Amazing new life form

[gluadys]

NASA recently announced discovery of a new life form that builds its DNA differently from all other life--using arsenic instead of phosphorus.

Discovery of "Arsenic-bug" Expands Definition of Life - NASA Science

 

[juvenissun]

NASA recently announced discovery of a new life form that builds its DNA differently from all other life--using arsenic instead of phosphorus.

Discovery of "Arsenic-bug" Expands Definition of Life - NASA Science

As-rich sedimentary environment is not new on the earth. I only wonder why would this discovery be a surprise. I would not be surprised even a bacteria with Al or Au in its DNA be discovered somewhere in the universe.

The Dead Sea in Israel has a similar environment to the Mono Lake (brine + volcanic). May be someone should try to find such bacteria there too. Would someone suggest this "new" bacteria evolved from bacterial of normal DNA? Is it possible for DNA to evolve?

Is it possible to have a DNA built by both P and As in various ratio?

 

[Mallon]

Surely this is evidence for a second designer! No one would expect a single, common designer to create such disparate forms of life.

 

[miamited]

Hi Glaudys,

I watched the information about this 'new' find, but to be honest I can't find any reason why it would give us any different information about life and its possibility in another planetary environment. The only new 'fact' that we have is that we have found an apparently rare life form, seeing as no one else had discovered it before, that is able to use arsenic as a building block. While I'm not any kind of scientist, I listened to one on the news say that this means we might look for life in places other than where we have looked before. OK, no problem, but from what I have seen, as regards life on another planet, the person was talking about being able to look for life where there are not the generally accepted building blocks of life as we know them here. Fine! Keep looking, but the discovery doesn't mean that we 'will' find life if we find other such conditions, just that we maybe should expand our parameters regarding where to look.

Personally, knowing God's purpose as revealed by His Spirit and through His word, I am pretty confident that we won't ever find 'life' anywhere but earth. However, I am fully aware that that's not a generally accepted truth even among fellow believers.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted.

 

[matthewgar]

Surely this is evidence for a second designer! No one would expect a single, common designer to create such disparate forms of life.

Except this isn't a second abiogenesis, it's part of our root system but is able to use arsenic on it's own, so not totally brand new,the excitement is that it shows arsenic while hypothesized before was never proven toi be a substitute viably for phospherous.

 

[juvenissun]

Except this isn't a second abiogenesis, it's part of our root system but is able to use arsenic on it's own, so not totally brand new,the excitement is that it shows arsenic while hypothesized before was never proven toi be a substitute viably for phospherous.

Has anybody tried to prove it?

 

[gluadys]

As-rich sedimentary environment is not new on the earth. I only wonder why would this discovery be a surprise. I would not be surprised even a bacteria with Al or Au in its DNA be discovered somewhere in the universe.

Indeed, discoveries like this should be a dime a dozen if species were separately created and not surprising at all.

The wonder here is that since species are related and arsenic is toxic to almost every species, that we should find even one that has adapted to use it this way.

The Dead Sea in Israel has a similar environment to the Mono Lake (brine + volcanic). May be someone should try to find such bacteria there too. Would someone suggest this "new" bacteria evolved from bacterial of normal DNA?

Not a bad idea. There will certainly be incentive to look for similar species elsewhere.

Is it possible for DNA to evolve?

Is it possible to have a DNA built by both P and As in various ratio?

I think the answer to the first question is "yes". I think the answer to the second is probably "no". But don't hold me to either one as definitive.

 

[juvenissun]

Indeed, discoveries like this should be a dime a dozen if species were separately created and not surprising at all.

The wonder here is that since species are related and arsenic is toxic to almost every species, that we should find even one that has adapted to use it this way.

I think the answer to the first question is "yes". I think the answer to the second is probably "no". But don't hold me to either one as definitive.

OK, it is just a chatting.

If DNA evolved, then why not some DNA with mixed P and As existed as transitionals? If not, how did P get switched to As all of a sudden? The fact that As-DNA only appeared in the rare As-enriched modern environment almost guaranteed an evolutional origin.

