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Beauty is determined by the Golden Ratio.
That has been around even before there was life.
If you look at the spiral you see the Golden Ratio.
Maybe I'd take you seriously if you found a research paper which shows that non-theists are indeed corrupt, or even more likely to be immoral people.Psalm 53:1 The fool has said in his heart, There is no God,
They are corrupt, and have committed abominable injustice;
There is no one who does good.
Sorry my friend if you resemble this saying so the saying you are.
Psalm 53:1 The fool has said in his heart, There is no God,
They are corrupt, and have committed abominable injustice;
There is no one who does good.
Sorry my friend if you resemble this saying so the saying you are.
Hi,
I'm an atheist and a genetic/microbiological scientist and because this is a Christian forum I've opened this thread so anyone who wishes to know more about Evolution or my beliefs or why I hold them can ask me questions accordingly.
I would however like a respectful debate, but feel free to counteract anything I say if you disagree. I will try my hardest to remain respectful. Thanks
OK people, ask away.
Chloroplasts, in algae and plants, and their descendents, the apicoplasts, in apicomplexans (e.g. malaria parasites).Apart from mitochondria, what organs of eucaryote cells have their own DNA and reproduce independently of the primary DNA in the nucleus?
Yes, there have been a number of studies. Mitochondria appear to be related to alphaproteobacteria; this paper attempts to trace their relationship more precisely.And, are there any studies, theories, or wild conjectures as to how mitochondria are related to prokaryotes. I.e. do we have any idea which lineage(s?) of bacteria or archaea became mitochondria, and what do the relatives of mitochondria look like?
Chloroplasts, in algae and plants, and their descendents, the apicoplasts, in apicomplexans (e.g. malaria parasites).
Yes, there have been a number of studies. Mitochondria appear to be related to alphaproteobacteria; this paper attempts to trace their relationship more precisely.
And, are there any studies, theories, or wild conjectures as to how mitochondria are related to prokaryotes. I.e. do we have any idea which lineage(s?) of bacteria or archaea became mitochondria, and what do the relatives of mitochondria look like?
Does kind of beg the question:Including the original paper recommended, and the google search, and some wikipedia, there's a lot of interesting information out there.
One thing I found particularly interesting is that there are living creatures that appear to show intermediate stages of gaining "endosymbiotic" cell organelles. E.g. Hatena arenicola, which is a single cell organism. Originally it's clear, and acts like a predator. But, if it ingests a cell of a certain type of algae, then the Hatena arenicola organism changes considerably, and becomes a plant with the consumed (but maintained) algae acting a bit like an organelle. The Hatena arenicola loses its feeding apparatus which changes to an eye-spot so that it can seek out light. When the photosynthetic Hatena arenicola divides, only one half gets the ingested algae, so the other half reverts to a carnivorous lifestyle until it ingests another algae cell.
Hatena arenicola were only discovered in the year 2000, and described in 2006 if I remember correctly. This shows how much new evidence for evolution is being found all the time.
Rickettsia themselves, being obligate intracellular parasites, also seem to be an intermediate form between a standalone bacteria and an organelle. That evidence suggests that they are closely related to mitochondria makes them even more interesting.
There are "intermediate" creatures now. E.g. flying squirrels which are part way between flying and non-flying, or mudskippers which are fish "leaving the water". I didn't know that there are organisms which are part way between complex eucaryote and procaryote.
IIRC Wolbachia (another one of those Rickettsiales!) treads that fine line like a tightrope walker. On the one hand, it behaves like an overgrown selfish gene, going around killing anything that can't pass it on. On the other hand...Does kind of beg the question:
As an organism becomes more dependant (in evolutionary time) on its host, to the point where it no longer even needs its own reproduction capabilities (it uses its host to reproduce) - how fine a line is it between symbiant and parasite?
Including the original paper recommended, and the google search, and some wikipedia, there's a lot of interesting information out there.One thing I found particularly interesting is that there are living creatures that appear to show intermediate stages of gaining "endosymbiotic" cell organelles. E.g. Hatena arenicola, which is a single cell organism. Originally it's clear, and acts like a predator. But, if it ingests a cell of a certain type of algae, then the Hatena arenicola organism changes considerably, and becomes a plant with the consumed (but maintained) algae acting a bit like an organelle. The Hatena arenicola loses its feeding apparatus which changes to an eye-spot so that it can seek out light. When the photosynthetic Hatena arenicola divides, only one half gets the ingested algae, so the other half reverts to a carnivorous lifestyle until it ingests another algae cell. Hatena arenicola were only discovered in the year 2000, and described in 2006 if I remember correctly. This shows how much new evidence for evolution is being found all the time. Rickettsia themselves, being obligate intracellular parasites, also seem to be an intermediate form between a standalone bacteria and an organelle. That evidence suggests that they are closely related to mitochondria makes them even more interesting.
There are "intermediate" creatures now. E.g. flying squirrels which are part way between flying and non-flying, or mudskippers which are fish "leaving the water". I didn't know that there are organisms which are part way between complex eucaryote and procaryote.
No, they wouldn't (although people are born that are arguably that deformed facially, albeit in different ways). What you have there is a straw man, not reductio ad absurdum.
Your assertion would be true if genetics was a massive lottery, as each possible gene or chromosome comes up on the middle line and you end up with your winning number, with equal chance for any gene to come up any way.
It's just not, that's a colossal misunderstanding. I can say with certainty now, you do NOT understand this yet (but you're clearly intelligent so there is hope!).
The colossal majority of genetic information is passed from the parents, with the occasional variation. These variations aren't things like "this person will look like a deformed monster X" or "this person will be 27 feet tall", they are small individual variations, for example, eye color. If it was a completely unfixed and random lottery where X and Y didn't matter, yes, someone could have a child that looked like your monster thing above, but then the issue would be that it would NOT survive long because major genetic abnormalities often come with a greater susceptibility to disease.
Ironically your picture of the faces quite a good demonstration against your own point. The differences in these people show the kind of small, random mutations that occur in our species quite nicely, although because these people aren't closely related it's a limited demonstration that could be better done in other ways. There's no guidance by an unseen master going on here. If there was, he's playing a pretty sadistic joke by throwing genetic conditions like Downs Syndrome deliberately into the mix, no?
God has created Creatures that have the ability to adapt to terrible environmental and climate changes. Very quickly.
Isn't it wonderful that we have the theory of evolution to describe this process?
There are "intermediate" creatures now. E.g. flying squirrels which are part way between flying and non-flying, or mudskippers which are fish "leaving the water".
I hate to point out the obvious, but Down's syndrome is not a mutation.Perfectly stated. No. The guidance is programmed in as normal variation and Downs Syndrome is a mutation that works to destroy the process. Yes, Down Syndrome is a fault that we have to deal with. Its not part of the original plan.
See, if you met a little toothed, clawed, gliding featherball at the point when little toothed-clawed gliders were the the latest and greatest in the evolution of dinosaur flight, you could make the exact same argument about it. Organisms are only intermediate in hindsight, when you know what sort of creatures they evolved into.Neither of those are considered intermediate creatures. They are simply animals that have characteristics that other creatures have.
Do you use rosary beads as you chant this topic over and over?
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