Agreement

[James_Lai]

Hello.
People are very different. Brain scientists say that there can be up to 1:40 variation in volume and complexity of our cortex. There are people who have structures in certain zones of the cortex that many other people don’t have at all. It’s an invisible difference that if translated into height, would be like people 5ft vs 200ft tall. Or people with additional eyes at the back of their heads, or people who are able to hear ultrasound or see in UV range of the radiation spectrum.

Of course, we have also difference in the environment in which people develop and live which affects how they think.

So it seems there can never be full understanding between people, as some people are physically incapable to grasp certain ideas or look at things in a certain way? Or when environment preconditions them to have a certain mindset.

How do you see Christianity overcoming this obstacle, if it does attempt to do so?

You can try and explain an idea in very simple and generic terms in hopes most if not all people would get it. Then you run a risk to reduce it more than necessary. Or if you make it sound too complex, then you risk some people missing it altogether. You can create certain emphasis and risk the teaching lose the intended salt. You can overdo symbolism so that the symbols take off with their own “independent life”. Etc.

How do you tweak or present a religion so that it’s most universal, but at the same time remains true and effective for its purposes?

Seems like virtually impossible task, similar to what the public education system is trying to achieve by providing a standard curriculum and same pedagogical methodologies to all kids… (ends up favouring a minority who are most suitable for it, e.g. girls, extraverts or auditory learners)….

 

[Clare73]

Hello.
People are very different. Brain scientists say that there can be up to 1:40 variation in volume and complexity of our cortex. There are people who have structures in certain zones of the cortex that many other people don’t have at all. It’s an invisible difference that if translated into height, would be like people 5ft vs 200ft tall. Or people with additional eyes at the back of their heads, or people who are able to hear ultrasound or see in UV range of the radiation spectrum.
Of course, we have also difference in the environment in which people develop and live which

affects how they think.
So it seems there can never be understanding between people, as some people are physically incapable to grasp certain ideas or look at things in a certain way? Or when environment preconditions them to have a certain mindset.
How do you see Christianity overcoming this obstacle, if it does attempt to do so?
You can try and explain an idea in very simple and generic terms in hopes most if not all people would get it. Then you run a risk to reduce it more than necessary. Or if you make it sound too complex, then you risk some people missing it altogether. You can create certain emphasis and risk the teaching lose the intended salt. You can overdo symbolism so that the symbols take off with their own “independent life”. Etc.

How do you tweak or present a religion so that it’s most universal, but at the same time remains true and effective for its purposes?

Seems like virtually impossible task, similar to what the public education system is trying to achieve by providing a standard curriculum and same pedagogical methodologies to all kids… (ends up favouring a minority who are most suitable for it, e.g. girls, extraverts or auditory learners)….

Christian doctrine and Christian religion do not.

Your proposition assumes it is all up to the capabilities of the human mind. . .and leaves out the human spirit being reborn from spiritual death into the divine eternal life of and by the Holy Spirit, who personally enables all that occurs in his spiritual realm.

 

[James_Lai]

Christian doctrine and Christian religion do not.

Your proposition assumes it is all up to the capabilities of the human mind. . .and leaves out the human spirit being reborn from spiritual death into the divine eternal life of and by the Holy Spirit, who personally enables all that occurs in his spiritual realm.

The mystical still uses the physical as a vehicle… Buddha talked about it in his Lotus Sutra in the Pali canon in the parable of the Yanas and kids in a burning house. I’m not from the West and I can see that to some people if you try and translate what you said above to their dialect (if they do have appropriate vocabulary), then you need a separate book to try and explain it to them, and maybe a whole course to begin understanding that book…

Transmission of ideas, and proper understanding of ideas is genuinely a challenging task. Take schools for example or even something seemingly simple as product marketing… It’s not that straight forward. It’s very common in Chinese papers big name Western corporations apologize for some marketing blunders… What works in one place, can send a very different message elsewhere…

Or if we take some people who don’t steal or aren’t violent because of moral reasoning, others only because they’re scared of punishment…

 

[Clare73]

The mystical still uses the physical as a vehicle… Buddha talked about it in his Lotus Sutra in the Pali canon in the parable of the Yanas and kids in a burning house. I’m not from the West and I can see that to some people if you try and translate what you said above to their dialect (if they do have appropriate vocabulary), then you need a separate book to try and explain it to them, and maybe a whole course to begin understanding that book…

Transmission of ideas, and proper understanding of ideas is genuinely a challenging task. Take schools for example or even something seemingly simple as product marketing… It’s not that straight forward. It’s very common in Chinese papers big name Western corporations apologize for some marketing blunders… What works in one place, can send a very different message elsewhere…

Or if we take some people who don’t steal or aren’t violent because of moral reasoning, others only because they’re scared of punishment…

Not getting how does this relates to my response in post #2.

 

[James_Lai]

Not getting how does this relates to my response in post #2.

Before the Holy Spirit does His work in the soul of the believer, there are still some wteps to be done prior to that. As the Bible says, “How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?” There’s a process.

I bring my friends to church and they listen to songs, hear the preaching. They have atheist background. It takes months if not years for them to truly grasp even the fundamentals.

Or you take even Canadians who were moderately churched in early age, but are secular. They hear a preaching or read the Bible or read a tract or see a Christian Youtube or TikTok… What is their take away for real? If you interview them afterwards, each one will have their own ideas…

That’s my point.

 

[Clare73]

Before the Holy Spirit does His work in the soul of the believer, there are still some wteps to be done prior to that. As the Bible says, “How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?” There’s a process.

I bring my friends to church and they listen to songs, hear the preaching. They have atheist background. It takes months if not years for them to truly grasp even the fundamentals.

Or you take even Canadians who were moderately churched in early age, but are secular. They hear a preaching or read the Bible or read a tract or see a Christian Youtube or TikTok… What is their take away for real? If you interview them afterwards, each ine will have their own ideas

Nothing happens until the Holy Spirit does his work, which includes the steps of hearing and preaching.

Hearing and preaching avail nothing if the Holy Spirit is not at work in them.
They probably won't understand most, if any, of it.

 

[James_Lai]

Nothing happens until the Holy Spirit does his work.

I understand, but it’s a different subject. Apostle Paul recognized the need to adjust the preaching style and contents to the audience.

“And unto the Jews I became a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; 21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law”. (1 Cor 9)

We live in a physical world. Is doesn’t help to spiritualize everything. We aren’t ephemeral ghosts floating in the ether. We are physico-chemical machines and brain is where the mind and emotions are.

How and at what level the spiritual plane is involved, that’s a separate (and hugely interesting) discussion.

 

[Clare73]

I understand, but it’s a different subject. Apostle Paul recognized the need to adjust the preaching style and contents to the audience.

“And unto the Jews I became a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; 21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law”. (1 Cor 9)

We live in a physical world. Is doesn’t help to spiritualize everything. We aren’t ephemeral ghosts floating in the ether. We are physico-chemical machines and brain is where the mind and emotions are.

How and at what level the spiritual plane is involved, that’s a separate (and hugely interesting) discussion.

Precisely. . .we talk to everyone in terms they can understand and to which they can relate, from children to professionals to the compromised.