If bacteria with As-DNA could be evolved within a few hundred thousands of years, there is certainly a possibility to see the process in a lab environment.

 

[Mallon]

If DNA evolved, then why not some DNA with mixed P and As existed as transitionals?

That's pretty much what we're seeing here. These bacteria have the ability to incorporate either P or As in their DNA.

 

[matthewgar]

As-rich sedimentary environment is not new on the earth. I only wonder why would this discovery be a surprise. I would not be surprised even a bacteria with Al or Au in its DNA be discovered somewhere in the universe.

The Dead Sea in Israel has a similar environment to the Mono Lake (brine + volcanic). May be someone should try to find such bacteria there too. Would someone suggest this "new" bacteria evolved from bacterial of normal DNA? Is it possible for DNA to evolve?

Is it possible to have a DNA built by both P and As in various ratio?

These do it, as mentioned there is still some phospherous left in the bacteria, but notenough to acomidate for all needed phospherous in the cell. So there is some in there, and it's not yet perfect, some die off due to aresenic not being perfect, but they have found a way to use it.

 

[juvenissun]

That's pretty much what we're seeing here. These bacteria have the ability to incorporate either P or As in their DNA.

I would suggest people to treat bacteria with high dose of Sb to see what would happen.

 

[shernren]

As usual xkcd covered the event brilliantly:

 

[Greg1234]

These do it, as mentioned there is still some phospherous left in the bacteria, but notenough to acomidate for all needed phospherous in the cell.

I think there is enough. In fact, some are even criticizing the scientific caliber of research conducted in determining this ratio.

A recent high-profile astrobiology discovery led by a NASA scientist is being called into question by a B.C. microbiologist, who says the science was sloppy.
"I don't know whether the authors are just bad scientists or whether they're unscrupulously pushing NASA's 'There's life in outer space!' agenda," wrote University of British Columbia Prof. Rosie Redfield on her blog about the study, which was published Dec. 2 in Science.
​

Read more: CBC News - Technology & Science - NASA's arsenic microbe science slammed​

 

[philadiddle]

As far as I understand they created it in a lab. There's a lot of criticism but I'll wait with baited breath while the peer review process runs its course.

 

[AnswersInHovind]

As far as I understand they created it in a lab. There's a lot of criticism but I'll wait with baited breath while the peer review process runs its course.

they made it in a lab?

"Hey guys! We intelligently designed a new life form! This helps prove evolution!"

 

[Dark_Lite]

they made it in a lab?

"Hey guys! We intelligently designed a new life form! This helps prove evolution!"

They took it from the lake and introduced it into a high-arsenic environment. They did not "create" it.

 

[AnswersInHovind]

They took it from the lake and introduced it into a high-arsenic environment. They did not "create" it.

They intentionally altered the conditions in an intelligent and intentional way with the desire of a specific result. Create doesn't have to be out of nothing or from scratch, you can reform exiting materials and that is creation.

 

[Dark_Lite]

They intentionally altered the conditions in an intelligent and intentional way with the desire of a specific result. Create doesn't have to be out of nothing or from scratch, you can reform exiting materials and that is creation.

They didn't reform existing materials. They took bacteria from one place, and put it in another place. If I move a dog from my house to another person's house, have I created a new form of life? No. Please do not attempt to stretch the definition of "intelligent design" to cover this. It doesn't work.

 

[ivebeenshown]

They intentionally altered the conditions in an intelligent and intentional way with the desire of a specific result. Create doesn't have to be out of nothing or from scratch, you can reform exiting materials and that is creation.

Creation has become synonymous with formation, but true creation is an adversary to the laws of thermodynamics. Only God can truly create anything.

 

[Mallon]

They intentionally altered the conditions in an intelligent and intentional way with the desire of a specific result. Create doesn't have to be out of nothing or from scratch, you can reform exiting materials and that is creation.

That might be the first time I've heard a creationist say that.

Still, the bacteria we're talking about aren't new. They weren't evolved in a lab. They were simply grown on a different medium.