan traditions are filled with converts, and often they're not any more devout than others. I've also known others who convert and aren't overly devout (a few Christians and a Muslim). Soo.. guess it depends on the person.

For what it's worth:

I have found that former members of the Catholic Church were more anti-Catholic than atheists.

Kutte

When I converted to Catholicism I went out of my way to appear devout. I read at the Stations of the Cross, recited rosary before every mass, regularly went to confession and almost never read secular books, only works by saints, theologians, etc. I think that when a convert joins a faith that is overwhelmingly seens as a faith by birth (Catholic and Orthodox Christianity, Islam, Judaism, etc.) they feel like they have something to prove.

I think it depends on the individual, but from my experience, converts are more devout.

I was raised from birth as a Catholic, and was never particularly devout. My father was also born as a Catholic, and he knows next to nothing about Catholicism. He goes to church sometimes, though. My extended family is almost all Catholic, and none of them know much about their religion, or why they believe it, or anything like that. They just go to church once in a while. Some of them go every Sunday because they feel it's the right thing to do. I think it has to do with not having a point of reference to compare, because you've always been that religion.

I don't know many converts. One I know is very devout. The other was really devout for the first couple months and then abandoned it.

-Lyn

MichaelArchangelos said:

What have you experienced? Are most converts at your church/mosque/temple etc more devout than those who were raised in the religion? And also, how many of you have priests/pastors/ministers/imams/monks etc who are converts?

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Good question. I have no idea what the answer is, as most people in the Anglican church in the UK were born and bred into it, as I was. I explored many other churches and experienced many other ways of worship, but in the end I found my home was right here, where I was baptised.

I am not sure how I would distinguish the more devout among the congregation from those who are less so, to be honest.

I generally think converts are more devout. The reason, is because most people who were born into their religion, practice out of compulsion; because it is the norm for them. But many times they disagree with these practices and they do "sinful" things a lot more.

To the contrary, people who convert, do it because they truly feel in their hearts it is the truth. Therefore they try and follow up on the obligations of their religion, since they feel that it is the way of God. They also have a desire to learn about their religion, in my opinion, more than those who were born in the religion.

But of course it varies from individual to individual. Some converts don't take their conversion as seriously so they still do things that is against their religion. And, of course, many people who were born into their religion take their religion very seriously and practice upon their obligations just as much as a convert.

But, I think that most converts seems to take their religion more seriously than those born into that religion.

MichaelArchangelos said:

I was wondering, do any of you here have any direct experience of whether converts are more zealous and devout than people raised in the religion? Are most converts at your temple more devout than those who were raised in the religion? And also, how many of you have priests/pastors/ministers/imams/monks etc who are converts?

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I can only give you my experience and what I have seen in my circles. I am a convert to Judaism (orthodox) from christianity. Others tell me that I am making them into ba'al teshuvas (someone that returns to G-d). Of course, they are religious already but because of my zeal for HaShem - I push them further.

I know of several christian pastors along with some of their congregation members that have converted to Judaism. It is on my website. Just take a look at my profile for my website.

I think that converts tend to be more zealous at least at first. That is not necessarily a bad thing. In my tradition, some of our most revered saints were converts, such as St. Mary of Egypt, St. Panteleimon, St. Pelagia and St. Elizabeth the New Martyr.

For those who remain in the Orthodox Church, the initial flame is usually tempered to a slow, steady burn.

M.

Monica said:

In my tradition, some of our most revered saints were converts, such as St. Mary of Egypt, St. Panteleimon, St. Pelagia and St. Elizabeth the New Martyr.

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St. Panteleimon? I'm just reading a book some of my children have been reading. It's Philip Pullman's Dark Material's Trilogy. Fantastic. (I think I'm regressing a few years but...yes it's fantastic).

The central character has a sort of living soul (referred to as her "daemon") who is called Panteleimon!

That must be where the name comes from! I'll be looking it up tomorrow. Thanks.

ps Unless you want to tell me a little bit more.

pps I'd heard Philip Pullman was an atheist.

Here you go

OCA - Feasts and Saints: Life of Saint

I am a convert to Christianity. I was raised in a nonreligious home that was quite anti-religious. I came to Christianity because it seemed to logically describe many things about the human condition. I don't think I am very zealous because I think faith is a personal issue. I also don't think you have to acknowledge Jesus' existence to go to heaven. You can see the Son of God present in the world around you and call him by a different name and still go to heaven. I don't like evangelicals or fundamentalists that force conversion and are close-minded and place people in strict categories and boxes.

One good example of a convert springs to mind, a man of about 80 who goes to my church. He converted in his 20s. He is very "zealous" but not in a negative sense. He is full of such joy and compassion. He won't judge you or think less of you for being non-Christian (but he might pray for you privately). He truly lives as Jesus would want him to live, to the best of his ability. He is zealous, certainly, but not a fundamentalist. I don't think the two terms can be equated.

Monica said:

I think that converts tend to be more zealous at least at first. That is not necessarily a bad thing. In my tradition, some of our most revered saints were converts, such as St. Mary of Egypt, St. Panteleimon, St. Pelagia and St. Elizabeth the New Martyr.

For those who remain in the Orthodox Church, the initial flame is usually tempered to a slow, steady burn.

M.

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I agree, but this is not to say that many who are born in the faith aren't also zealous (in the good way).

leftrightleftrightleft said:

I am a convert to Christianity. I was raised in a nonreligious home that was quite anti-religious. I came to Christianity because it seemed to logically describe many things about the human condition. I don't think I am very zealous because I think faith is a personal issue. I also don't think you have to acknowledge Jesus' existence to go to heaven. You can see the Son of God present in the world around you and call him by a different name and still go to heaven. I don't like evangelicals or fundamentalists that force conversion and are close-minded and place people in strict categories and boxes.

One good example of a convert springs to mind, a man of about 80 who goes to my church. He converted in his 20s. He is very "zealous" but not in a negative sense. He is full of such joy and compassion. He won't judge you or think less of you for being non-Christian (but he might pray for you privately). He truly lives as Jesus would want him to live, to the best of his ability. He is zealous, certainly, but not a fundamentalist. I don't think the two terms can be equated.

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after w e have problemme in our familie, m y dad he go to non christian religiion. m y morfar he is christian and now he help me go back to be christian. m y morfar is like the guy you talk abaout but he is not 80 years. he is full with spirit and joy. he is good to people.

IN MY EXPERIENCE... clearly distinguishing it from any universal normative principle or anyone else's personal experience.....

I have seen many Christian males convert to Islam (in Muslim countries) so that they could marry a Muslim woman. In most of these cases, I suspected that their conversion was not altogether genuine, so their zeal was somewhat lacking. However, who am I to discern someone's heart? Thus, this is all based on appearances.

I have seen many youth leave the Roman Catholic Church (particularly in America). Whenever I inquire or whenever they share their thoughts, it seems that they feel the RCC is too rigid and too exclusive. Exclusivism is a difficult position to hold in a society that has so much cultural diffusion. When these youth joined their new religion, they seemed very much "on fire" and determined to represent their new faith strongly. However, in time much of this seems to wane...

Generally, the conversions that seem to provide the most lasting enthusiasm and diligence are from converts over the age of 30 who spend a longer time researching their options as opposed to being "overwhelmed" emotionally. I can think of several persons in this category that I know who always strike me as more devout than those who are "original" in that denomination.

seashale76 said:

I agree, but this is not to say that many who are born in the faith aren't also zealous (in the good way).

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Of course.

M.